Lyle and TJ react to Jorge Polanco signing with the Mets, and whether or not it was a good idea for the Mariners to match that price (2:30). They then discuss the Mariners being one of the two teams in discussion to acquire Brendan Donovan, and if that pivot is enough (13:35).
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00:00 --> 00:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Welcome to episode number 337 of the Marine Layer.
00:03 --> 00:09 [SPEAKER_01]: Podcast will react to Jorge Polanco spurning the Mariners and signing with the New York Metz.
00:09 --> 00:19 [SPEAKER_01]: There's also some reports out there that the Mariners have turned their focus to bring in Donovan will debate whether or not the proposed prospects and the idea of Donovan makes sense for the Mariners.
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00:42 --> 00:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's get it rolling.
00:57 --> 01:16 [SPEAKER_01]: And we welcome you to this episode of the Marine Lair podcast part of the just baseball podcast network recording here on Sunday evening December 14th and when I woke up on Saturday morning the last thing I was expecting to see is Jorge Polanco and the New York Mets that is not what I was expecting.
01:16 --> 01:18 [SPEAKER_01]: I wake up and I'm shocked.
01:19 --> 01:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I was.
01:21 --> 01:34 [SPEAKER_00]: I was pretty shocked, I was trying to use a different word, but I had my mouth open when I got the report after waking up because I thought to myself, really the nets, the nets of all teams, but yeah.
01:35 --> 01:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Like it makes sense, think about it after the fact that Mets had had a bad week, they let Diaz walk out the door, they'd let Alonzo walk out the door, and they were in need of offense, they were in need of an upgrade to the roster, and they found one in Jorge Polanco, but not only did they find one, I mean, they overpaid for him, they bid above what every reported price was for Jorge Polanco.
02:00 --> 02:04 [SPEAKER_01]: We had speculated that Jorge Polanco's price could have been as low as $12 million.
02:05 --> 02:10 [SPEAKER_01]: The Seattle Times had reported the bidding was between $15 and $17 million a year.
02:11 --> 02:15 [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't think he was getting $20 million a year.
02:16 --> 02:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Like talk to us, like at the beginning of like the middle of November, in the middle of the offseason or even at the start of the winter meetings.
02:23 --> 02:28 [SPEAKER_01]: And you said, guys, the cost to sign Jorge Polanco is $20 million a year.
02:29 --> 02:30 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm out.
02:30 --> 02:31 [SPEAKER_00]: 20 million?
02:32 --> 02:34 [SPEAKER_01]: No.
02:34 --> 02:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm.
02:34 --> 02:36 [SPEAKER_00]: I would have been pretty shocked.
02:36 --> 02:45 [SPEAKER_00]: I bet you this came together in the last couple of days to be honest with you because when we were at the Winter Meetings, I think we had a sense that it had a pretty decent chance to get done.
02:45 --> 02:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Nothing's a guarantee, but it felt like things were trending in the right direction.
02:49 --> 02:53 [SPEAKER_00]: And when you talked to Jeff Passen, who was on Brock and Salk a few days prior,
02:54 --> 02:56 [SPEAKER_00]: I can't remember exactly when he said it.
02:56 --> 02:57 [SPEAKER_00]: It was at some point during the offsies.
02:58 --> 03:00 [SPEAKER_00]: I think it was during the week of the winter meetings.
03:00 --> 03:03 [SPEAKER_00]: He thought Polanko's price would be between $15 and $17 million a year.
03:04 --> 03:08 [SPEAKER_00]: Which is again, still a decent chunk of change, but it's not $20 million a year.
03:09 --> 03:21 [SPEAKER_00]: This to me feels like the Metz after losing Eddie, and especially after losing Peter Lanzo, pivoted very fast and threw a number in Jorge Polanko and his camp that they just could not refuse.
03:21 --> 03:22 [SPEAKER_01]: They were desperate.
03:22 --> 03:24 [SPEAKER_01]: and so that's have been desperate under Steve Cohen.
03:24 --> 03:29 [SPEAKER_01]: They have given absurd amounts of money to players out of desperation.
03:29 --> 03:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
03:30 --> 03:35 [SPEAKER_00]: And when you think about the fact that Peter Lanzo signed on that Wednesday,
03:35 --> 03:50 [SPEAKER_00]: It feels like considering we got the Polanco news early Saturday morning in that 48-ish hour stretch, it feels like that's when it came together because again, through most of the winter meetings, we had a decent, I shouldn't say we knew it was going to get done.
03:50 --> 03:54 [SPEAKER_00]: That's certainly not what we're saying, but it felt like things were trending in the right direction.
03:54 --> 03:54 [SPEAKER_00]: That's for sure.
03:55 --> 04:01 [SPEAKER_00]: But then all of a sudden, we leave the winter meetings on Wednesday night, we turn around Saturday morning, Polanco's a met.
04:01 --> 04:08 [SPEAKER_00]: It feels like in that range of time, once Petalons of Side Elsewhere in Baltimore, that's when it all happened.
04:09 --> 04:22 [SPEAKER_01]: The reporting was that the Mariners offered a very competitive offer and I don't doubt they did for how they've operated this off season, they have made, they've put their best foot forward when trying to sign their guys back and they're by their guys.
04:22 --> 04:31 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, Josh Nailer, who they already signed to a five-year deal at a very, very good
04:31 --> 04:49 [SPEAKER_01]: And then for Polanco, I feel like the Mariners offered Jorge Polanco a two-year deal for $15 million a year with a vesting option for a third year, which would have been in total to your contract for $30 million perhaps maxes out at $42 million with the vesting option, right?
04:49 --> 04:51 [SPEAKER_01]: I feel like that's a reasonable amount.
04:52 --> 05:03 [SPEAKER_00]: for sure, but when you're getting $20 million a year, $20 million a year in terms of A, A, V, and for last years, which gives you a chance to hit the market again sooner, if he has another couple of good seasons.
05:04 --> 05:09 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, if you're pull on, go and like his camp said, you're going to take the deal that was the most money.
05:09 --> 05:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Even though it was reported that the Mariners were his number one choice that he wanted to be back in Seattle.
05:14 --> 05:15 [SPEAKER_01]: How often do you see that?
05:16 --> 05:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Guy signs somewhere else.
05:17 --> 05:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Report instantly comes out and says,
05:23 --> 05:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I don't think that's that surprising yet.
05:25 --> 05:30 [SPEAKER_00]: It's number one choice was to be back with the team that he was playing with that team didn't give him enough money.
05:30 --> 05:31 [SPEAKER_01]: It's not.
05:31 --> 05:32 [SPEAKER_01]: It's just kind of surprising.
05:32 --> 05:33 [SPEAKER_01]: We actually see that come out.
05:33 --> 05:36 [SPEAKER_01]: That's usually feels like things that stay under the radar.
05:37 --> 05:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Like we find out after the fact.
05:38 --> 05:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh yeah, Polanco's number one choice was the Mariners, but that's something we learn off the record as opposed to Adam Jew tweeting it right after he signs.
05:47 --> 05:56 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, to be fair, as great as Freddie Freeman's been with the Dodgers, everybody found out he wanted to be back with the Braves, and that was his number one choice, and it didn't happen.
05:56 --> 05:57 [SPEAKER_00]: His agent mess that up.
05:57 --> 06:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, is this an instance of the Mariners chipping out?
06:03 --> 06:06 [SPEAKER_00]: No, but it makes things very hard the rest of this offseason.
06:07 --> 06:07 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not going to lie.
06:07 --> 06:15 [SPEAKER_00]: I understand if you don't want to pay the $20 million a year for Jorge Palago, but with him now not back in the fold.
06:17 --> 06:22 [SPEAKER_00]: I think this, I think this can throw a real wrench into what the rest of this off season is gonna look like.
06:23 --> 06:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Because you only have limited money left to spend and I really, really don't love the idea of giving up legit prospects for somebody like Brendan Donovan or Brandon Lau who are good, but I don't look at them as needle movers and we can get into that more later.
06:41 --> 06:46 [SPEAKER_00]: But I don't, I, I don't think this is a sense
06:46 --> 06:53 [SPEAKER_00]: But I also don't really say with confidence that I know what their backup plan is.
06:54 --> 07:02 [SPEAKER_01]: At the, at the Mariners offered the money, though, to actually sign Jorge Polanco, which I would imagine would need to have been matching the Met's offer.
07:02 --> 07:05 [SPEAKER_01]: The Mariners would have needed to offer two years for $40 million dollars.
07:06 --> 07:08 [SPEAKER_01]: That takes them out of everything else for the soft season.
07:09 --> 07:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Does that make you feel any better?
07:11 --> 07:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Because you say the road is hard right now, but the road would have been hard if you sign Jorge Planco to that number and you had no money to add perhaps additional starters.
07:20 --> 07:24 [SPEAKER_01]: You had no money to add to your bullpen and you had no money to get that second bat you said that we need.
07:24 --> 07:25 [SPEAKER_01]: The Mariners need.
07:25 --> 07:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, now they especially need two bats.
07:29 --> 07:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Now with the situation that they have been dealt, they need two bats.
07:32 --> 07:38 [SPEAKER_00]: You could have argued just Planco could be enough if you bring him back
07:38 --> 07:45 [SPEAKER_00]: letting Colt Emerson try and run with the job at third base of the earns it would be how they run out their 26 roster.
07:45 --> 07:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Now, look, I know Donovan's good, but now more than ever, I really think they need two bats.
07:52 --> 08:13 [SPEAKER_01]: Let's let's hold off the dawn of in conversation because we're going to talk about the the reports that said the mariners are one of two teams that are actively talking to the cardinals about a kady we reported that Yesterday that the mariners were in on that and there's some prospects to go around with that too lots of names very good reporting there that we'll discuss here in a second, but I'll say this
08:13 --> 08:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Now that the Mariners are out on Polanco, the true upgrade options you can have on your infields are now this.
08:20 --> 08:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Brennan Donovan, Brennan Lau, Babushet, Alex pregnant.
08:24 --> 08:30 [SPEAKER_01]: If you want to add impact on your infield with the Mariners said, we want to upgrade the bats on our infield.
08:30 --> 08:32 [SPEAKER_01]: Those are the four guys remaining.
08:32 --> 08:33 [SPEAKER_01]: That will actually upgrade it.
08:34 --> 08:46 [SPEAKER_01]: You could sort of lock into an upgrade by signing somebody else, but it's not a first-year thing because the drop-off between those four guys and all the other options that are available that we know are available is pretty steep.
08:48 --> 09:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and I'd love to sit here and say the Mariners could get in on some of the sweepstakes of the free agents, but see, again, I'm not going to kill him for not giving Polanko $20 million a year because you're right, the Met's overpaid for that.
09:02 --> 09:07 [SPEAKER_00]: What makes me roll my eyes is they're not even going to consider those other ones.
09:07 --> 09:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Those other guys because I think we know that Breiglin reports bullshit even if it's not.
09:11 --> 09:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, sorry, the report is not bullshit.
09:13 --> 09:15 [SPEAKER_00]: What what Adam June Ryan Davis heard.
09:15 --> 09:16 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm sure as legit.
09:16 --> 09:24 [SPEAKER_00]: What I think it's bullshit is Alex Breiglin actually having a chance to put pen to paper with the Mariners and if that's the case, then
09:25 --> 09:25 [SPEAKER_00]: What's left?
09:25 --> 09:33 [SPEAKER_00]: You have to trade legit prospects for bats, and those teams know that you're going to be desperate for offense, so they could try to get you out the price.
09:35 --> 09:38 [SPEAKER_00]: You could, but is that what the final price is going to be?
09:38 --> 09:39 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.
09:39 --> 09:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Again, this, it's just, this is why Polonka made so much sense.
09:43 --> 09:44 [SPEAKER_00]: He fit the roster so well.
09:45 --> 09:46 [SPEAKER_00]: He was in your budget.
09:46 --> 09:47 [SPEAKER_00]: You know he can be really good.
09:47 --> 09:48 [SPEAKER_00]: You know he in your budget.
09:49 --> 09:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I guess your thought he was going to be in your budget at the end of the day probably wasn't.
09:53 --> 09:56 [SPEAKER_00]: But like, are they going to go get a legit bullpen arm still too?
09:56 --> 10:06 [SPEAKER_00]: I hope so because if you're, if you're not going to pay Polonka the 20 million a year, I hope you are using your remaining offseason budget to go get a couple of bats and find a way
10:07 --> 10:14 [SPEAKER_01]: In the next couple of weeks, I'm not going to be shocked if the Mariners go out there and they acquire Brennan Donovan and they get that final right-handed reliever and then they call it an off-season.
10:15 --> 10:16 [SPEAKER_01]: That would be good.
10:16 --> 10:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Their offense would still be a bat short, but of course during the course of a season, you can always get that bat at the deadline.
10:23 --> 10:24 [SPEAKER_01]: It's what the Mariners did last off-season.
10:24 --> 10:27 [SPEAKER_01]: It's not a very reliable strategy, but...
10:27 --> 10:32 [SPEAKER_01]: If you acquire Brendan Donovan, then you have that fifth bat of your sort of quote unquote core.
10:32 --> 10:35 [SPEAKER_01]: He's your fifth and fifth best bat you have in your lineup.
10:35 --> 10:40 [SPEAKER_01]: And then you go acquire that sixth bat of the deadline when you get a better sense of guys that are available.
10:40 --> 10:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Wow, potentially a bat like Jorge Polanco, the meds aren't very good.
10:45 --> 10:46 [SPEAKER_00]: I'll stamp this.
10:47 --> 10:49 [SPEAKER_00]: I know Metz fans weren't happy when I said it this week.
10:49 --> 10:50 [SPEAKER_00]: No, they were not.
10:50 --> 10:51 [SPEAKER_01]: No, they would not be with you.
10:51 --> 10:57 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, do you think that has more to do with the fact that they've had a really brutal week?
10:57 --> 11:05 [SPEAKER_00]: And then when they immediately see that the guy that they've just side in free agency is being floated out there to be traded in three months that they're not three months in six months.
11:05 --> 11:06 [SPEAKER_00]: They're not happy about it.
11:06 --> 11:07 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that's what it is.
11:07 --> 11:10 [SPEAKER_01]: If someone didn't see it, can you remind the people what you suggested?
11:10 --> 11:12 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I basically set or not, basically.
11:13 --> 11:22 [SPEAKER_00]: I said that if the Metz are not good by the deadline, I think there's a real chance Jorge Polanco gets traded, and I think there's a real chance that the Mariners would just trade back from.
11:22 --> 11:25 [SPEAKER_00]: It would require the Metz to eat some of that money, don't get me wrong.
11:25 --> 11:29 [SPEAKER_00]: I still don't think the Mariners in a trade would take on $20 million a year.
11:29 --> 11:36 [SPEAKER_00]: But if the Metz eats some of the money, I think you could see Jorge Polanco back at a Mariners uniform, if the Metz are not good in 2026.
11:37 --> 11:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Because on a two-year deal,
11:38 --> 11:40 [SPEAKER_00]: That's a tradable contract.
11:40 --> 11:49 [SPEAKER_00]: If you'd signed a four-year deal to different story, for two years just like Justin Verlander when the met signed him and then traded him back to Houston a few months later, it's a tradable contract.
11:49 --> 12:00 [SPEAKER_00]: If the met's are not good and right now the roster's very, very meddling, I think there's a world you could see him back with Mariners.
12:02 --> 12:03 [SPEAKER_00]: finding that level of offense.
12:04 --> 12:08 [SPEAKER_00]: And I know you're not guaranteed to get it from Polanco himself this year, but I don't know man.
12:09 --> 12:13 [SPEAKER_00]: I feel it felt like something really clicked last year for me was healthy kind of strike out right down.
12:13 --> 12:15 [SPEAKER_00]: He was on top of everything.
12:15 --> 12:18 [SPEAKER_00]: He like his power stroke was back.
12:19 --> 12:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Donovan's just not that.
12:20 --> 12:21 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm sorry.
12:21 --> 12:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe we're trying not to talk about Donovan yet, but that's my biggest worry.
12:26 --> 12:41 [SPEAKER_01]: that year though for plenco is such an outlier like he's been good in his past years but he's not been that offensive player he had never been that level of offensive player before in his whole career he could do it again with the mats he could have done it again with the mariners but it's not for sure
12:41 --> 12:56 [SPEAKER_01]: like none of these are for sure none of these guys that you're going out there and getting are for sure and by the way for all these other remaining options none of them have the injury history like plonco does and none of them outside of boba shed have the positional restrictions like plonco does.
12:58 --> 13:00 [SPEAKER_00]: It's true it's totally fair.
13:01 --> 13:04 [SPEAKER_00]: And maybe for that reason, people will make a case for Brendan Donovan.
13:04 --> 13:11 [SPEAKER_00]: He just, Jorge Polanco feels a little bit more like a line up lengthener to me than Donovan.
13:11 --> 13:16 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not saying Donovan's a bad player, he's actually, he's a good player and we'll talk about him.
13:17 --> 13:22 [SPEAKER_00]: But he's not an offensive needle mover in my mind.
13:22 --> 13:26 [SPEAKER_00]: When you mention him as the fifth bat toward the top of your line up,
13:27 --> 13:32 [SPEAKER_00]: that doesn't strike total fear into my eyes and I don't know if it strikes total fear into an opponent's eyes.
13:32 --> 13:34 [SPEAKER_00]: The way the parko did in the second half of last year.
13:36 --> 13:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Let's talk about Donovan then because we're sort of dancing around the subject.
13:39 --> 13:44 [SPEAKER_01]: So the report comes out that the murders are one of two teams that are interested in Brennan Donovan.
13:44 --> 13:46 [SPEAKER_01]: It's themselves and the giants.
13:47 --> 13:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Donovan is not going to have this type of offensive season that Jorge Polanco had last season.
13:55 --> 13:56 [SPEAKER_01]: He does not have that kind of power.
13:57 --> 13:59 [SPEAKER_01]: He does not have that sort of offensive ceiling.
14:00 --> 14:14 [SPEAKER_01]: But if you look at the two of them for their career, Brennan Donovan in half the seasons, less than half the seasons that Jorge Planck was played in Major League Baseball, has the same amount of two more seasons on a year to year average.
14:14 --> 14:18 [SPEAKER_01]: He averages more war per season than Jorge Planck who does.
14:18 --> 14:24 [SPEAKER_01]: by WRC Plus, he's seven points better than Jorge Polanco in his career on average.
14:24 --> 14:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Jorge Polanco is a 112 WRC Plus hitter in his career.
14:29 --> 14:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Brandon Donovan is one-nineteen.
14:30 --> 14:32 [SPEAKER_01]: They get their different ways.
14:32 --> 14:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Polanco has showed that with his switch hitting ability, with his power, his little bit more ceiling to offer.
14:39 --> 14:48 [SPEAKER_01]: But with the fact that Jorge Polanco struggles to stay healthy, struggles to stay in the field, I did get a chuckle that people were saying the match are going to put them all over the infield for them.
14:48 --> 14:49 [SPEAKER_01]: That's not going to happen.
14:49 --> 14:53 [SPEAKER_01]: He's going to play first base and he's going to de-H. Donovan meanwhile can play out field.
14:53 --> 14:54 [SPEAKER_01]: He can play second.
14:54 --> 14:55 [SPEAKER_01]: He can play third.
14:56 --> 15:02 [SPEAKER_01]: And his floor is much higher offensively as he has shown in his career and he doesn't have the same injury issues.
15:05 --> 15:07 [SPEAKER_00]: He's safer, but the ceiling's not there.
15:08 --> 15:09 [SPEAKER_00]: It's just not.
15:10 --> 15:10 [SPEAKER_00]: That's part of the worry.
15:11 --> 15:23 [SPEAKER_00]: And you know what else is to, if you want to talk about some of my concern with losing Polanco, is the development of your young players, which still is important in 26, even when you're trying to win, developing your young players is still important.
15:24 --> 15:28 [SPEAKER_00]: What Jorge Polanco did with his position is he was going to be the primary DH.
15:28 --> 15:34 [SPEAKER_00]: He'd mix in its second base when you had to have him do so, but primarily he was just going to be your DH.
15:34 --> 15:35 [SPEAKER_00]: What happens with Donovan?
15:35 --> 15:38 [SPEAKER_00]: He or D-H, I don't know if he is.
15:38 --> 15:42 [SPEAKER_00]: And if he's playing second base all the time, what happens with Cole Young?
15:44 --> 15:46 [SPEAKER_01]: you rotate guys around.
15:46 --> 15:56 [SPEAKER_01]: There's an opportunity for Donovan to play more outfield because as we've mentioned, the Mariners are also probably an outfield or short, especially proven outfielders.
15:56 --> 16:06 [SPEAKER_01]: They have two proven guys in Randy and Julio, and then right field is guys who have been good in spurts in their career, but not overly consistent.
16:06 --> 16:09 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I guess Donovan plays a decent amount of left field and has.
16:09 --> 16:18 [SPEAKER_00]: So in that way, if you want to have some days where you put Donovan in left and then you have Randy D H, you could do that, but then that opens up for coal.
16:18 --> 16:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, exactly.
16:19 --> 16:21 [SPEAKER_00]: I just don't know how to play this video.
16:21 --> 16:23 [SPEAKER_00]: What's that, uh, he's put a little bit of right field.
16:23 --> 16:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I just don't want to see Cole Young's development get blocked because it's important as it is for this team to win in 2026, the development of Cole to Emerson and Cole Young is going to be very important this year.
16:36 --> 16:37 [SPEAKER_00]: So you have to let him play to do that.
16:38 --> 16:40 [SPEAKER_00]: If they're playing twice a week, you can't do that.
16:41 --> 16:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Palanco gave Cole Young the avenue to continue to develop.
16:45 --> 16:47 [SPEAKER_00]: I wouldn't do so as much.
16:47 --> 16:53 [SPEAKER_01]: What if the Mariners decision then is to put Brennan Donovan at third base instead?
16:53 --> 16:57 [SPEAKER_00]: That's fine, but he actually hasn't played a ton of third base over the last couple years.
16:57 --> 17:00 [SPEAKER_01]: And he didn't play a single game at third base this year.
17:01 --> 17:04 [SPEAKER_00]: He is mostly been a second basemen and a mix in and left field.
17:07 --> 17:07 [SPEAKER_01]: It's possible.
17:07 --> 17:11 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, the Mariners asked Jorge Planco had never played third base before to play third base last year.
17:11 --> 17:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Didn't work out, but Brennan Donovan is much younger and
17:15 --> 17:17 [SPEAKER_01]: better, better defender than Jorge Polanco is.
17:17 --> 17:23 [SPEAKER_00]: It's always possible if you were to start the year with Brennan out of him playing third base, I would feel better about it.
17:23 --> 17:41 [SPEAKER_00]: If you trade for Donovan and say, hey, you're going to spend most of your time at third base, I would feel a little bit better about it filling up, filling out your lineup and looking at your defensive alignment because what that does is it does not force Colt Emerson onto the roster, it lets Colt young continue to develop its second base and you can move Donovan around when you need to.
17:41 --> 17:48 [SPEAKER_01]: And when Colt comes up, then you just figure out how you're going to get your nine best players on the field.
17:48 --> 17:52 [SPEAKER_01]: And you're not going to be deficient at any position by having your nine best players out there.
17:52 --> 17:56 [SPEAKER_01]: One day, Colt Young DHS and Brennan, Donovan, play second base.
17:57 --> 18:00 [SPEAKER_01]: One day, Colt Emerson DHS and Brennan, Donovan, play third base.
18:00 --> 18:09 [SPEAKER_01]: One day, Randy Arozerana DHS and you put Brennan Donovan and left field or maybe you put Brennan, Donovan in right field and you DHS, Dom
18:09 --> 18:13 [SPEAKER_01]: There are ways to make this work with Brennan Donovan.
18:13 --> 18:19 [SPEAKER_01]: That's why he offers you more versatility than Jorge Polanco does.
18:19 --> 18:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Meanwhile, if you have Jorge Polanco, and let's say Cal gets kind of beat up during the year and he needs to de-hate a little bit more, Jorge Polanco's already playing there.
18:27 --> 18:29 [SPEAKER_01]: And then you get a little bit more of a situation.
18:30 --> 18:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Unfortunately for Cal, this is when having Harry Fordwood.
18:35 --> 18:42 [SPEAKER_01]: perhaps help him a little bit, because Andrew Kinsner, Kinsner, who's not very good at really anything.
18:43 --> 18:49 [SPEAKER_01]: It's not somebody I want in there catching more than one time a week, maybe one time every other week.
18:49 --> 18:52 [SPEAKER_01]: That's where it gets a little bit trickier when you're trying to DH cow.
18:52 --> 18:55 [SPEAKER_00]: and it's how cow could get run into the ground.
18:55 --> 19:02 [SPEAKER_00]: By signing Andrew Kisner by the way, we're not gonna spend all the time in the world on him, but if you miss it this weekend, the Mariners found their new backup catcher.
19:02 --> 19:09 [SPEAKER_00]: It's Andrew Kisner, he's bounced around in his career, he spends some time with the giants, he spends some time with the cardinals, he spends some time with the Rangers, few different teams.
19:10 --> 19:13 [SPEAKER_00]: It appears this is who the Mariners backup catcher is gonna be.
19:14 --> 19:16 [SPEAKER_00]: He ain't much of an offensive player.
19:16 --> 19:17 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's put it like that in 20 minutes.
19:17 --> 19:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Really.
19:18 --> 19:39 [SPEAKER_00]: No, like he apparently blocks better and changed his framing a little bit over I think it's his framing that not as blocking his framing over the last couple years has gotten better and that was documented online but I don't think he has a great arm He's not gonna hit much this feels like somebody where Yeah, you're leaning into having your best player be your catcher.
19:40 --> 19:41 [SPEAKER_00]: The problem is
19:42 --> 19:44 [SPEAKER_00]: This is how Calth's gonna get run into the ground again.
19:44 --> 19:46 [SPEAKER_00]: And
19:47 --> 19:55 [SPEAKER_00]: You're going to have to either swallow that, or you're going to have to let Andrew Kisner play a decent amount, which I don't know if anybody wants.
19:56 --> 20:04 [SPEAKER_01]: The problem is it was either that, or it was if you wanted a legit backup catcher who was actually good, you had to pay $7 million for Danny Jansson.
20:04 --> 20:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Right, and the mariners were never going to do that.
20:06 --> 20:12 [SPEAKER_00]: You're not going to spend $7 million bucks a year on a position where you're best player, and arguably the best player in the league last year.
20:12 --> 20:15 [SPEAKER_00]: is manning that position on a two year deal, by the way.
20:16 --> 20:23 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, two years for just over 14 million bucks for Danny Johnson, who on one of our most recent episodes, we threw out there as an idea for the bearer to bring in his backup catcher.
20:24 --> 20:26 [SPEAKER_00]: But he was pricey, so they weren't going to do it.
20:27 --> 20:31 [SPEAKER_00]: This is one of the areas they're going to have to sacrifice, but back to Brennan Donovan,
20:32 --> 20:49 [SPEAKER_00]: If they are going to bring him in and say you're going to play third base, I will admit I'd feel a little bit better because along with letting Cole young develop and along with having that position filled and not having to necessarily rely on Ben Williams in for that, it also doesn't force Cole to Emerson on to the roster on opening day.
20:50 --> 20:59 [SPEAKER_00]: If he earns it, great, if he goes off in spring training and it's his job, fine, then
21:01 --> 21:11 [SPEAKER_00]: do not want to see and frankly cannot and frankly cannot like swallow the idea of seeing cold Emerson being another Jared Kelnik.
21:11 --> 21:24 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not saying he's going to be like that production wise, but the idea of throwing him onto the roster because the rest of it is not complete enough that you're putting ridiculous pressure on the guy is not fair and it's not right for his development.
21:24 --> 21:25 [SPEAKER_00]: So I don't want to see that.
21:25 --> 21:28 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think that's the situation the Mariners are in.
21:28 --> 21:34 [SPEAKER_01]: I think the Mariners in their current state even without bread and Donovan are perfectly fine leaving Colt Emerson off the roster.
21:35 --> 21:40 [SPEAKER_01]: They've essentially stated that Ben Williamson, they view him as a big leaker.
21:41 --> 21:42 [SPEAKER_01]: If you were in that he would play a third.
21:43 --> 21:46 [SPEAKER_01]: He might not be good enough in our eyes, but the Mariners have set that.
21:47 --> 21:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, there's a difference between a big leader and a big league starter.
21:51 --> 21:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Ben Williamson was more than 20% below league average of the hitter last year.
21:55 --> 21:57 [SPEAKER_00]: He doesn't know.
21:57 --> 22:00 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like I'm not defending his production.
22:00 --> 22:19 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm just saying this the two the teams two teams are referencing Our significantly different or 2021 Mariners with Jared Kellenik who rolled out the worst offense in baseball before they call them up and asked him to save save the roster Meanwhile the Mariners right now have at least four all star caliber bats in their lineup
22:20 --> 22:23 [SPEAKER_00]: No, but you're, it's the similar idea with the position.
22:23 --> 22:29 [SPEAKER_00]: You're not asking him to save a whole offense, but you're asking him to do a lot when he has not played a lot of games above Avall.
22:30 --> 22:32 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm just saying him will think they'd be asking.
22:32 --> 22:33 [SPEAKER_00]: He's not even to play third base.
22:33 --> 22:36 [SPEAKER_00]: If you had done him into play third base, he is not forced onto the roster early.
22:36 --> 22:39 [SPEAKER_00]: You let him develop and when he's ready, he's ready.
22:40 --> 22:47 [SPEAKER_00]: If, if you did not find somebody to play third base early on in the year, he is going to, again,
22:48 --> 22:52 [SPEAKER_00]: you may put him on the big league roster on opening day because you're going to deem him your best option.
22:52 --> 22:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Even if he needs a little more development time.
22:56 --> 22:56 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's not fair to him.
22:56 --> 23:00 [SPEAKER_01]: The Mariners need another bat.
23:00 --> 23:04 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think right now they're forced to put Colt Emerson on the roster.
23:04 --> 23:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, they're not forced to do anything.
23:06 --> 23:19 [SPEAKER_00]: But again, if they view him as the best option because they don't find anybody else at third days, if they view cold Emerson as better than Ben Williamson and they're ready to put him on the roster and by the way, another element to this now is
23:21 --> 23:27 [SPEAKER_00]: putting him on the roster by opening day to give him as good a chance as possible the win rookie of the year to get the extra draft pick.
23:27 --> 23:27 [SPEAKER_00]: That's a real thing.
23:27 --> 23:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Now remember what happened with Julio when he won rookie of the year.
23:31 --> 23:32 [SPEAKER_00]: He was up on opening day.
23:32 --> 23:38 [SPEAKER_00]: He won rookie of the year and the Mariners got that PPI pick, which allowed them to take Johnny Farmello.
23:40 --> 23:41 [SPEAKER_00]: That plays a factor now.
23:42 --> 23:47 [SPEAKER_00]: If they think Cold Emerson is borderline ready, it's another reason they could have them on the roster early.
23:47 --> 23:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Whether he's ready or not.
23:50 --> 23:56 [SPEAKER_01]: What about the prospects that were reported that the Cardinals were looking at, that they named two of them, Katie did.
23:57 --> 24:06 [SPEAKER_01]: One of them is Gerangelo Sanger, and the other one is Lazaro Montes, is are those prospects you'd be comfortable letting go for brand out of it.
24:08 --> 24:09 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if it matters what I think.
24:10 --> 24:28 [SPEAKER_00]: I think the Mariners have to find more offense the rest of this offseason and those may be your remaining options because they're not gonna get serious about the S tier free agents and maybe forced to trade for guys and the two guys that seem to be out there for trade are Brennan, Donovan, and Brennan Low and Donovan's probably the better batter than two.
24:29 --> 24:31 [SPEAKER_00]: you don't sound very comfortable trading.
24:32 --> 24:40 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I don't love the idea of trading to range a low, especially, or last, for somebody that, again, is good, but I don't know if he's great.
24:40 --> 24:41 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think he's a needle mover.
24:41 --> 24:43 [SPEAKER_00]: He's a good hitter, but not a needle mover.
24:44 --> 24:46 [SPEAKER_01]: But at some point, you have to use your resources.
24:47 --> 24:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Otherwise,
24:48 --> 25:17 [SPEAKER_01]: where are the spots for these guys you mentioned to me last potentially as a spot at the h he potentially does it the bat develops well hang on that right now is a year and a half away from the big leagues that's what i was going to say let's not twist the words here he eventually has a spot as a d eight not in twenty twenty six with our amount has needed at least another full year of the miners and if his bat is not ready for a year and a half I mean it's too bad he's been very great to us and I'm I love watching a play when he's
25:18 --> 25:24 [SPEAKER_01]: but like it's time to win in 2026 and the Mariners have so many prospects.
25:25 --> 25:34 [SPEAKER_01]: So many, you could argue that neither of those two are gonna get to the big leagues faster in their own form system at their own position.
25:35 --> 25:41 [SPEAKER_00]: I would swallow, I would swallow the idea of trading lads easier than I would d'Angelo St. Joe.
25:41 --> 25:43 [SPEAKER_00]: One because I think d'Angelo has a chance to be very good.
25:44 --> 25:51 [SPEAKER_00]: And number two, it is more the pitchers that I get nervous about trading because I say to myself, is Logan gonna sign an extension.
25:51 --> 25:52 [SPEAKER_00]: He's only got two years left.
25:52 --> 25:55 [SPEAKER_00]: It's Kirby gonna sign an extension.
25:55 --> 26:03 [SPEAKER_00]: no signs indicate that at this point, eventually Louise is going to age out, you need guys to be able to replace these pictures eventually.
26:03 --> 26:06 [SPEAKER_00]: And if you're going to trade pictures, I'm not saying I'm against it.
26:06 --> 26:17 [SPEAKER_00]: But if you were going to trade pictures out of your farm system that are very good, by the way, those are the guys that I hang onto a lot tighter and say, I'm not dealing them unless it's for
26:17 --> 26:19 [SPEAKER_00]: legitimate difference makers.
26:20 --> 26:23 [SPEAKER_00]: I just don't think Donovan is that again.
26:23 --> 26:23 [SPEAKER_00]: He's good.
26:23 --> 26:26 [SPEAKER_00]: He is like he's a piece in a line up that's going to make a team much better.
26:27 --> 26:36 [SPEAKER_00]: But to look at what Jorge Polanco did last year and try to replace it with Brendan Donovan, I just don't view those as the same level of impact.
26:36 --> 26:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Jorge Polanco, does he clutch his hit or in baseball last year?
26:40 --> 26:42 [SPEAKER_01]: You're right, but you and I see this totally differently.
26:42 --> 26:43 [SPEAKER_01]: I-
26:43 --> 26:48 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't have a problem trading the third best prospect at his own position in your system.
26:49 --> 26:53 [SPEAKER_01]: There are two guys in the Mariners' own farm system that they view higher than Duranjlo.
26:54 --> 27:01 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's not to knock Duranjlo at all because he's excellent, his fastball is unbelievable, his slider is a right hander, is phenomenal.
27:01 --> 27:05 [SPEAKER_01]: but Kate Anderson and Ryan Sloan are ranked higher than Drangelow.
27:05 --> 27:10 [SPEAKER_01]: Any prospect evaluator, any person in the Mariners system, would tell you that.
27:10 --> 27:21 [SPEAKER_01]: So if you're not willing to trade that level of prospect to upgrade your current roster that will impact you today, not what Drangelow could potentially do in July and August,
27:21 --> 27:29 [SPEAKER_01]: to like supplement an injury and then sit him back down to the miners and maybe have him throw 25 bigly giddings.
27:29 --> 27:30 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm sorry.
27:30 --> 27:35 [SPEAKER_01]: That's not selling me as opposed to getting two full years of Brennan Donovan.
27:37 --> 27:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Again, I may have to just accept it if it happens because the Mariners can't roll into the year with this current iteration of the offense.
27:45 --> 27:47 [SPEAKER_00]: You cannot be too bad short.
27:47 --> 27:56 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not going to be thrilled if they're one bad short, but if they go out and get a bat and get a bullpen arm the rest of the offseason, I think we'll give them plenty of credit for the offseason they'll have.
27:56 --> 28:04 [SPEAKER_00]: will be about short they'll be about short and again it'll worry me but they will have done at least enough to be plenty competitive in 2026.
28:04 --> 28:07 [SPEAKER_00]: They can't run out of this iteration of the offense right now.
28:08 --> 28:09 [SPEAKER_00]: and they have to find it.
28:10 --> 28:22 [SPEAKER_00]: So in the end, and at the end of the day, if this is what it costs to get Brendan Dottovan because the Cardinals know they have leverage and they know the Mariners need offense, sure I'm gonna have to accept it, doesn't mean I'm gonna love it.
28:23 --> 28:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Because again, like this is what the Mariners do best and could they draft another picture next year that turns into Durangelo, I guess.
28:31 --> 28:31 [SPEAKER_00]: But,
28:32 --> 28:45 [SPEAKER_00]: I would rather save those pitchers until you're ready to package them for somebody more impactful than Donovan, because if you're not going to trade slow in Anderson, because you view them as potential untouchable prospects, you got to trade pitchers at some point.
28:45 --> 28:59 [SPEAKER_00]: And if Durangelo's the prospect from the pitching side that you're more willing to dangle out there, I would much rather wait until you're ready to make much more of a blockbuster impact move for an offensive player than Brennan Donovan.
29:00 --> 29:04 [SPEAKER_01]: the way you're describing that, it sounds to me you'd only trade him for a Katell Marté.
29:07 --> 29:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, Katell's gotten really interesting because again, I just can't shake some of the stuff we heard about the winter meetings about some of that internal turmoil about him and Katell's the only real blue-trip trade piece out there.
29:20 --> 29:22 [SPEAKER_00]: If you're asking me, yes, I like,
29:23 --> 29:25 [SPEAKER_00]: You can tell Marta is who I would trade your Angela Sanger for.
29:26 --> 29:29 [SPEAKER_00]: I would prefer to not see him get dealt for Donovan.
29:29 --> 29:32 [SPEAKER_00]: If that's the price, I'm going to have to live with it.
29:32 --> 29:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Because at the end of the day, the Mariners have to prioritize 20-26 more than their prospects.
29:37 --> 29:44 [SPEAKER_00]: But this is where I sometimes roll my eyes about them totally ignoring the free agent market because free agents only cost money.
29:45 --> 29:50 [SPEAKER_00]: But it trades cost you legit prospects, especially now when people know they need offense.
29:50 --> 29:53 [SPEAKER_01]: It's fair, but both things require resources.
29:53 --> 30:01 [SPEAKER_01]: If you think about it in a resource perspective, the Mariners are more rich in prospect resources as opposed to monetary resources.
30:01 --> 30:03 [SPEAKER_01]: And therefore, they feel more comfortable.
30:03 --> 30:11 [SPEAKER_01]: spending their prospect resources, which is the entire reason you build up your farm system in the first place to trade in a choir.
30:11 --> 30:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Again, can I ask you this again, I've asked you this on this podcast, I'm asking this again.
30:15 --> 30:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Any prospect trade in the last four years have the Mariners regretted?
30:20 --> 30:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Is there one?
30:21 --> 30:21 [SPEAKER_00]: No.
30:23 --> 30:24 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, can I turn it back on you?
30:25 --> 30:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Sure.
30:25 --> 30:31 [SPEAKER_00]: They got two and a half years of ran to your rows of ran up for less than what your
30:31 --> 30:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Brody Hopkins, Aden Smith, Ty Cummings, Good Prospect, Aden Smith specifically, maybe really, really good down the line.
30:40 --> 30:46 [SPEAKER_00]: But they got more service time of Randy Rosarena, who is more of an impact bat when you're just talking about his offense.
30:46 --> 30:47 [SPEAKER_00]: Two more.
30:47 --> 30:53 [SPEAKER_00]: For less, then what's being floated out there right now, or sorry, for Rosarena, then what's being floated out there right now for Donovan?
30:54 --> 30:58 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think, first of all, I don't think the package is too different.
30:58 --> 31:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Like by prospect rankings, yes, both Brody Hopkins and Aiden Smith were borderline top 100 prospects.
31:07 --> 31:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Drain below is just inside the top 100 prospects in baseball and last, depending on the outlet is ranged anywhere from 30 to 80.
31:16 --> 31:18 [SPEAKER_01]: So like that also, I think counts for that.
31:18 --> 31:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Number two, Randy only had two more months of control than Brendan Donovan does.
31:23 --> 31:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Brendan Donovan, I feel like teams look at his versatility and his value that he brings, that could raise that ceiling potentially higher.
31:31 --> 31:35 [SPEAKER_01]: And also, finally, we don't know what the package is.
31:35 --> 31:36 [SPEAKER_01]: They haven't made a trade yet.
31:36 --> 31:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Like we're just speculating.
31:38 --> 31:42 [SPEAKER_01]: It could only be one of Dorangelo and Laz.
31:42 --> 32:11 [SPEAKER_01]: if it was just a ranch though you weren't trading last two you're just trading during the oil for bread and donovan you would say now i mean again i wouldn't love it oh were you under the impression that the idea of this trade was you'd have to trade both those guys in the last and out of it i figured it'd be one of the other and then i was going to i was going to propose it to you would you so i'd well i know the answer to this because you just answered it for me you would not trade both of these prospects are running donovan wouldn't be happy about it that's for sure
32:12 --> 32:14 [SPEAKER_00]: and you wouldn't even just trade your Angelou?
32:15 --> 32:18 [SPEAKER_00]: Again, if this is the price, it's about winning in 26.
32:18 --> 32:20 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not saying no, I wouldn't do it.
32:21 --> 32:22 [SPEAKER_00]: I am saying I wouldn't be thrilled about it.
32:23 --> 32:25 [SPEAKER_00]: And this is where the Polanco thing really bites them in the ass.
32:25 --> 32:28 [SPEAKER_00]: I know they couldn't do anything about the Met's giving him $20 million a year.
32:29 --> 32:37 [SPEAKER_00]: But this really bites them in the ass because you will be forced to potentially overpay in prospect capital for somebody who's good, but not great.
32:39 --> 32:44 [SPEAKER_01]: I, you and I just won't see this the same way because I have no problem trading prospects at this point.
32:44 --> 32:53 [SPEAKER_01]: The Mariners have their big league roster, they have lots of studs, they have better prospects in their own system at the same position that they would be trading from currently.
32:53 --> 33:04 [SPEAKER_01]: So therefore, I don't have a problem and guess what, the draft is going to happen again in another six and a half months or now where the Mariners will restock their farm system with more top 100 prospects.
33:04 --> 33:06 [SPEAKER_01]: So like that's just how it is.
33:07 --> 33:08 [SPEAKER_01]: That's how the cookie crumbles sometimes.
33:08 --> 33:11 [SPEAKER_01]: You're going to have to trade guys to upgrade your current roster.
33:11 --> 33:12 [SPEAKER_01]: That's how teams win.
33:12 --> 33:15 [SPEAKER_01]: There's going to be a team out there of Terriq school is available.
33:15 --> 33:17 [SPEAKER_01]: That is going to have to trade top 100 prospects to get him.
33:18 --> 33:22 [SPEAKER_01]: And I know Terriq school is a lot better than Brennan Donovan, but you're trading to add value.
33:22 --> 33:23 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's the cost of adding value.
33:24 --> 33:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Value is not free to your current roster.
33:29 --> 33:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Because they ignore free agency.
33:32 --> 33:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, they didn't ignore free agency.
33:33 --> 33:44 [SPEAKER_01]: They have a limit on free agency, who also don't buy that the players themselves would have any interest in coming to Seattle in the first place?
33:44 --> 33:44 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
33:44 --> 33:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Because if they can't get a long-term deal.
33:48 --> 33:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I mean, who the highest pay for the agency has before Josh Nailer?
33:53 --> 33:55 [SPEAKER_01]: Before Josh Nailer was Mitch Garver.
33:56 --> 33:57 [SPEAKER_01]: They ignore free agency.
34:00 --> 34:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, again, they are very rich in prospect resources.
34:05 --> 34:06 [SPEAKER_01]: They have a lot of them.
34:06 --> 34:09 [SPEAKER_01]: They might as well use it because there's not room for all of them.
34:12 --> 34:17 [SPEAKER_00]: I know, but I would rather see Dr. Angela package for somebody that's more impactful than Donovan at the end of the day.
34:17 --> 34:20 [SPEAKER_00]: If that's the price that you're going to have to live with it, and I'm going to have to stomach it.
34:21 --> 34:21 [SPEAKER_00]: But,
34:22 --> 34:28 [SPEAKER_00]: It's not the Mariners deciding not to pay polanco that I'm not stomaching well.
34:28 --> 34:33 [SPEAKER_00]: It's the ripple effect of what now is going to transpire that sits with me worse.
34:33 --> 34:36 [SPEAKER_00]: And I'm not even necessarily saying I'd give him $20 million a year.
34:36 --> 34:38 [SPEAKER_00]: It's more than me just being upset that
34:38 --> 34:55 [SPEAKER_00]: his value went up so high because now the mariners are in a tougher position and I know that's probably incentive to pull on to himself which by the way great great great great for him that he got that money because he earned it and he had a hell of a year last year and he's an amazing dude and I couldn't be happier for him.
34:55 --> 34:59 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm just not sitting as happy thinking about the mariners current situation with him gone.
35:01 --> 35:08 [SPEAKER_01]: If the Mariners were to attack for agency, I know there's only one player that fits the criteria that we've outlined that the Mariners need.
35:08 --> 35:15 [SPEAKER_01]: It would be Alex Braggman or Bust, or Cal Tucker, yeah, or Cal Tucker.
35:16 --> 35:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
35:17 --> 35:26 [SPEAKER_00]: By the way, a tune into Wednesday's podcast because by Wednesday, we're going to have some breaking Marie Lair pod news that we're going to need to share with everybody.
35:26 --> 35:28 [SPEAKER_00]: I promise you're not going to want to miss it.
35:29 --> 35:38 [SPEAKER_01]: It'll be worth it, but in terms of what they're actually looking for and what they feel like fits, it would be Alex Breckman to what I'll present like I talked about on the mailbag.
35:38 --> 35:41 [SPEAKER_01]: There are two ways you're going to sign Alex Breckman.
35:41 --> 35:51 [SPEAKER_01]: You're going to either hand him a contract for $40 million a year or you're going to hand him a contract of at least eight years at 31 years old at about $35 million a year.
35:53 --> 35:58 [SPEAKER_01]: You're better, you're better, but does that like work out?
35:59 --> 36:00 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
36:01 --> 36:02 [SPEAKER_01]: That's like, that's the sacrifice.
36:02 --> 36:07 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like giving up long-term prospect, cap, long-term prospect value.
36:07 --> 36:10 [SPEAKER_01]: You're giving up long-term monetary value as well.
36:11 --> 36:12 [SPEAKER_01]: There's had lots of one.
36:12 --> 36:14 [SPEAKER_01]: They publicly admit that they have lots of one.
36:14 --> 36:17 [SPEAKER_01]: And I'd like them to spend it, because that's how you go in a world series.
36:19 --> 36:19 [SPEAKER_01]: It's totally fair.
36:20 --> 36:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Again, I'm not saying I don't want to get pregnant and eight year deal either, but I would stomach giving them more money over the last years.
36:28 --> 36:32 [SPEAKER_01]: There's no free, no other free agents that would make you happy then.
36:32 --> 36:38 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think, not Boba Shet, like Boba Shet's really good, but you have no really, you know where to play him really.
36:39 --> 36:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Now, not without finding a plan B for Coyoung.
36:43 --> 36:44 [SPEAKER_00]: No, so.
36:45 --> 36:55 [SPEAKER_01]: It's just, it's not easy, which is why it makes it a lot easier for me to stomach trading derangelo for Brennan, Donovan, and like, Brennan, Donovan's a good player.
36:55 --> 36:56 [SPEAKER_01]: He is good.
36:56 --> 36:59 [SPEAKER_01]: He is a better, he is better than Jorge Polanco is.
37:00 --> 37:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, not last year, not last year, but over his career.
37:03 --> 37:07 [SPEAKER_01]: He is better than Jorge Polanco is, he's younger, he plays all over the place.
37:08 --> 37:14 [SPEAKER_01]: That is, that's the kind of person you're okay trading, trading a top 100 prospect for.
37:14 --> 37:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Like you, a two and a half win player who plays three, three plus positions is not worth the top 100 prospect, multiple years of control, not that expensive.
37:24 --> 37:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Again, there's the difference here.
37:26 --> 37:36 [SPEAKER_00]: I understand that if it, if it comes down to you either have Brennan Donovan or you don't, and this is their price, then yes, you have to do it because you don't have other options at this point.
37:37 --> 37:39 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm just saying I'm not going to be thrill trading Gerangelo away.
37:39 --> 37:44 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not saying I wouldn't do, again, it's like Patrick Star says this in one SpongeBob episode.
37:44 --> 37:47 [SPEAKER_00]: He goes, fine, I'll do it, but I'm not happy about it.
37:48 --> 37:54 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think the Mariners are a better baseball team if they keep Gerangelo's Sanger and pay Jorge Planco $20 million this year.
37:57 --> 38:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe not, but this Polanco thing really did fuck them.
38:00 --> 38:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, there's no other way to put it.
38:02 --> 38:03 [SPEAKER_00]: That was their plan.
38:03 --> 38:06 [SPEAKER_00]: That was their clear cut number one plan after Josh Nailer.
38:06 --> 38:11 [SPEAKER_00]: The market went crazy for him when the Met's offered him the deal they did, and now they're being forced to pivot.
38:13 --> 38:16 [SPEAKER_00]: Are you all like, again, the Mariners clearly were okay with bringing Polanco back.
38:17 --> 38:23 [SPEAKER_00]: They clearly said, if it's up to us, we don't necessarily have to trade prospects.
38:23 --> 38:25 [SPEAKER_00]: They would just go get Polanco back.
38:26 --> 38:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Are you okay trading LAS?
38:29 --> 38:31 [SPEAKER_00]: More so than Sanger, why?
38:32 --> 38:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Because he's much more polarizing.
38:34 --> 38:39 [SPEAKER_00]: And I know that answer is probably going to make a lot of fans really mad, because people love LAS, and for every good reason.
38:40 --> 38:53 [SPEAKER_00]: But when you are much further away from the big leagues and Sanger is, and you're still striking out 30% of the time and you don't really have a position and you don't great out well defensively and you don't great out much with speed.
38:54 --> 39:00 [SPEAKER_00]: For lads, I understand the 100th percentile outcome is being Kyle Schwerer, which is a fascinating prospect to dream on.
39:01 --> 39:07 [SPEAKER_00]: But when that's your set of tools,
39:08 --> 39:11 [SPEAKER_00]: you have to absolutely mash or you're not going to have value.
39:12 --> 39:13 [SPEAKER_00]: For Lizar a month has that big league value.
39:14 --> 39:18 [SPEAKER_00]: He is going to have to hit 30 plus homers a year in major league baseball.
39:18 --> 39:24 [SPEAKER_00]: And if the swing in this proves to be too much and it overwhelms them in the big leagues, then he doesn't have much value.
39:24 --> 39:25 [SPEAKER_00]: St. Joe has real value.
39:27 --> 39:33 [SPEAKER_01]: He's got the last as the highest ceiling in the system, but the lowest floor.
39:34 --> 39:48 [SPEAKER_01]: that's that's something I feel like if you're you're hedging you're okay with giving up given that you have other top hitting prospects in your system like Michael O'Royle that we've talked about not quite the ceiling but he's been ultra consistent and ultra good.
39:49 --> 40:12 [SPEAKER_01]: Your top prospect right now is considered one of the best hitters in the minors in Colt Emerson when you have those guys to come back on You feel a little bit better about it and not having a position and he It hurts him like that's really the spots he can play is if he eventually moves to first face It's first a corner outfield spot though not playing it very well or D.H.
40:13 --> 40:18 [SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't offer you a lot if he's not hitting right
40:18 --> 40:21 [SPEAKER_00]: which is why I'd be more okay with that one than Dr. Angela Sandoff.
40:22 --> 40:24 [SPEAKER_00]: You just need your need pitching depth.
40:24 --> 40:24 [SPEAKER_00]: You really do.
40:26 --> 40:28 [SPEAKER_00]: The Mariners have pitching depth though.
40:29 --> 40:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but he's got a chance to be more than depth.
40:31 --> 40:32 [SPEAKER_01]: He's got a chance to be really good.
40:34 --> 40:39 [SPEAKER_01]: We'll see what happens if the Mariners eventually trade for Brennan Donovan within the next couple of weeks.
40:39 --> 40:40 [SPEAKER_01]: We'll react to it.
40:40 --> 40:41 [SPEAKER_01]: We'll see what the package is.
40:42 --> 40:46 [SPEAKER_01]: It sounds like if it's going to be a trade, it's going to be for one of those two guys.
40:47 --> 40:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Now get the Mariners this.
40:49 --> 40:50 [SPEAKER_01]: Those two prospects.
40:50 --> 40:53 [SPEAKER_01]: They're offering up sound a lot better than the ones the giants are offering.
40:53 --> 40:55 [SPEAKER_01]: A lot higher upside.
40:55 --> 40:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Higher rated overall among the prospect ranking.
40:59 --> 41:03 [SPEAKER_01]: So we'll see.
41:03 --> 41:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Mariners, Mariners have pivoted and it seems like they have their guy and they're going to go try and acquire him now.
41:08 --> 41:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Odds are loud, they'll just make the trade on Christmas and, you know, it's going to throw a wrench into our plans, but, you know, that's fine.
41:16 --> 41:19 [SPEAKER_00]: And again, this is now just the hand they've been dealt.
41:19 --> 41:22 [SPEAKER_00]: You have to get better offensively in 2026.
41:22 --> 41:24 [SPEAKER_00]: Dot of it may be the best option out there.
41:24 --> 41:33 [SPEAKER_00]: And if you decide on that, you're eventually going to have to give up what the Cardinals want to get them.
41:34 --> 41:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but at least we got some some news this weekend, not the news we were expecting, but it's something, it is always something.
41:42 --> 41:44 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, it's something to talk about.
41:44 --> 41:45 [SPEAKER_00]: I just wish it was better news.
41:46 --> 41:46 [SPEAKER_00]: That's all.
41:46 --> 41:47 [SPEAKER_00]: I wish it was.
41:48 --> 41:50 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll have even better news on Wednesday to discuss.
41:50 --> 41:54 [SPEAKER_00]: No, we're going to have some great news on Wednesday to discuss.
41:55 --> 41:56 [SPEAKER_00]: People are going to be fired up.
41:57 --> 41:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Some people laugh.
41:58 --> 41:59 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm sure some people will roll their eyes.
42:00 --> 42:04 [SPEAKER_00]: But just wait, you'll want a
42:05 --> 42:08 [SPEAKER_00]: Alright, that's just about wraps up this edition of the Marine Lair podcast.
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42:43 --> 42:44 [SPEAKER_00]: That's TJ.
42:44 --> 42:45 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm Lyle.
42:45 --> 42:45 [SPEAKER_00]: It's always weird.
42:45 --> 42:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Thank you guys for tuning in.
42:47 --> 42:48 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll talk to you soon.