Episode 436: Reacting To The Mariners Losing The Series To The Dodgers + Mailbag

00:00:00 Speaker 1: Welcome to episode number four thirty six of the Marine Layer Podcast. It's a mailbag episode, so we'll open it up and answer your best listener questions. Will also react to the Mariners losing two of three to the Dodgers. 00:00:11 Speaker 2: Reminder to you guys, just before we start this episode, make sure to go download these podcasts if you're listening, and please go rate and review five stars on the audio platforms, go hit subscribe if you're watching on YouTube. You can also check us out on our website marine layerpod dot com, where you can find episodes are all there too, patreons there. All of our podcast merch is there. Go get yourself some merch. That's marine layerpod dot com, and then check us out across social media. We're everywhere. We're posting content every day at marine Layer Pod. 00:00:41 Speaker 1: Let's get it rolling and we welcome you to this episode of the Marine Layer Podcast, part of the Just Baseball podcast Network, recording here on Thursday evening, July thirtieth. While the season's over. 00:01:08 Speaker 2: We're way overdue for one. And honestly, I don't like your delivery on that. That was pretty blam. That was flat. I thought you were gonna bring it in and say, like recording here on Thursday evening, July thirtieth, and the season's over. 00:01:22 Speaker 1: I was just blunting to the point, do the people need me to dress up the fact that the Mariners season does in fact seem trending towards over. 00:01:31 Speaker 2: I mean like, I don't know what we have to keep continuing to say. I don't know what we can keep continuing to say until something changes. I think that's the over overarching storyline here is they have got to shake something up. Man. Through four months, it is clear as day that this is not working. None of it is working. Brian Wu is uncompetitive in every road start, offense is bad, Cal's still not hitting, Naylor's still not hitting. Julio had hit his hot streak and he's still hovering around a barely above league average hitter. Like, I don't know what we have to keep saying, Like. 00:02:08 Speaker 1: The last wrote, sorry, no Eten finished well, And I. 00:02:11 Speaker 2: Was just gonna say, And obviously that Dodger series was as about as predictable as you can get. Credit to them for winning the one game, but I've said it a couple times now. This week they had to play their one hundredth percentile outcome game as an offense to win by ninety feet in one game against the best team in baseball, in a game that almost was blown, and again in a game that the Dodgers very easily could have won. It took the absolute maximum effort out of the Mariners offense to win that game, and then the next two they were uncompetitive, so pretty predictable. 00:02:46 Speaker 1: Adam Jude wrote a great story postgame here on Thursday and highlighted it in his lead that the Mariners were eight outs away from playing this Dodgers team in that stadium. And to think of how much has changed in eight months between these two franch is that were eight outs for matching up in the World Series, and then watching what we watched this week, just two different leagues of baseball. Team Like we said this going into the series, and we'll say it again. The Dodger said Kyle Tucker batting seventh and taoscar Hernandez batting eighth, that that's just a different league of baseball roster. The Mariners, on the other side, had those two spots reserved for Rob Refsnyder, Slash, Luke Rayley and Weston Wilson. Massive difference TA Oscar Hernandez hit clean up for the Mariners. 00:03:41 Speaker 2: Are we in the trust tree here? We usually are gonna I'm gonna get vulnerable for a second here on the pod. I'm mad enough to admit this to our fans. I was rooting for Kyle Tucker to homer against the Mariners in this series. It didn't happen, but I was rooting for it. 00:03:57 Speaker 1: But as our Dodger friends call him, Kyle Sucker didn't really do that much. 00:04:01 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, Dodger fans have not been fans of my guy through the first year of the contract. It has been a tough go. I would still take it on the Mariners in a heartbeat. 00:04:10 Speaker 1: But oh, it's just what the Mariner's kneed. Dog another underperforming left handed hitter making too much money. 00:04:17 Speaker 2: I want them, I still want them. Okay. I was rooting for him to homer against the Mariners anyway, Yes, that is what I said on Tuesday night, even when the Mariners won. And look, I get it. We never tell people how to fan. We say that all the time. People were excited and they were fired up after the Mariners beat the Dodgers on Tuesday, and they were calling it the win of the year, and maybe it was, and they were obviously hoping it was gonna spark something. I'm sitting there and saying, my biggest takeaway from that game is, look at how much effort it took the Mariners to win that one game and doing so barely, like by the skin of their teeth. These two teams are not even in the same stratosphere in terms of talent. They like, they don't even line up, they don't compare. So for the two teams that had the highest World Series odds in Baseball going into the season, it's just night and day. Man, that wasn't the Dodgers' best game of the year. That wasn't even the best Dodgers team you could put out there. They didn't have Will Smith, the Mariners didn't have to face Yamamoto in this series. Blake Snell and Tyler Glass now are still hurt, and the Mariners just barely hung on to win that game on Tuesday, and then Wednesday and Thursday they're uncompetitive and even without show Hey on Thursday, they basically got run out of the building. It's just not even the same stratosphere of talent. 00:05:33 Speaker 1: And what we said after the two wins on this Mariners road chap where we wanted to see something else after that, to show that it's not a total one off, And the Mariners just proved us right so much that right after they had these huge swings, which when I say they had these huge swings, dom Kinzone won the Mariners two games on this road trip. Dom Canzone's the reason the Mariners aren't heading back to Seattle in a true five alarm fun as bad as you think it is, if they had gotten swept in Texas and swept in Los Angeles, there would be like a like a five legit five alarm fire heading back to Seattle. Right now, dom Canzone made sure that didn't really happen. We wanted to see after those games. Okay, can you show like something right after this, like make this translate from one game to the next. And the Mariners in each of the two games following those wins put out the most lifeless offensive performances you could possibly think of, and then they end up losing those games, and they end up losing five of the seven games on this road trip. You also mention this in your reaction to the Mariners are no longer flip flopping series. They're just straight up now losing a bunch of series. Five out of the last six series they've lost. 00:06:48 Speaker 2: It's not competitive. It's no longer the conversation of just hovering around five hundred of win the series, lose the next win a series, lose the next. Maybe they win two series and they lose two series. No, they've lost the series two, the Marlins, the Rays, they beat the Giants barely, barely, thank you, Cole Young, lost to the Reds, lost to the Rangers. Now lost to the Dodgers, and you know what's coming in August in terms of their schedule. How in the world do they dig themselves out of. 00:07:19 Speaker 1: This drastic change? But is that drastic change gonna come? I don't know as of right now, I don't think so. There's no trade that's gonna make a drastic change. Like the drastic change is either gonna come via subtraction from something on the major league roster, something in this organization, or it's gonna be drastic change with the players turning it around. But neither of those things have been given any indication that that's actually gonna happen. So I don't know, an I have no clue. Here's a fun fact. Do you want to guess the last road series the Mariners want person perspective? 00:08:02 Speaker 2: Okay, I can do this. The last road series the Mariners won. I mean, they obviously lost the two series in Florida. They've lost the two series on this road trip. I'm going all the way back to the start of the month. They beat the Blue Jays in a series that was at home. Before that, they were where Anaheim maybe. 00:08:20 Speaker 1: No way farther back. 00:08:22 Speaker 2: Oh my god, Okay, why don't you just tell me. 00:08:27 Speaker 1: That A's series that started the eight game win streak was the last road series they won. No, no, it was no, yeah, that's that was the last one. They swept the Ace the first three wins of an eight game win streak. That was the last time they beat a team in a series on the road. They have one split in that stretch. Besides that, they've lost every single series. 00:08:50 Speaker 2: That just can't be real. I mean, brother, that was like mid to late May. 00:08:54 Speaker 1: That was two months ago, over two months ago. 00:08:56 Speaker 2: Now, good lord, I'm looking at it right now. I mean, you're a right, yeah. How is that possible? 00:09:04 Speaker 1: Because the Mariners over that two month stretch have the worst offense in baseball, and this rotation is pitched significantly worse on the road. 00:09:14 Speaker 2: Oh oh wait, No, I was about to say you were wrong. No, I was gonna say they won the Oriole Series. No, they split it, You're right, split it. 00:09:21 Speaker 1: Nope. 00:09:22 Speaker 2: Anyways, keep going, they had a chance to win that series. No, keep going, nope. 00:09:27 Speaker 1: Yeah, and the rotation has been terrible on the road. It's not even bad they've been They've been terrible on the road. 00:09:33 Speaker 2: Yeah. Oh man, And we should be sitting here four days ahead of the trade deadline just talking about how do you take this team over the top, how do you go from good to great? How do you make yourselves even more of a World Series contender? Instead? Right now, I don't have any clue what they're gonna do. And that's not just the market being bad, but it's how much does this team truly go off? I know Adam Jude on Wednesday with Us said they're gonna try to be all in. And if you haven't listened to Wednesday's episode with Adam you should. It's a really good episode and he provides some great insight as always. But I don't know, man, I just can't sit here and see them being ultra aggressive at the deadline for a team that's just not showing you much life. 00:10:21 Speaker 1: Lucky for them, though, there's not really gonna be the opportunity to be ultra aggressive. Who who qualifies on this deadline of being as being ultra aggressive? 00:10:33 Speaker 2: I mean, there's one guy, and he's about to be a Dodger. It's Trek Schoole, Arrek Schooble. 00:10:37 Speaker 1: The only team that's gonna trade the packet, that kind of package for Terrek School is gonna be the Dodgers because everyone else knows they can't re sign him, but the Dodgers do so they're like, all right, we'll give you good prospects for him, sure, right. The other team, the Rays and the Brewers, like sorry, man, like, we can't mortgage our future for someone who's gonna be here two months. And it would be the same thing with the Mariners. They wouldn't. 00:10:59 Speaker 2: They wouldn't, right, No, I mean, is there anything else to even say from this series? It's just the same old story other than that. 00:11:08 Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, there is. There's something that gets brought to light at the end of today, where like this is such a damning stat of like where the Mariners are this season. It kind of makes sense why the Mariners are in this spot. There's clearly a number of factors. But entering this season, I mean there's a cal Rawley was clearly the best player on the Mariners and Brian Wu was the Mariner's best pitcher. This year, Brian was now fifty seventh out of sixty two qualified starting pitchers in e RA. Do I need to say that again? Fifty seventh out of sixty two. Cal Rawley by WRC plus is currently one hundred and seventy third out of one hundred and seventy six among players with three hundred played appearances by WRC plus. So your best pitch sure is fifty seventh out of sixty two. Your best hitter is one hundred and seventy third out of one hundred and seventy six. How is it possible to do anything? It's not? 00:12:11 Speaker 2: Again, what have I said or what have we said for weeks? Now? If Cal doesn't turn this around, they're not going to the playoffs. Now, I mean this hinges on him and Julio and Naylor, but certainly Cal and if he doesn't turn it around, they're just not going anywhere. By the way, this is I should just say shout out to our friend Jage for tweeting that out and because that's him that dug that out, So I just wanted to make sure like we say shout out to him for that. 00:12:35 Speaker 1: Yeah, I just want to say this. I think We've reached the point of the season where I'm just waiting for the Mariners to prove us wrong, because the collective sentiment around the fan bases is that this team is going to miss the playoffs now, and this team is going to go down as one of the most disappointing, if not the most disappointing team in Mariners franchise history. I would really really love for them to prove us wrong because we just unfortunately have no evidence right now to suggest otherwise. You could. You could come to me and say, TJ, like sometimes baseball happens, you just turn it around. That's totally right, But there's just no evidence that that's gonna happen right now. Given the performance we've seen from the Mariners. There's no there's little evidence this season that Brian wu is gonna drastically turn it around on the road enough to be not like the worst pitcher in baseball on the road. There's unfortunately not much evidence this season that cal Rally's gonna go from being one of the worst hitters in baseball to one of the best hitters in baseball. Again, there's no evidence that Dan Wilson's decision making is going to improve and help this team actively win games. 00:13:47 Speaker 2: Now what am I missing here? 00:13:48 Speaker 1: I'm just like, at some point, I just I wish they would prove us wrong in some aspect, and I just cannot find a way that they're actually gonna do that. And it is really frustrating that we have all this hype as Mariners fans. We finally we finally get a Game seven of the ALCS. We go into this next season, we have the second best World Series odds, everything's lined up, you bring back Naylor, you have a sixty home run catcher. Everything is supposed to be right, and then they just shit on it. 00:14:19 Speaker 3: Man. 00:14:20 Speaker 2: It's I mean, dude, it makes you rip your hair out. By the way, speaking of Dan Wilson, we'll weave it into the mailbag questions because I think it fits in with one or two of them. Jeff Passen did not hold back when he was talking about Dan Wilson this week when he was on with Brocken Salk. I have a little bit of the audio. I'll play a little small bit of it when it gets weaved into the mailbag. But it's just again, same old stories. Man, talk about Dan all the time, We talk about the offense all the time, We talk about the lack of consistency with runners in scoring position all the time. I mean, against the issues against lefties all the time. I guess credit to them for adding to Robleski a bit, who who was an All Star this year on Tuesday. Then they turn around against Eric Lawer and do nothing. They have one hit against Eric Lawer. 00:15:10 Speaker 1: Mm hmm. 00:15:11 Speaker 2: Yeah. 00:15:12 Speaker 1: Just prove us wrong, man, because otherwise people have their mindset, the fan base has their mindset that you're going to miss the playoffs. Yeah, and you're gonna be disappointing across the board, correct, Like that's that's that's just how it is right now. And I'm I'm really frustrated. I'm really frustrated watching this team. And man, like we said at the beginning of this road trip, it's like, can you please, can you please? Just knowing where you are that you've lost first place, you understand what's in front of you. Just show something, right, just show something, And they couldn't even do that. It just went exactly how we expect it. The only difference is they they won two games. They went two and five on the road trip instead of going oh and seven, big whoop. 00:15:59 Speaker 2: Yeah, that terrible road trip. It was an awful road trip. Just because they won two games doesn't make it any some sort of salvageable road trip. It wasn't. And by the way, before we get to the mailbag, let me get out of this. Let me get out ahead of this. 00:16:13 Speaker 1: Now. 00:16:14 Speaker 2: The Twins and the Tigers are no world beaters of baseball teams. They've been borderline better than the Mariners. The Twins have been by record, but neither of these teams are world beaters. So let me get out ahead of this in advance and say this. If the Mariners go four and two in their next six games, I am buying it. Like I am buying it. It'll be a start. And I'm not very convinced they're going to go four and two in their next six games. But going and beating those two teams, now, not with everything you got coming up on your schedule, you got to go prove something against the teams that actually have playoff aspirations and like world series aspirations to get me to say, oh, yeah, this team's really figured something out, winning series at home against the Twins and the Times ain't gonna cut it for me. 00:17:02 Speaker 1: I'll take it. It's a start, But then we're gonna need six more of those. 00:17:08 Speaker 2: Yeah again, Rays, Astros, Yankees, Brewers, Phillies, Cubs like you have all those teams in August. So let me say that again. I agree with you that it is a start if they go four and two, and again I'm not really convinced they will, but if they do, it is a mere start. It is not a spark plug. It is not a jump start like it is a mer like. Okay, now the engine's been very slightly repped up. What are you gonna do against all the actual good teams? 00:17:41 Speaker 1: Let me throw this note out here before we get into the mailbag. A lot of really good mailbag questions highlighting what will be on Monday. So here's the recording schedule for this weekend. We are not gonna have an episode out Monday morning, unless, of course, there's a trade Sunday night in which case there will be an episode out Monday morning. Law and I are gonna wait to lease our Monday podcast until the afternoon after the deadline, So we'll tape as soon as the deadline is over and to give our reaction, and then we'll put it out right after that. So just if you're driving to work on Monday and you don't see a podcast, we're still here. We st are still doing the podcast, but it just won't be that morning. It will still be after the deadline. But if there's a big trade for the Mariners, we're gonna be right here and taping just for you. 00:18:24 Speaker 2: Yeah, we'll put out a reminder on social media on Sunday too about it. But the thought process is there's just not much of a point for us to put out an episode Monday morning when Monday's obviously and often the biggest day of the trade deadline with trades going left and right, when the Mariners could make more moves. So I think the easiest thing to do is, as TJ said, unless there is a very very marquee trade, the easiest thing to do here is just record when it's all over, put it out late Monday afternoon or Monday evening for you guys, and that will be the Monday episode, just a few hours delayed so we can cap everything. 00:19:01 Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, we got a great mailbag to get to. But before that, let's pause here for an ad. 00:19:07 Speaker 2: Let's compare two players. They're making similar contracts, but you have to pick one guy to be in your lineup. 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Christian starts us off on Patreon and he asks, do both of you guys feel like as of now, can Zone deserves a spot in the lineup every single day lefties or righty's? 00:21:05 Speaker 2: Absolutely, yes. I don't even think this is a question. I know it's still a somewhat small sample for cam Zone against lefties, but in that sample he is now opsing ten sixty against left handed pitching. He's got four bombs. He is absolutely mashing. You saw it against the Dodgers here and on Tuesday, you saw it in Texas. You've seen it over the weeks. Now, yes, absolutely, he should be in there every day. 00:21:31 Speaker 1: I mean, he's not only the best hitter in his forty something played appearances against lefties on this Mariners roster. Against lefties by far, he has a one ninety eight WORC plus and first on this roster Julio's the next best at one thirty nine. That's a fifty nine point gap between first and second against lefties. You know how we all think like Randy Roserain is the guy who's like he stays in the lineup every day, he's gonna hit lefties. Yeah, Yeah, can Zone by WORC plus is ninety eight points in front of Randy this year agains. 00:22:05 Speaker 2: Celebrities ninety eight percent. That's crazy. Now ninety eight percent ahead of Randy. 00:22:09 Speaker 1: He's almost twice as good as Randy rose Rain against lefties this year. 00:22:12 Speaker 2: Yeah, small sample, but he's crushing it. Man. Yes, I don't even think this is much of a question that he's got to be in there every day at this point. 00:22:20 Speaker 1: I mean again, her will answer this again later in this mail bag because someone asked us this. But can Zone is inking himself a permanent spawn in this Mariners lineup in the future, like going forward, this is your DH He's going to be in there every single day, I think, yeah, going forward. 00:22:38 Speaker 2: I mean unless this doesn't sustain for whatever reason and come next year something changes and drops off, or in two years something drops off. Yes, absolutely, he'll be in there every day. 00:22:49 Speaker 1: But I mean, going into this season, the thought was, all right, I mean, dom Canzone crushes righty fastballs, is going to be able to evolve from that and hit lefties and righty's and hit break pitches and walk a little bit more. And he's done literally all of that. Yeah, and he's become the best hitter on this team. 00:23:07 Speaker 2: Greed. 00:23:09 Speaker 1: Josh's next on the mail bag. Josh's question is, if Dan gets fired, do you think Jerry and Justin should go with him? 00:23:17 Speaker 2: No, because I think they ended up buying themselves some time with what happened last year and getting all the way to Game seven of the ALCS and everything they've done with the farm. Look, no front office is perfect. They are certainly not perfect. They have mightily, mightily struggled for a decade to put together a quality big league offense and it's still very clearly a problem this year. But between their ability to develop big league pitching and their ability to develop a really good farm system and again getting all the way to the seventh game of the ALCS last year, I don't think they end up going with them. Now you can get into who's decision it was to hire Dan in the first place, and maybe we'll get into that here in a minute, but just their overall resume, I don't see them totally cleaning house. 00:24:09 Speaker 1: It would make some fans feel better if if that happened. I think some fans at this point want a fresh start, and I get the idea, But if you just like itemize it, like what Jerry and Justin's job is and how well they do at it. It's kind of hard to poke holes. Besides the fact they don't have a World Series title, a lot of the other processes are pretty good sans hiring a manager, uh, developing pictures. I mean, they're organizationally pretty great at that young hitters. They've done a decent job they now have. They have Julio and Center, they have col behind the plate. Both of those guys have been extended. Colt said short. I mean, I guess the book's still out on him, but Signs are promising very highly rated prospect and they handed him one hundred million dollars. That means they must be pretty confident in him. Cole Young, it's pretty good, right, dom can zone. We can now put him in that bucket of a young hitter. They've molded into a solid everyday player, if not better than solid, So that checks off. I mean, oh, you could put JB. Crawford in there too, maybe not always with the bat, but he has definitely brought value to this team with his on base skills. So yeah, okay, so there's the hitters that this group has brought in and developed. I feel like the only nitpick. Oh trades trades great, They're usually pretty good at trades, drafting, very good international signing. Their international signings have been pretty solid when they've been in charge. The only thing I can poke at them is they stink at bringing in platoon bats. They're platoon bats. They're not just bad, they're awful well. 00:25:46 Speaker 2: And the free agent signings haven't gone great so far either, between Garb and Naylor, ref Snyder, Pollock, I mean, and that ties in with the platoons Pollock and Refsnyder. But the free agent signings, yeah, have not been perfect. I mean, how do you evaluate the trades they've made for big league offense. I mean it's been i'd say hit or miss so. 00:26:07 Speaker 1: Ta Oscar right, that was that was a wash probably okay, because I mean you gave up the primary piece was Eric Swanson, and Swanson had a good year and change and then it was out of the big leagues. 00:26:22 Speaker 2: Right and then although that's one good year and one bad year when they traded for him. 00:26:29 Speaker 1: M hmm. The one good year was free agency, not even a trade. 00:26:33 Speaker 2: Oh true? 00:26:33 Speaker 1: Yeah? Uh, Cole Wong was a disaster. 00:26:37 Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know there's been some Jesse Winker, but then I guess I gets balanced out with Gino, so. 00:26:44 Speaker 1: That part's been hit or mess. But they've had some really good trades. Josh Neeler was a good trade. Gino was a good trade. Luis Castill was a good trade. Yeah, for sure. How are we judging the Edwin Diez trade? 00:26:59 Speaker 2: Well, I mean, if they were gonna tear down, they had to try to get prospects back for a closer. You weren't gonna keep Edwin Diaz on a rebuilding team. That wouldn't have made any sense. But yeah, like, look, they got what looked to be a really hefty return for him, and then it just didn't work out with Jared. So yeah, look, you can you are more than in your right to evaluate in your own opinion on how they've done with trades. You can look at it in the positive lens. You can look at it in a negative lens. I think that's totally fair. But I just think what they've done with again farm system, with big league pitching, and again the fact they got as far as they did last year is probably gonna buy him some more time. I wish they'd made the playoffs more times than their tenure, that's for sure. But I think the other part of Josh's question we should get into here a little bit, because he does specify more. He said should they go because they made the decision to hire him without any managerial experience and with no interview process. So we've mentioned this a bit on previous episodes. Will men again, we don't have any confirmation on the following, But just to tell you guys, what we've heard and the things that we've picked up through the echo chambers and just through some conversations, is we've heard both stories. And this isn't just conversations with random drunk fans in the pen. This is like, you know, these are these are These are conversations with people that we trust that we have heard both stories. We have heard it was a Jerry decision, and we have also heard that bringing Dan on in the way they did without interviewing anybody else was an ownership decision, and they told Jerry this is who they had to hire. So I don't know which one of those is true. If it truly was Jerry on his own and the front office on their own, I mean, yeah, it's a terrible process I mean, and I mean beyond terrible, and we've seen how that Dan Wilson era's gone, but there are still other things that balance it out. 00:28:56 Speaker 1: The other thing I can note from this based on that specific do you think the mayors cut corners on other parts of their process? Like organization? Do they cut corners? Drafting? Do they cut corners? Developing? Do they cut corners with their No, I guess the free agents kind of, but some of their other homegrown players. Do they do that? 00:29:18 Speaker 2: No? Not really. Again, the front office certainly doesn't seem to cut corners. The free agency thing is is again owners that goes that goes higher than the front office. That is the owners deciding to cut corners because again they're often pretty cheap and don't like to spend. 00:29:31 Speaker 1: Right, Well, they whoever hired Dan Wilson cut corners hiring him so that the results are what the results are when you cut corners, is. 00:29:43 Speaker 2: That this feels like a pretty decent time to weave in this passing thing, right, because I mean, we're on the well, we're on the topic of Dan. I said we were gonna mention passing. Wow, so passing was on brocken Salt. This week as he usually is doing his regular radio hit and let's let me just play you a couple seconds or like a few seconds of two different clips when he's talking about the state of the Mariners and what's gone wrong and why they are where they are, and he starts to go into answer this is number one, talking about when things go this badly and you're at the point you're at. He thought it points to something deeper. And then he talks about that they need to make a change, and he kind of says this here, I'll try to cue it up for the right spot, but here, let's let's give it a shot. I'll just put my mic up or phone up to the mic, change up the. 00:30:31 Speaker 3: Mix in there. And I almost wonder if it's a matter of changing up the mix, because I'm not sure that they're going to change up the thing that they really should, which is the manager. 00:30:43 Speaker 2: Okay, so that's number one where you just heard the premiere voice in baseball media essentially say Dan Wilson should no longer have a job. 00:30:51 Speaker 1: Correct. They're unwilling to, he said, they're unwilling to make the change. They or he's unsure they're going to make the change. They actually need to change. 00:30:58 Speaker 2: Which is the manager, which is Jeff Passen saying again, Dan Wilson shouldn't be managing anymore, right. 00:31:05 Speaker 1: Which teas up the second one, which is even more damning. 00:31:09 Speaker 2: Right, and why and this is and this is point number two. I think it's very simple. 00:31:13 Speaker 3: If Dan Wilson weren't one of the best players in franchise history, he would. 00:31:18 Speaker 2: Not be manager anymore. Yeah. 00:31:21 Speaker 3: I think it's simple as that. There's politics that are going on here. 00:31:28 Speaker 1: Yes, yep. 00:31:30 Speaker 2: Again, you guys know good and well how we feel about Dan as a manager, but don't take it from us. That is again the premiere voice in baseball media saying he doesn't think Dan should have a job anymore. And he's also saying that if Dan wasn't in the team Hall of Fame, he would have been gone. All right. 00:31:51 Speaker 1: Yeah, here's a note to anybody if in our listening audience who eventually wants to to run a baseball team, If you you want like a nice, smooth operation with no politics, as Jeff Passon says, if you're hiring a manager, let's make sure like the manager or the GM or the president. Because the giants are running into the situation too with Buster Posey. The person can have no association with your organization prior no players. 00:32:22 Speaker 2: I mean if they had played one year in the organization or something like that where they didn't have true ties. Okay, Ryan Sandberg managed the Phillies. It's not like he was some Phillies legend. He was obviously a Hall of Famer as a Cub. But then manage the Phillies. 00:32:36 Speaker 1: You get what I'm saying. No, no ten tenure player for X franchise gets to should gets hired to come back and run run said franchise, either in the dugout or in the front office. As you can see, like the two examples we currently have in Major League Baseball, it puts teams in really difficult situations, more difficult than it should be. Where if Dan Wilson had no associate with the Mariners, the Mariners would not have a preconceived bias from twenty five years ago to prevent them from making decision that could potentially make them better this year. 00:33:10 Speaker 2: Correct. And by the way, let me just add one more note to what pass And said before we get to our next question. When Passing talks about stuff like this, he's not really ripping off takes. If you listen to Jeff talk about what he just said, that does not sound like he's ripping off some take. That sounds to me like he has got intel and has had conversations with people inside that building that also feel that way. I can't know that for sure. It's not like we've asked Passon about it. It's just what it sounds like listening to those answers. And if that's true, if what we are saying is true, then that backs up what TJ and I have been saying for months, which is we think this front office, despite some of the flaws it has, are just too smart a baseball people to be watching what's going down day by day, game by game, especially when trying to make decisions and saying, yeah, we love the way these games are getting managed. They can't say it publicly, but there's just no way, there's just no way that their philosophy lines up with what is going down on that field on a day to day basis. 00:34:18 Speaker 1: I can't say I'm that surprised, can't. 00:34:21 Speaker 2: No, No, we can't say that for sure. Again, like we're not us believing that isn't like it's not sourced but it's sure as hell feels that way, and it's sure as hell sounds that way. Listen in to pass and talk about it. 00:34:36 Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, before we get to our next mailbag question, Lole, let's pause here for another ad. 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Head to cozyearth dot com and use our code Marine for an exclusive twenty percent off. That's code Marine Maari for an exclusive twenty percent off. And if you see a post purchase survey mention that you heard about Cozy Earth right here. Michael on Patreon asks, can you compare what the actual packages might be for Kirby versus Hancock in your opinion? 00:35:54 Speaker 2: Man, it's hard. I mean, let me turn this back to you. First, do you think these guys have similar to equal value? Because Kirby is the better pitcher with two and a half years of control, but Emerson has proven to be a really good big league starter this year with four and a half years of control. 00:36:12 Speaker 1: That's one hundred percent what I think. I think the package is essentially the same. And also consider this, if the Mariners are trying to buy this with these moves, they're trying to buy and make themselves better. There's a cap that a team is gonna is gonna set when they're trading players that the Mariners deem by worthy. Because if you're buying, you're trading for big leaguers and most likely the team you're trading with needs a starting pitcher so they can compete in the playoffs. So how much are you really gonna get back? Right? 00:36:44 Speaker 2: I mean, it's impossible to put together an exact package for you because you got to pick the team. You gotta go through the player, you gotta go through the prospects, and there's so many different options if you want a general return and what it could look like, it feels like it would be one can controllable big league player and then one solid prospect to good prospect. 00:37:05 Speaker 1: Mm hmm. Yeah, it can be like the Connolly Early for Curtis Mead trade. Well, that was straight up so yeah, I mean that was a straight up trade. Every team trades and values differently, but that's a pretty solid, a pretty solid framework that the Nationals and Red Sox laid out for the Mariners if they're going to trade one of these guys. Emerson doesn't have as much control as Connolly Early, but he's also more proven in the big leagues. He's pitched for longer, and on the other side, Curtis Mead might be better than any better and younger than any player the Mariners could get back in a trade. Curtis Mead has had a really good year of fortunate he's hurt now, broke his wrist. That's a bummer, really bad luck. But he's like a thirty percent over league average as a hitter this year, and that's a one for one swap for a big leaguer. The Mariners I think at this point would take that in a heartbeat. But I don't think that option's out there. I don't really think so. So I'm with you. I'm thinking it's a it's a solid big league player and it's a prospect. But even still, there's where you'd be making too much of your trying to find a difference in value between those two guys. 00:38:11 Speaker 2: Sure, yeah, I agreed in. 00:38:13 Speaker 1: The middle of the season especially that adds so much. Off season trades are much different in season trades. I mean, everyone's trying to win, right, Yeah. Next question comes from I think I'm saying your name your name right? I think Jatin, I know we've we've met in person, and I forget how to pronounce it, So I apologize. Let me know in the comments that I pronounced that correctly. His question is what if the Mariner's trade for Lane Thomas from the Royals. 00:38:45 Speaker 2: I mean, I guess they need a right handed bat, but it doesn't feel like a very inspiring trade. They could do it, but Lane Thomas is a free agent at the end of the year. He is hitting lefties pretty well this year, but still for the Sea as a whole, he's barely been an above average hitter. He's an okay defender at best. At this point. It's just like like it would essentially like be replacing Rob Refsnyder if you went and got Lane Thomas, that would be the role he'd fill. But that's not really putting you over the top. 00:39:20 Speaker 1: This is not a move to put you over the top. I think if you move on from Victor Roeblists and replace it with him with Lane Thomas, I think I'd be fine with that. 00:39:27 Speaker 2: Oh, I guess Roboys could be the other option here. Is that who Thomas replaces? Again, Sure, but you got to do a lot more than that. 00:39:35 Speaker 1: It's yeah, it's not just him. But if if this option is available, I think I would do it. 00:39:39 Speaker 2: Sure. 00:39:39 Speaker 1: I think I think your team would be slightly better with that. I think that would be better. You can't bet put him in the lineup against righties. He's terrible against righty's, but he's been good against lefties this year. 00:39:48 Speaker 2: Yeah. 00:39:49 Speaker 1: So you put him out in the corner, in a corner outfield spot, I think he'll be better. The Royals have played him out in center a ton he's been terrible out there. 00:39:55 Speaker 2: Yeah, And I was gonna say, maybe that's why his defense has been so brutal this year. Now, the guy has a good arm, he just has not played good defense. 00:40:03 Speaker 1: No, but you put him in a corner outfield spot, put him in right field, and he could be your guy to be in the lineup against lefties. I do think that would be a plus. 00:40:11 Speaker 2: Sure. I mean again, like, it's fine. I'm not saying it's a bad move. It's just I don't think that's exactly riling up the fan base in a positive way. If that makes sense, I think people would say, okay, like sure. 00:40:25 Speaker 1: Next question comes from Alex on Patreon. Alex's question is During the broadcast to the second game against the Dodgers, Dave Valley and Aaron Goldsmith discussed how long it took for Edgar Martinez to become an everyday major league player. Reminded me a bit of Canzone. What do you think are the chances that Canzone becomes the Mariners full time DH for the foreseeable future, And what would you say is his one hundredth percentile outcome? 00:40:50 Speaker 2: Well, I can't say his one hundred percentile outcome is going to be Edgar because that's just not fair to say he's going to be a Hall of Fame hitter. But one hundred percentile outcome, I mean, the guy makes a couple All Star Games as a Mariner over the next few seasons, and he's a thirty home run guy moving forward, and he puts up similar ops to what he's putting up now, or is you know, consistently an eight thirty to eight sixty ops guy. Feels like one hundred percentile outcome. If you get an eight to fifty ops in Dom can Zone for the next three to four years and he makes two All Star Games, that's a pretty good outcome. 00:41:25 Speaker 1: To answer the first question, yes, I think he will be at the Mariner's DH going forward at the very least next season, and hard to as long as the production remains well above average, he's going to have it for seasons going forward. One hundred percentile, I'd just say Mariners Hall of Fame with roughly the same offensive output as Kyle Seger over his career for one hundred percent of Kyle Sieger at two hundred and forty two home runs. At Dom's current rate, he'll probably have maybe slightly better rate stats than Kyle Seger, but overall, maybe the power production will be close to that two forty two mark, and that'd be a really really good career for Dom Canzone. 00:42:05 Speaker 2: Yeah, you hit two hundred and fifty big league home runs. That's a great career. Not a Hall of Fame career, but I don't think anybody's expecting that. It's a really good career if he does that. Yeah, he'll get paid in free agency if he does that, that's for. 00:42:17 Speaker 1: Sure, definitely, or the Mariners extend him. He could probably be an extension candidate, given he's a DH and his age. 00:42:25 Speaker 2: Yeah, they would take him a while to hit free agency. 00:42:27 Speaker 1: Yeah, so he's got what three years? 00:42:30 Speaker 2: Yeah, I believe he's a free agent after twenty twenty nine if I have that right. 00:42:35 Speaker 1: Oh, so he's got three more years. 00:42:38 Speaker 2: Offt Yeah, Yeah, he is a free agent in twenty thirty. 00:42:42 Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, so yeah, he's got three years left. So the Mariners are in no rush for that, but he's definitely an extension candidate, a little shorter extension because he'll be thirty one. Thirty two sounds right by the time he hits free agency. 00:42:56 Speaker 2: Yeah. 00:42:58 Speaker 1: Next question comes from Alex on Patreon. Alex's question is what gets us Mason Miller and are the Mariners willing to pay it at this point? 00:43:06 Speaker 2: I mean, we've talked about this. We said the thing that would put it over the top is trading George Kirby for him, because I don't know how the Padres would get much of a better return package than a bona fide big league starting pitcher who's been an All Star and throws strikes at the rate that Kirby does. But if you want to look to something other than just a starting pitcher, because we've talked about that, I mean, if you want to know what for sure would land him, I mean trading Kate Anderson and Ryan Sloan would land him. But the Mariners aren't gonna do that. So, you know, trading Felnen, cell us In and somebody else that's high up in your prospects doesn't like if you're gonna trade Felnin and Las Montes. Could that get you Mason Miller, Probably, but the Mariners may not want to do that either. 00:43:54 Speaker 1: For a guarantee, it's gonna have to be George Kirby, Ryan Sloan or Kate Anderson. Yeah, everything else comes with a little bit of a question given how good Mason Miller is. Mason Miller's better now than he was at this point last year, like as a trade asset, Like Mason Miller was very stuffy and still very very very effective with the A's, but he's better now. 00:44:14 Speaker 2: Yeah, he was agreed. 00:44:16 Speaker 1: I think the profile of Mason Miller is significantly higher now and. 00:44:21 Speaker 2: He is he is trending toward Cooper's town. 00:44:24 Speaker 1: With Yeah, I mean he is one of the greatest relievers that has ever played Major League baseball. That that's pretty certain, and just on a rate basis. 00:44:34 Speaker 2: On a rate basis, I was going to say, the counting stats still have a long way to go, but yes, for sure. 00:44:40 Speaker 1: But he pitches in Major League baseball for a while, then those counting statues will catch up. Next question comes from Xander on Patreon. Xander's wondering with the Mariner's home run derby coming up, if we were to put all the Mariner's content creators in the lineup, who would win? 00:45:00 Speaker 2: Man, So, if you had asked me this a year ago, even a few months ago, maybe there's a chance I'd pump my own like ego up and say myself, but I think it's our buddy Andrew. I think it'd be our buddy West Coast Willie, who I'm sure some of you guys know that would have the best shot. I mean, he played Division one baseball. Now, he was a pitcher, but him and I have known each other a long time, and like we grew up playing against each other in All Stars in Little League, and you know, had a bunch of mutual friends all through high school. And like he was a really really good high school player as a hitter and a pitcher. And I think if you were gonna put some content creators out there, he'd probably be the best one. I was gonna vote for you. Oh you were, Oh that's Yeahue. Well, again, if you had asked me a few months ago, I might have said me. But again, I didn't play Division one baseball. So but you get hit a ball really far, all right, So I mean, look like I think I could hold my own like, I think I got a shot to like, like send some baseball's a long way, but but I don't know if I could put myself in the top. 00:46:11 Speaker 1: I mean, you and Andrew hit about the same amount with the Division one level. 00:46:16 Speaker 2: I guess that's fair. But he was always a better player than I was growing up and through high school, which is why I'll put more. I'll put more chips in his basket. I mean, if you guys want to find out for yourself, If you guys aren't doing anything on Saturday, I'll just give a little plug here. TJ and I and our buddy Andrew, who's West Coast Willie on social media, are all playing in a celebrity softball game in Kirkland. It's called the Cats and Dogs Celebrity Softball Game. It's it's to help support and honor the Junior Softball World Series that takes place in Kirkland every year. But it's gonna be in Kirkland at three pm on Saturday at Lee Johnson Field, and all three of us are playing in the game. We're all on the same team, so I don't know. We'll see who shows out in that game. Maybe I'll help win or lose some points for some people. 00:47:02 Speaker 1: If you want to watch me come swing and miss, then that's yeah, show up. 00:47:07 Speaker 2: See you can tell the swing a bat? Can you tell the difference in priorities here? I mean TJ is sitting here saying, I just hope I don't look absolutely stupid and I may be the worst player out. There was this message to me earlier in the in the week. Yet West Coast Willie and I are sitting here saying, can I like connect to hit a ball out of Lee Johnson? That is our mindset going into this. 00:47:29 Speaker 1: I will I'll take a ball out of the infield. If maybe if I had some time to actually take some swings, i'd feel a little bit better about myself. But I don't know what I'm enough time to take swings. Oh, we're just we're just gonna We're just gonna show up on Saturday, Lyle, and we're gonna hope the baseball gods are on our side. 00:47:47 Speaker 2: Oh. I actually took some swings here on Thursday night tonight when the game got out of hand after Dalton Rushing hit the home run. My brother's in town briefly, so we went out to uh one of our local baseball fields, and I was actually taking some swings, so I was like, yeah, okay, give myself a shot to try to connect with one on Saturday. Why not? 00:48:04 Speaker 1: If you're leave your prediction down in the comments below. Whether or not Wile actually clears the fence at Lee Johnson Field, it's it's not likely. 00:48:12 Speaker 2: It's a hard part. Honestly, for those who know the field, it favors lefties much more than it does righties. If you want to hit one out of there, as a writing, you kind of got to hit it right down the line, like right down the line. But it'll be fun. I'm really looking forward to playing in the game in all seriousness. If you want one other name of a Mariner's content creator, So we've had it was a while back, but we've had our friend Ben Ranieri on the podcast before once and he played Division three college baseball, I believe, so he'd probably be another one that has a shot. 00:48:43 Speaker 1: Next question comes from Alex on Patreon. Alex's question is looking back at your preseason expectations, who's exceeded the more Cole Young or dom can Zone. 00:48:56 Speaker 2: I mean, it's interesting. I think both have obviously exceeded, But if I have to pick one. I think it's got to be Cole Young because I don't think we expected Cole Young to play this type of defense after what he showed in his rookie year. Because his rookie year there was some real bumps in the road with his second base defense. Now all of a sudden, you turn around and he's been awesome over there. So I think we all believe there was a world that can Zone could have a good season at the played offensively after the spurt that he showed in the second half of last year. But to see what Cole Young's done on defense after what he displayed in his rookie season, paired with the fact that he's actually got a chance to be a twenty home run second baseman, I'd say, Cole Young, this is tough. 00:49:39 Speaker 1: I kind of lean the other direction here. 00:49:41 Speaker 2: Hold up, maybe I haven't looked in a while. What happened to Cole's defense is about where it was. It's way down is oas in the eighteenth percentile now. 00:49:53 Speaker 1: Was DRS has stayed about the same sense about. 00:49:57 Speaker 2: May Well, that's good. Honestly, Sometimes defensive run saved is a better metric for infielders and OA is the better metric for outfielders, So I guess that's a good sign if he's If he's still putting up good numbers by drs, the. 00:50:12 Speaker 1: Defense I think is like stabilized a little bit. It hasn't. He's not entering like an Andrelton Simmons level of like plus thirty drs. 00:50:20 Speaker 2: That's fair. But yeah, he's still been good. 00:50:23 Speaker 1: He's had a very good overall season. 00:50:25 Speaker 2: Young has actually, yeah, so by defensive run saved, he's still got twelve of them for the year, which is very good. 00:50:30 Speaker 1: Okay, so like well, but he did have like eleven of them by May. Sure, yeah, but you know what, some further content, but you know what. 00:50:38 Speaker 2: Man by Baseball Reference, he might end the season as a legit four win player. And I don't think most people had that on their Bengo card for Cole Young in year two as a twenty two year old. 00:50:48 Speaker 1: No, but I do remember we weren't totally bought in on dom can zone at the start of his season, right, And he's far and away been or maybe not far and away, but he's been the Mariners' most consistent hitter this season, and he has I think really shown us what he could do at the plate, Like, listen to this consistency. By month, April he had a one forty four WRC, plus May he had a one twenty four, Junie had a one ninety one, and July he had a one twenty one. Yeah, that's way better than what I would have thought. There's no valleys, like the difference between him and Luke Rayley are staggering when it comes to consistency. Yeah, I think I think that shows a lot for Dom. I think I'm gonna I think I'm gonna lean down with this answer. 00:51:29 Speaker 2: I'm gonna make one more one more point for Cole because speaking of consistency, I don't think you can talk about Cole Young without mentioning this. He's played every game. He's been in every game this year. Remember how last September he ran out of gas and the Mariners basically stopped playing him, and then he wasn't on the postseason roster. He's turned that around and he has been so durable that he's played every single day. I mean that means something. 00:51:57 Speaker 1: It definitely does. Cameron I Patreon asks, do you guys think we will see Michael Arroyo called up? Or when will we'll think Michael Royal could be called up. 00:52:08 Speaker 2: I mean, if they don't go get a right handed bat at the deadline, don't you feel like it's got a chance to be pretty soon. I know you can't take everything you see in Tacoma that seriously, because it's such a bambox of a league and a hitter's park. But Michael Royo is crushing the baseball down in Tacoma to the point where it makes you think, yeah, he might need a new challenge here soon, even though he hasn't played that many games in Triple A. I think there's becoming a much, much more real possibility that we're gonna see Royal before the end of the season. So maybe on September first, maybe when rosters expand. 00:52:42 Speaker 1: I think if they don't trade for a bat at the deadline, he's up next week. 00:52:45 Speaker 2: Oh wow, okay, get do you want drastic change? I mean it might spark plug something. It's gotta try. 00:52:54 Speaker 1: It's time to start throwing stuff at the wall. If they don't, if they can't find a deal they like by Monday, yeah, you're starting to throw shit at the wall. And you're saying, all right, like clearly, Michael you can hit in triple A, so can everyone else. Let's let's show you what Let's see what you can do at the big league level and hopefully you can help us. 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It was not good. So that's the closest thing we've had to something that's quantitative. But I don't think there's anything definitive you can find. 00:55:13 Speaker 1: Hmmm, I'm I'm I think the best thing I could find is like one run game win loss record, Like that's it's close, but even still, Dan doesn't have total control of the Mariners performance in one run games, so it's it's tough, Like honestly, this is an old school eye test and like a yes no? Or was a was a bullpen decision? Successful? Like does it? Does that check out? That's why a lot of this for managers comes down to process over results, Like is is a manager's process good? Does he think about the game the right way? Is he thinking about his matchups within a baseball game and the decision he decisions he's gonna make make and how he operates his club? Else? Is the process of that good? And the answer to that for Dan Wilson is we don't really know what it is because he just doesn't say it, doesn't really say what it is how he manages his players besides the fact he's hands off, and we don't know his process for making decisions besides like yeah it worked or didn't? 00:56:20 Speaker 2: Oh no, his process is not good. In fact, I say it's bad because while he doesn't explain it, we've seen it play out on the field and it blows up in their face half the time. 00:56:30 Speaker 1: Well more or less, Yeah it's bad. And we also don't know what it is. 00:56:34 Speaker 2: Yeah, I think both are true. 00:56:36 Speaker 1: Yeah, So to answer your question, Ralph, no, there's not. I think eventually someone will find something something the maybe on Baseball Savant will find they'll cook up cook up a stat for managers. But as of right now, I don't think we have one. Nick on Patreon asks to follow up to Ralph's question, saying he wants to piggy act on that question, what is a run handicap that the Mariners, simply due to Dan's decision making, would have in a seven game series? So, for example, the Mariners would have a negative two run handicap and a seven game series based on dance decisions. 00:57:18 Speaker 2: Well, if it was negative too, they still would have lost in Game seven, wouldn't they Because it's a three run homer that Springer hit. 00:57:28 Speaker 1: But they were they were up to Blue Jays, right, Yeah, they ended up up to so it was it would have been net even they would have tired. They would have gone extras. 00:57:39 Speaker 3: Uh. 00:57:40 Speaker 1: I mean two runs sounds right? Two runs is a single Kerry Carpenter home run with a runner on. 00:57:47 Speaker 2: All right? 00:57:48 Speaker 1: Sure this is both those, both the big decisions and the or I guess the two biggest decisions of the playoffs. Both were like NET two in some way. 00:57:56 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, they were Okay, two. 00:57:59 Speaker 1: Run sounds right once you get into bigger runs. I mean, if it's if your manager is costing you four runs in a series, like that's that's really bad. I don't even think Dan's cost them four runs in a series. I don't think has he. 00:58:12 Speaker 2: I don't think off the top of my head, but I won't say yes for sure. Go back to the monitor and we check, yeah for sure. 00:58:19 Speaker 1: Okay. Caate on Patreon asks what are your thoughts on trading Emerson Hancock to the White Sox for Braden Montgomery? 00:58:27 Speaker 2: So I tweeted this idea out because shout out to this question. I mean, honestly, Caden brings a really good question to the table. This is the name I had not thought about. If I thought about it, I think it would have been a good one to bring up to Adam Jude. I would be intrigued by the return on this because this is the type of player where you could stomach trading away one of your starting pitchers. Because Braidon Montgomery is not perfect. He hasn't hit for a ton of power in the minor leagues. His Savan Page is a rookie, is not perfect offensively by any stretch, but he is a switch hitting outfielder whose service clock just started because this is his first season in the big leagues. He is a very good defender. He has a strong arm, he's got speed, he's a good athlete. He's a former first round pick. This feels like the type of guy that could turn into an everyday player for you, that has the chance to be a player of some impact. So look, I like the idea. I don't know if the White Sox would go for this, because I think they view Bradon Montgomery as a potential All Star outfielder one day, but I would be intrigued. I would stomach that return, okay, if that's what they got back for a starter. 00:59:41 Speaker 1: I like the idea. So we checked in with our friend Elijah Evans, who also works at Just Baseball. He's a big White Sox fan covers the White Sox, so we pitched this idea to him. He said, unlikely, but not impossible, which kind of makes me think, like, how much would you have to overpay for Braid Montgomery. So his pitch was that the White Sox don't have enough depth in their outfield, in their farm system to justify trading someone like Braid Montgomery. So I'm like, all right, if you have to make it worth it to them, like an overpay to make the White Sox clearly say yes, it is trading Emerson Hancock and lazarro Montes for Braid Montgomery. But I know that's never gonna happen. Why would you trade Why would you trade that kind of capital for a guy who is still a prospect. I couldn't justify that. It would be some teams would think it's an overpay if you traded Emerson Hancock straight up for Braiden Montgomery. But that's like the best the Mariners could offer. And if the White Sox wouldn't say yes to that, then I don't know if there was something they would say yes to. 01:00:46 Speaker 2: Right again, I think Braid Montgomery had some really nice upside and like does he have the chance to be an All star outfielder? Yeah, But that also might be why the White Sox don't want to give them up. I mean, I think they feel like he, you know, isn't going to be a guy that strikes out a ton. He's already not striking out a ton in the big leagues. It's about a twenty percent rate as a rookie, which is a pretty good sign. So there are Again, they are nice tools to Brad Montgomery's game, and I would be pretty happy with that return if that's what they got. But it would probably be hard to get the White Sox to say yes to giving them away, especially because the White Sox farm system isn't loaded with outfielders. I think they liked the idea of having Montgomery and Antonachi and a couple of those other guys form up their outfield for a long time. 01:01:36 Speaker 1: From the trade values we've seen so far at this deadline, is Braidon Montgomery more valuable than Curtis Mead? Do you think? 01:01:44 Speaker 2: Current moment? 01:01:45 Speaker 3: No? 01:01:45 Speaker 2: But it's more of a long term outlook. 01:01:48 Speaker 1: Right, But the teams factor it in when they're trading for a player like that. I mean I would argue, yes, yeah, I mean even though Curtis Mead was a prospect for the for the for the Rays like he used to keep a currently not quite as much, but he still netted you a whole pitcher, right, Brad Montgomery's more valuable than Curtis meat Is and it's like, Okay, then maybe it does lean towards Emerson in a prospect for him, But I you know at that point, like, again, you're giving up a lot of capital for a guy who still is unproven in the big leagues. 01:02:21 Speaker 2: Right, it's a risk. 01:02:23 Speaker 1: It'd certainly be a risk, but maybe the murders have to take a risk at this point. 01:02:27 Speaker 2: Right, And again, he could end up hitting for some power. He's certainly hit for power in college, Like could Montgomery be a twenty twenty guy at some point? Possible, but it would be a hard one to pull off. But I really like the question, Kad, because I think it's a very interesting player that I like and a lot of people like. And I don't think a lot of people have thrown out that name. So it's a unique idea and I'm glad we're having some more names being thrown out there that are kind of outside the box thinking in a good way. 01:02:55 Speaker 1: David wraps us up on Patreon and asks, how about Pete Fairbanks potent being acquired? 01:03:02 Speaker 2: If you had asked me a couple of years ago, I would have said, awesome, It's just Pete Fairbanks has really really had a tough go of it. It can't be your move for a reliever if that's what you're doing, like, you got to go get a leverage reliever and him, because he is sitting with an era that's approaching seven this year. 01:03:22 Speaker 1: He could pitch in your Carlos Vargas role. Yeah, for Ben Carlos Vargas from coming back onto the roster right again. 01:03:31 Speaker 2: Pete Fairbanks is a big name once upon a time, pitching some big games, and he was a leverage reliever for the Rays in a lot of those years where they were a dominant team. But it I just don't think he's the same guy anymore. 01:03:46 Speaker 1: He's still really good against left, uh not left, he's against right. He's he's allowing a sub six hundred ops there, but against lefties it's like a lost cause over a thousand ops. They're destroying him. Almost all of the damage done against peer Pete Fairbanks this year is when he has to face a left handed hitter. That's not for a reliever. I mean, as a reliever, especially a writer reliever, you should be able to get both out and if you can't, it's it's tough. It's a really tough sell to a team to be a reliable guy. But if if Pete Fairbanks comes to the Mariners to pitch in the sixth inning, like, I'm fine with that, which is what he is at this point. He's a sixth thinning reliever until proven otherwise. 01:04:27 Speaker 2: But again, is Zra is sitting at like seven this year? 01:04:31 Speaker 1: Do you want him pitching in the sixth I mean, I'd rather him than Michael Rucker. 01:04:36 Speaker 2: Well, okay, but if you get Fairbanks, you got to go get somebody else too. 01:04:40 Speaker 1: Yes, one hundred percent. No, No, to be Pete Fairbanks is in no way your only option. 01:04:45 Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, so we're we're on the same page there now. Well, as always, you guys really bring it with the creativity of these questions, because as we approach the trade deadline, there's a lot to talk about. There's certainly a lot to talk about with the team right now, not all in the best of ways, But you guys always come prepared with questions, and that's what we love. And if you guys are out there and we haven't answered a question of yours and you want us to answer a question of yours, go sign up for our Patreon and you get guaranteed mailbag questions answered every single week when you send them. With that, that just about wraps up this edition of the Marine Layer Podcast. You guys know the drill. If you want to listen to the full form podcast, you can do so wherever you get your audio pods, make sure you download these episodes. If you're listening, make sure you go rate and review and please leave it five stars. When you're on Apples, Spotify, any of the audio platforms, go hit that subscribe button. If you're on YouTube and watching the podcast, make sure to go check out our website which is marine layerpod dot com. Patreons there, episodes are all there, podcast merches there that's marine layerpod dot com. And then on social media you can find us everywhere. We're posting content every day at marine Layer Pod. That's TJ. I'm Lyle As always be thank you guys for tuning in. We'll talk to you soon. 01:06:00 Speaker 3: St ST ST ST ST