Episode 462: Reacting To The Mariners Firing Manager Dan Wilson

00:00:00 Speaker 1: Welcome to episode number 462 of the Marine Layer podcast. We're reacting to the news that Dan Wilson is out as Mariners manager and he will not return for 2027. 00:00:11 Speaker 2: Reminder to you guys, make sure to download these podcast episodes. If you're listening, make sure to rate and review, leave it five stars. You can check out our website, which is marinelayerpod.com. You can find merch, Patreon episodes, everything over there. You can also hit subscribe on YouTube if you're watching and follow us across social media at marinelayerpod. Let's get it rolling. 00:00:30 Speaker 3: And we welcome. 00:00:43 Speaker 1: You to this episode of the Marine Layer podcast, part of the Just Baseball Podcast Network, recording here Sunday afternoon, September 27th. Lyle, you've been waiting for these words all season long. Dan Wilson is out as Mariners manager. 00:01:02 Speaker 3: Why? 00:01:02 Speaker 2: What happened? That's a great question. 00:01:07 Speaker 3: I don't know. 00:01:08 Speaker 2: Like, this is a bit of a shock, I'd say. I mean, real left hook, if you ask me. 00:01:16 Speaker 1: Just totally out of left field. They didn't really waste any time. 00:01:21 Speaker 2: Dude. 00:01:23 Speaker 1: You're worried they might drag this out into the week. 00:01:26 Speaker 2: No? 00:01:26 Speaker 3: No? 00:01:28 Speaker 2: They did not. Well, that did foil my plans of being prepared to get up at 6 in the morning to go to the gym, so I was nowhere but absolutely seated when the news dropped this week. But instead, we got an absolute curry from way downtown this afternoon in the middle of the Mariners game, and we'll get to that. But have you guys ever just felt like a weight lifted off your shoulders? Like, have you ever felt like you could just fly? Dude, I feel like today I could just fly. You ever see the movie Limitless, by the way? 00:01:59 Speaker 3: No. 00:02:02 Speaker 2: I don't think so. Okay, it's a movie with Bradley Cooper, and if I remember right, the premise of the movie is, I think in real life, humans only use a part of their brain. Is it a third of their brain? Is it two-thirds of the brain? Whatever it is. Well, in Limitless... Bradley Cooper starts taking some pill that allows him to use his full brain, which nobody can do in real life, and he does things like starting to learn how to play the piano, and he masters it in two days. He starts to do things like that. Now that the Equation X of Dan Wilson has been removed from the Marine Layer pod, I almost feel like Bradley Cooper in Limitless, where now that I have a full brain to work with, I mean, I could do anything. Dude, I could solve world hunger. Maybe I'll marry Alex Earl. Who knows? Like, it could do anything. 00:02:55 Speaker 1: I have a question for you because we asked this question of the Mariners is what's going to be their driving force of 2027? I would say a big driving force of this podcast in 2026 was the topic of Dan Wilson. If we ever ran out of something to talk about, usually something with Dan Wilson happened that we could talk about no matter what, and there would always be something. Wow, what is the driving force of this podcast going to be next year? 00:03:20 Speaker 2: Well, the way you've been talking off the pod these days and even on a little bit, it sounds like it might be Jerry DePoto. Oh, yeah, it might be Jerry DePoto. 00:03:29 Speaker 1: We'll have plenty to say on the Mariners' front office and everything else that concluded the Mariners' season tomorrow. So as you're listening to this, this episode is going to come out on early Sunday evening. We are going to do a full season wrap. The Mariners' end-of-season press conference is tomorrow on Monday. After they're done with that, we will record. And then we also do a little bit on Rick Riz as well. So if you're looking for any of that, that will be on Monday's episode. That will be out sometime Monday afternoon. 00:03:54 Speaker 2: Yeah. This episode. So let me just clarify for people. Don't wake up tomorrow, Monday morning and expect an immediate pod because we are going to wait for the Mariners press conference with Jerry and Justin to conclude before we record tomorrow's podcast. So it'll be out in the afternoon tomorrow rather than your usual morning time because Something tells me there's going to be some things to dissect from that press conference. 00:04:19 Speaker 1: And some articles that came out over the weekend that I have some thoughts on regarding the relationship between the front office and the coaching staff, which just, it just continues to blow my mind day by day, but we can get to that tomorrow. 00:04:34 Speaker 2: I mean, this is a Dan Wilson episode that has to do with Dan. You want to get to that in a few minutes? 00:04:40 Speaker 1: I mean, Sure. I'm probably just going to bring it back up tomorrow again. 00:04:44 Speaker 2: That's fine. 00:04:45 Speaker 1: When, when, when they actually have to answer the questions in front of the public about it. 00:04:49 Speaker 2: Okay. 00:04:50 Speaker 3: Yeah. Yes. 00:04:51 Speaker 2: So as we sit here recording, why do we think the Mariners moved on from Dan Wilson? It's a tough puzzle to solve. I'm really blanking. 00:05:02 Speaker 1: Because I think they realized by early to middle of this season that this was going to be an inevitable outcome and they've they might've planned this day out months in advance. Cause what happened today seemed like a very well-oiled machine of how it was going to go down. I'm going to be, I'm going to be totally honest. Nothing that happened today seemed like it happened like randomly or, or there was the, the Scott service leak last year or Rosenthal's break in the news of service getting fired four hours before the Seattle times had that confirmation as well. Or Jerry going with, uh, ironically with Ken Rawls and all the day before and saying, well, anything's on the table and something like that. No, Lyle, I think today was a little bit different. I think it felt a little bit more sequenced and coordinated on how this all happened. But yeah, if you just want a frank answer on this, I think the Mariners understood by the middle of the season that this was the most likely outcome and they were ready for this to happen probably for weeks. It sounded like, based on all the articles that were written over the weekend, that this decision had already been made for a while, which is what you and I had assumed when we were asking, like, why hadn't the Mariners made any decisions? They just didn't want to actually go through with it until, well, September 27th. 00:06:16 Speaker 2: Rather than, you know, maybe doing it mid-season to try to actually save a season with expectations as high as ever. Unlike, you know, unlike what the Phillies did and unlike what the The Red Sox. Oh, and the Red Sox did. Yeah. Both those teams were popping champagne this weekend. 00:06:31 Speaker 1: The Mariners? 00:06:32 Speaker 2: No, they're going home. The only person that might pop champagne is me. You got it next to you. You didn't go for the big bottle? Oh, I didn't have a big bottle. They didn't have one or you didn't want one? No, I didn't get one in time. 00:06:48 Speaker 1: But if this is like... So, like, where do you rank this day in your life? 00:06:52 Speaker 3: I mean.... 00:06:54 Speaker 2: I mean, somewhere. 00:06:56 Speaker 1: I feel like if this ranks in the top 10, that warrants a full-size bottle. 00:06:59 Speaker 2: Yeah, it probably does. I mean, it probably ranks just below Gino's Grand Slam, if we're going to be honest. I don't know where it ranks. It's a positive day. Look, I know Dan was emotional in the press conference, and maybe he is sad to be leaving relationships just a certain point behind with some of the players. But also. 00:07:26 Speaker 2: Are we surprised? Like, is he surprised? 00:07:30 Speaker 1: I don't think he's surprised. He might've known for a while too, but until it actually happens. 00:07:35 Speaker 2: Yeah. 00:07:35 Speaker 1: Then, then it all kind of catches up to you. It's like Rick, like Rick knew the whole season. 00:07:39 Speaker 3: Yeah. 00:07:40 Speaker 1: Well, that's going to be done after this year. And then it all catches up at once. Like I, my last job I left, like I had to sign off on air too. And then I, I literally finished on the air and then left. It catches you in a moment. 00:07:52 Speaker 2: Yeah, it does. It does. And my final day on Brock and Talk was a little bit like that, too. All I mean is, with the way everything went down today, if we're going to get into that for a few minutes here, it did seem very, very pre-planned and premeditated. Because... Look, nobody's faking emotions here. Dan Wilson wasn't faking his emotions when he did his press conference today announcing he wouldn't be returning as the manager. But usually when managers get let go, you don't hear from them again. Where everybody's lasting image of Dan Wilson is the guy who couldn't make a bullpen decision, the guy who couldn't properly pinch hit, the guy who couldn't relay a message of the team, the guy who couldn't speak on a team identity, didn't answer media questions well, didn't hold any of his players accountable ever. Like, that would be everybody's lasting image. The fact that the Mariners did something pretty unique, and you were talking about this before we hit record, the fact they did something pretty unique, it actually... ran him out there kind of the way the Seahawks did with Pete Carroll to say his goodbyes and, and show some emotion. It like, again, nobody's faking their emotion, but it seemed like there was a purpose behind that where instead of just letting everybody's final narrative be complete goodbye and good riddance. Now you're seeing a lot of sympathy. Let's use the Diamondbacks, for example. There's been a lot of talk about Torrey Lovello being on the hot seat. He wasn't sure if he was being back. He had to do his postgame presser today. But the Diamondbacks hadn't made a decision yet, and he said he didn't know. Like, he's just being honest. I just thought it was kind of strange that they trotted Dan out there to do that, to make him face the questions and explain to everyone that he won't be back next year. Because otherwise, I feel like for 95%. 00:09:56 Speaker 1: Percent of coaches that's how it happens and for someone who had the season he had had uh in managing this team the fact he did that i i thought was a little strange and then when the news broke i mean ironically the news broke in rick riz's final three innings like do we think that's a coincidence Well, I think. 00:10:18 Speaker 2: That's a terrible look, to be honest, because you're taking away from Rick's final day. But I think, again, this was. But I mean, you could spin it in the other sense. It's like that's when we planned it to come out. So it's like we have this buoy of positivity for for Rick Riz. And then we're just going to slide Dan Wilson right underneath that. 00:10:37 Speaker 3: Yeah. Right. 00:10:38 Speaker 2: Which it's not really getting slid underneath, but it's not. 00:10:42 Speaker 3: But. 00:10:43 Speaker 1: You know, that's why teams put out press. That's why teams put out like hard press releases at five o'clock on a Friday. Cause all the new shows already done. 00:10:50 Speaker 3: Right. 00:10:51 Speaker 2: Yeah. 00:10:52 Speaker 1: Right. 00:10:52 Speaker 3: Yes. 00:10:53 Speaker 2: So I, I thought the. 00:10:54 Speaker 1: Sequencing of it, like, unfortunately just showed a little bit of lack of accountability of it where like everyone's lasting image of Dan Wilson will be the emotional Dan Wilson. Like The Mariners Hall of Famer Dan Wilson, like, stepping off the stage, tears rolling down his cheeks, which, again, emotions are totally warranted. 00:11:13 Speaker 2: Like, that's fine. 00:11:15 Speaker 1: But it's not the, oh, I wasn't very good at my job, and that's why I'm not employed here next year. 00:11:21 Speaker 3: Oh. 00:11:22 Speaker 2: Does that make sense? Oh, I don't think it's a slight lack of accountability. I think it's a total lack of accountability. This is as awful a managerial tenure as we've ever seen. It is as atrocious a two years as we've ever seen from a manager. And now people are going to say, oh, but Lyle, they made the ALCS last year and got all the way to game seven. Nope. Miss me with that. Miss me with that. It was in spite of him that they got there. And then what happened when they needed him? 00:11:48 Speaker 1: And then he made the wrong decision, multiple wrong decisions, and lost them the series. 00:11:51 Speaker 2: And cost this entire city a trip to the World Series. Yes. Right. So, yes, it's a lack of accountability. Of course it is. That's been the theme of this entire season. Of course it's a lack of accountability. He was not good at the job, and now he's not going to manage anymore. I understand there's emotions, but let's be real here. He was not good at the job. That's why he's not coming back. 00:12:14 Speaker 1: And. 00:12:15 Speaker 2: it does feel like a big blitz here on this Sunday to try to make people forget a little bit about that. Cause you just, you just, you know, you just described it pretty well. You have Rick Riz and everybody's right in the deep state of the emotion of him leaving and him on his final broadcast and him speaking publicly over the PA system after the game. And again, we'll, we'll get to Rick on Monday and give him all his praises again on Monday. We'll get to all that, but right in the middle of Rick doing that, And all of the send-off is, yes, like you said, an emotional press conference talking about how Dan Wilson gave it his all. And whether you believe that or not is, I would say, fair to be up for debate. But, like, yes, it shows a lack of accountability. Wasn't good at the job. But the PR blitz here is to try to make people forget about it because– Oh, 30 years ago, he caught for the franchise, was a middle-of-the-pack catcher, and put up an 80 WRC Plus for his career. 00:13:17 Speaker 3: Yeah. 00:13:19 Speaker 2: Speaking of Rick's speech. 00:13:21 Speaker 1: Do you notice the emphasis in his speech when he mentioned Dan's name? 00:13:26 Speaker 2: Yeah, he's like, and at the center of it all, Dan, the man, Wilson for the 1995 Mariners. I'm like, well, you had Griffey, you had Randy, you had Edgar, you had Buhner. A-Rod wasn't like a game-changing piece of that team, but he was on the team. 00:13:46 Speaker 1: I mean. 00:13:49 Speaker 2: Listen, I'm not going to— I think all those guys did get mentioned. 00:13:52 Speaker 1: They did. 00:13:52 Speaker 2: But, yeah, not with the same emphasis. They did. They did. But, look, Rick and— I' m not going to go in on Rick or anything. This is his weekend. He can say whatever he wants to say, and Rick and Dan are friends, so I'm sure he's trying to let Dan go out on a high note, too, while he had the public mic. But, again, like— I guess Dan in 95 had one of his better seasons. He didn't really have many great seasons. He had like a two and a half or a season, but he still put up an OPS plus of under a hundred. Like he was the centerpiece of the team. Again, that's like saying Christian Vasquez was the centerpiece of the 2018 Red Sox because he was there for eight years, but he was a middling catcher on a team with Mookie and Rafi and JD Martinez and everybody else. Chris sale. Yeah, no, no. Again, Rick deserves nothing but praise. We're going to give him all his praises Monday. But yes, the strong emphasis on Dan was hashtag notice by us here at the Marine Layer pod. 00:14:49 Speaker 1: Okay, I've been thinking about this. I just, this is the only Jerry thing I'm going to mention here on this podcast today. Maybe we can expand on it more tomorrow. So there was reporting done by Adam Jude over the weekend that the front office essentially with this coaching staff and with this team essentially kind of sat on their hands and waited for something to change with this team. Like that's essentially what was admitted. And funny enough, it seemed like Jerry and Dan had a good relationship last offseason where they reportedly met for coffee every single week to talk about game planning decisions and trying to get better at that stuff. Maybe Jerry was trying to put the work in to help Dan get better. Dan did not get better as evidence of this season. But then it seems like Jerry managed to chop up slash ruin that relationship this year by the one action they took firing Bobby Magallanes that pretty much everyone liked and that Jerry went along and did it anyways. And then for the rest of the season was just kind of like, eh, it's fine. We'll just play it out. And then fire Dan at the end of the season. I thought that was very on brand for Jerry Napoto when it always seems to come in a certain moment with a lack of feel and certainly not a good look. 00:16:07 Speaker 2: Dude, if there was a baseball Mount Rushmore for... burning bridges Jerry's on it it really is incredible how many bridges this guy manages to burn like again neither of us were fans by any stretch of Dan Wilson the manager but I think everybody knows Dan's supposed to be a good dude and he managed to strain that relationship it's incredible but then again if we're going to add on to that point and this is a Jerry problem too also in that article from the Seattle Times this weekend, was talking about the reason they were meeting for coffee is because Dan had essentially no feel for the modern game and analytics, so they're trying to meet in the offseason to coach him through a bunch of it. It's like, well, maybe that was something you guys should have done your research on before you decided to interview zero other candidates, make him the permanent manager, and then run him off with a team that had a chance to win the World Series. And we're sitting here wrapping up the season today... In large part because of the manager. I know Starr's underperformed, but like, brother, did you not stop to think about exactly this when you hired him? A guy that literally played for Lou Piniella, has had no managerial experience, isn't a modern age analytics person. Oh, he doesn't understand analytics? 00:17:27 Speaker 3: Shocker. 00:17:28 Speaker 2: And you just let him run through the first season, which led to putting Edward Bazzardo in game seven of the ALCS. 00:17:32 Speaker 3: Yes. 00:17:35 Speaker 1: They were essentially just running through all the questions Jerry would have asked him in an interview if he actually interviewed him. 00:17:41 Speaker 3: Yeah. 00:17:42 Speaker 2: So let me put out a nice press release of our own here on the Marine Layer pod as Dan Wilson's tenure has come to an end as Mariner's manager. For this next hiring process, actually interview people! Yeah. And note, we better see public reports of several and i mean several candidates being publicly interviewed for this job and we better see guys getting a first interview we better see certain candidates getting a second interview we better hear about the some of the finalization process there needs to be public candidates out there leaked about who's interviewing for this job because the pr blitz you ran on the dan wilson era and how he got hired again almost as disastrous as his managerial tenure. 00:18:34 Speaker 1: And hopefully that's the last time we'll have to mention Dan Wilson in any official matter on this podcast. It sounds like he might have another role in the organization. I don't really care as long as it's not anything. As long as he stays out of the way of the people who are making decisions on wins and losses. 00:18:50 Speaker 2: Listen, as long as he's not in the dugout or has some significant role in the front office, who cares? He goes back to being a minor league rover. What do I care? 00:19:02 Speaker 1: That stuff's just kind of like whatever. 00:19:04 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's just a wash. Like, whatever. But, oh my God. This, Seattle fans, Mariners fans, you can rise and you can awake because this 25-month-long nightmare is over. 00:19:22 Speaker 1: My last word here, dog. The Mariners handled this Dan Wilson situation in a very Mariners way. I always think about the interview we had with Ryan Divish two years ago after they fired Scott Service. And he said they need a director of common sense. And maybe, Lyle, they honestly had too much common sense in this, where it looks like really strange at the end. 00:19:48 Speaker 2: By the way, let's just say it forever. because this entire PR blitz is fooling, I'll say, maximum five entire Mariners fans and everybody else can read the tea leaves even if the Mariners don't want to say it. Dan Wilson was fired. He was fired from the job. Yeah, I mean, he was. Yes, he was. You can PR spin it however you want. They let him go. And by the way, when he was asked by Divish this afternoon in his press conference about, Dan, was this your decision or theirs to step away? And to the very end, to the very end of the Dan Wilson managerial tenure, he completely avoided the question, dodged it at all costs, and did not give a sufficient answer. But when he does that, you know what he's doing? He's covering. 00:20:35 Speaker 1: Who is he covering for? The front office who fired him. Yeah. I honestly think if Dan resigned, he would say he resigned. 00:20:43 Speaker 2: But he didn't. Well, he's also partly covering for himself in that regard, too, because he probably doesn't want it out there publicly that he was hashtag fired. So he's covering for both. 00:20:54 Speaker 1: I mean, he's not going to be the Mariners manager next year. I don't know how else you're supposed to spin it that you didn't get fired. If he was good at his job, he'd be the manager next year because it pays a hell of a lot more than whatever other role he's going to get. 00:21:06 Speaker 2: Which, again, goes back to that this entire PR spin is fooling maximum five Mariners fans out there. This idea that he's decided to walk away and he's just not going to come back next year, it's not fooling anybody. 00:21:20 Speaker 1: Well, I don't really, to be honest, I don't think that's a very strong narrative out there. I saw a few accounts tweeting about it, but if you read Divish's article, he states in the article that no one confirmed who made what decision. That usually means he got fired. Yeah. 00:21:36 Speaker 2: They're trying to save face. Yes. Correct. 00:21:39 Speaker 1: He informed the team this morning that he would not be back. 00:21:41 Speaker 2: Yes. 00:21:42 Speaker 1: Because the team told him he would not be the manager next year. 00:21:48 Speaker 2: It doesn't, it just doesn't, it just take a weight off your shoulders. We really don't have to talk about Dan Wilson anymore. Like maybe he'll be mentioned on Monday's pod too. When we wrap up the entire press conference and they have to explain why they moved on, et cetera. But, Like, this is a chapter closing. No more Dan Wilson. No more bullpen nightmares. No more tough one-to-nights. No more God knows whatever pinch-hitting decision he made. Like, no more. No more. By the way, I'll tell you this. When they media train the next manager, one of the first things, they'll never admit this, one of the first things they're going to tell the new manager is, for the love of God, do not start your press conferences with tough one-to-night. 00:22:33 Speaker 3: No. 00:22:35 Speaker 1: You're not allowed to say those words. You might not even be allowed to say the word tough. Pick a different synonym. At least for the first two months of the year. So people, people can forget about it. But yeah, there's going to be no tough one tonight. So I can, I can say that that is going to be part of media training. 00:22:52 Speaker 2: You're going to sleep well tonight, dog. I'll tell you that. It's going to be the best sleep of your life. Oh, like an absolute angel, dude. It's going to be awesome. Now I don't have to get up at 6am anymore to go to the gym. I'll just sleep in. That's amazing. 00:23:04 Speaker 3: Huh? 00:23:07 Speaker 2: We really made it, didn't we? We made it. We did. 00:23:10 Speaker 1: But now, dog, now, now that we've gotten to the end of this episode, has it set into you that the next episode we're going to get to do is going to be about a Jerry DePoto press conference? 00:23:19 Speaker 2: And it's going to be in less than 24 hours. Dude, I can't wait. Actually, to that point, I don't have to get up at 6 a.m., but I am definitely still going to go to the gym in the morning because, again, I need to be seated for when this press conference starts. There's going to be ridiculous things. that are said in this presser. Unless they actually decide to take some accountability, oh, there's going to be ridiculous things said in this presser. 00:23:43 Speaker 1: Well, let's hope so, because that would be very refreshing. 00:23:48 Speaker 2: Oh, if they actually owned up for it, it would be super refreshing. It just doesn't really fit the narrative of this season by any party. No, no. 00:23:57 Speaker 1: Is there going to be a percentage mentioned, a win percentage mentioned? 00:24:00 Speaker 2: Dude, there's no shot. Could you imagine if they tried to double down on that? There's no way. There's no way. That's not happening. I think if Jerry got up there and tried to re-explain his 54% process to try to circle back to it on Monday, I think they might just cut the press conference right there. I think that might be the end. 00:24:25 Speaker 1: That probably would be his last ever press conference. Sorry, Justin, you can do the rest of these from now on. 00:24:34 Speaker 2: By the way, we can talk about it more tomorrow, but Stanton should be up there having an answer for this too. They're not going to do it. Well, they're not going to do it because, again, lack of accountability. But Stanton should have to be up there answering questions too. 00:24:47 Speaker 1: Correct. 00:24:48 Speaker 2: Correct. 00:24:50 Speaker 1: But the number one person I think responsible for this is Jerry DePoto. Everyone and their mother has now confirmed that this was Jerry DePoto's doing. 00:24:58 Speaker 3: Right. It was. 00:24:59 Speaker 2: It was not ownership. 00:25:01 Speaker 1: Jerry DePoto hired the manager, hired the coaching staff who led to this season. And a lot of the things that we see out there on the field right now. 00:25:09 Speaker 2: But say they wanted to, say Jerry had decided in mid to end of May, they wanted to move on and try to save the season. If ownership said no, then you should have to answer for that. 00:25:23 Speaker 1: In all the reports, Dog, it said the front office and the ownership group made the decision to keep him. 00:25:28 Speaker 3: Yeah. 00:25:28 Speaker 2: Well, again. 00:25:30 Speaker 1: What if ownership said, well, if you want to keep your job, he stays for the season. 00:25:34 Speaker 2: And that might have been what they said. 00:25:36 Speaker 1: It wouldn't be the first time Jerry's put his job priority in high up there. 00:25:43 Speaker 3: Yeah. 00:25:44 Speaker 2: Well, look back to two years ago when Scott got fired at the end of August in 24. Yeah. 00:25:49 Speaker 3: Yep. 00:25:50 Speaker 2: Same thing. But a weight has been lifted off our shoulders today. Everybody's shoulders. Weight has been lifted. 00:25:58 Speaker 1: Yeah. 00:25:59 Speaker 2: We made it. 00:26:02 Speaker 1: Okay. Okay. 00:26:02 Speaker 2: Well, that just about wraps up this edition of the Marine Layer Podcast. You guys know the drill. If you want to listen to the full-form podcast, you can do so wherever you get your audio pods. Download these episodes if you're listening. Make sure to rate and review five stars. Go hit subscribe on YouTube if you're watching. It really, really helps support the channel if you do. You can also find everything at our website, which is marinelayerpod.com. You can find all of our merch there, our Patreons there. All of our episodes are there. That's at marinelayerpod.com. And then find us across social media. We're everywhere at marinelayerpod. That's TJ. I'm Lyle. As always, we thank you guys for tuning in. We'll talk to you soon.