Episode 416: Reacting To The End Of A Bad Mariners Road Trip + How Will They Deal With These Injuries?

00:00:00 Speaker 1: Welcome to episode number four sixteen of the Marine Layer Podcast. The Mariners lose two of three in Washington and wrap up a four and six road trip. We'll give our takes as the Mariner's return home this week. 00:00:11 Speaker 2: A reminder to you guys before we start this podcast, just make sure you do us a big favor. Go download these episodes and please rate and review five stars if you're listening. If you're on YouTube and watching, make sure to go hit that subscribe button on YouTube and leave a comment in the comment section as well. On our website, all of our stuffs there too. That's marinelayerpod dot com. You can find our merch there. Our episodes are all there. Patreon is all there. We love being involved with you guys on the Patreon, so you can go sign up for that at our website again, that's marine layerpod dot com, and. 00:00:41 Speaker 3: Then find us on social media. 00:00:42 Speaker 2: We're posting content every day everywhere at Marine Layer Pod. 00:00:46 Speaker 1: Let's get it rolling. Hey, we welcome you to this episode of the Marine Layer Podcast, part of the Just Baseball podcast network, recording late Sunday night, June fourteenth. I'd say if there was a series for us to not be totally one hundred percent locked in and invested in and doing something else and celebrating something else. I would say it was this weekend because tuning into bits and pieces of this Sunday game sort of confermens like, Yeah, this might have been the one to miss. 00:01:27 Speaker 2: I gotta tell you, your voice sounds phenomenal. You sound like you're ready to take on the world. 00:01:32 Speaker 1: I was getting all fired up watching that game today. I mean, I was just I was just locked in. As soon as the Mariners took a one nothing lead. 00:01:41 Speaker 3: Sure, yeah, that's why your voice is gone. Yeah, let's go with that. 00:01:46 Speaker 1: Definitely that today was not great. The weekend for us was great. I'm like, if we're doing takeaways of TJ and Lyle's time down and down in Elsigo, No, it was fantastic, But I just don't think the Mariners can really relate to that. 00:02:00 Speaker 2: No, And yeah, southern California that being because we were in Manhattan Beach and that area. Bunch was Yeah, it was LA essentially, but like the beach aa LA. 00:02:10 Speaker 1: If we did try to do a podcast from there would have been a little chaotic. 00:02:14 Speaker 3: Yeah, maybe a little bit. 00:02:16 Speaker 2: By the way, if we want to avoid talking about the Mariners here for as long as possible after Yeah, you're right, which is another disaster of a series. 00:02:24 Speaker 3: Not a sweep, but not a good series by any stretch. 00:02:26 Speaker 2: In any way, I have a take from doing all this traveling, and maybe people are gonna absolutely dunk on me in the comments and just call me stupid. 00:02:35 Speaker 3: But I've thought about this a lot over the year, so I'm gonna rip it here. Anyway. 00:02:39 Speaker 2: What's the point of wearing a seatbelt on an airplane? I've started to think about this. I've thought at. 00:02:46 Speaker 1: This in case the plane hits like really bad turbulence and you fly up and smack your head on the roof. 00:02:54 Speaker 2: Well, so then if there was turbulence, would say usually announced, then you just put it on. It's one thing to have it in a car, and it's required at all times, because obviously a car is something very sudden could happen and you could need the seat belt on a plane, like you're just sitting there, You're not really moving. 00:03:09 Speaker 1: Like, wow, what if a plane has a bird flying to its engine and all of a sudden it slows down really fast? Oh, well that would be bad, but isn't Yeah, that would be fat that would be bad for you too if you're not wearing a seat belt. 00:03:25 Speaker 2: But and you would again fly forward, but then you can put it on if something were to happen. 00:03:30 Speaker 1: Well, no, you wouldn't know the bird's going to go into the engine because you're already going to be face planted into the back of someone else's seat, or even worse, flying to the front of the plane. 00:03:42 Speaker 2: But you also don't have seatbelts on buses. I almost look at an airplane kind of like that. 00:03:47 Speaker 1: Well, I mean, if you want to be the if you want to be maximum safe, then yes, there probably should be seat belts on buses. But they realize people probably aren't going to put a seat belt on on a bus. 00:03:58 Speaker 3: Yeah, so they. 00:03:59 Speaker 1: Definite like they sacrifice safety for efficiency in that in that sense, but seat but on planes, people aren't getting on and off every three blocks. They're sitting on there for six hours, so they're gonna wear a seat belt. It's the loss of motion, Like, once you're moving that fast, there needs to be something slowing you down otherwise you're just gonna keep going that fast. And the seat belt is that like do you realize like as the plane slows down, the thing that slows you down is your seat and your seat belt. 00:04:33 Speaker 2: Well, yes, but again, just of all the flying I've done over the years, there's not There's never really been a time where I say I really really need this seatbelt. In a car, you absolutely need the seat belt. On a plane, like, eh, I'm not so sure. 00:04:50 Speaker 1: If the plane crashes you would need a seatbelt. 00:04:53 Speaker 2: Well, but if a plane crashes, aren't you kind of in trouble. Whether you have the seatbelt on or. 00:04:58 Speaker 1: Not depends on the situation. There are situations where planes crash and it's totally fine, you just land somewhere. 00:05:09 Speaker 2: I have just yet to find many times where I've really felt like, oh, I need this seat belt. 00:05:17 Speaker 3: That's all. 00:05:19 Speaker 1: Of the time. In the car, you don't need a seat belt either. 00:05:22 Speaker 2: No, but in the car it's different if you have to like hit the brakes and things like that, you can feel the need for the seat belt. On a plane, again, you're just you're just sitting flat. 00:05:33 Speaker 3: I don't know. 00:05:35 Speaker 1: Then, this is not how I expecting this podcast to start. Well, the airplane seatbelts are like the biggest, like like non thing. When for me, when you get on a plane, like put it on forget it, Like you're sitting there. 00:05:48 Speaker 2: I'm not listen. I'm not saying it's hampering your flying experience. I just kind of sit there and say listen. They leave the seatbelt on sign a lot during the flight, and when the seatbelt sign is on, because it's on more than it's not, I often just sit there. I was like, yeah, I don't really think we're in need of the seat belts for the next two hours while you're just cruising. 00:06:08 Speaker 1: Well, I also think it is liable for airlines to make you wear your seat belts so they are not liable for your death on the plane. 00:06:17 Speaker 4: Hmmm. 00:06:17 Speaker 2: Well, I'm just telling you what my experience had been that would make their insurance a lot more expensive. Well, again, i'm telling you my flying experience. I said, there a lot of time thinking to myself, Yeah, man, are. 00:06:30 Speaker 1: You getting up in like moving around a bunch on the plane, Like I don't see you get up and move around that much? 00:06:35 Speaker 3: Yeah, not really. 00:06:36 Speaker 1: But again then I don't understand what the deal is. 00:06:39 Speaker 2: Well, you could just sit there without your seat belt on, and then if you need it, you put it on. 00:06:44 Speaker 3: I'm just saying. 00:06:47 Speaker 1: Yes, but if if you didn't like if you could just put put it on after the fact, then like then there probably wouldn't be a seat belt because you could just like if you had a heads up that you're about to slow down, you'd like put your hands on the back of someone's seat and just stop yourself. The point of the belt is for when unexpected things happen and you need to stop yourself from moving, so you can't just like expect and just go. 00:07:11 Speaker 2: Well, if you say so. This is me trying to again avoid install talking about the Mariners because I really don't want to to be honest, I really really I really don't want to dive in on just the atrocity of another road trip and another road series against the team you absolutely should have taken two of three games from and did not. So guess what if you enjoyed me sounding incredibly stupid and you're saying they're sitting to yourself. 00:07:38 Speaker 3: God, you really did go to Arizona State, didn't you? Llow? You really did not sit and learn things in class, did you allow? Nope? 00:07:44 Speaker 2: And here I am sitting here talking about it. Well, it acts just get to the point, which is the Mariners. 00:07:51 Speaker 1: The point. 00:07:52 Speaker 3: Yeah, they played terribly. 00:07:54 Speaker 1: They did play terribly. I mean, on paper, you look at this road trip and you're like, you're playing three average to below average teams. I didn't realize the Nationals had such a good offense. That kind of snuck up on me. 00:08:06 Speaker 2: Yeah, they've surprised the people this year. I mean, they cannot pitch, but all of a sudden they look like a frisky team that could compete for a wild card spot because, I mean, James Wood has been one of the best hitters in Major League Baseball and the Mariners found that out the hard way this weekend, paired with an offense that has had some really productive bats. C. J. Abrams has been really good. They have bats in that lineup that have really contributed. So yeah, here they are. Man. I don't know how they're gonna find ways to get outs on the mound, but they can certainly go punch for punch with opponents at the plate. 00:08:36 Speaker 1: All they need to do is throw Miles Michaelis against the Mariners. 00:08:40 Speaker 3: Yeah great, isn't that. 00:08:41 Speaker 1: Miles Michaelis these days looks like a BP pitcher and he threw seven shutout against the Mariners. 00:08:48 Speaker 3: Don't you just love to see it? 00:08:51 Speaker 2: And by that don't and then wasn't even the starter like they use an opener. They used, yeah, he's an opener for him, and then proceeded to Roads seven shut out. I mean, is Miles Michaelis all of a sudden the veteran Brian Bao of the National League, because I'm sure we'll get into this more when the Red Sox come to town this weekend. But Brian Bayo, who got sent down to Triple A for the Red Sox, has these really weird stats going with him this year where when he's when he comes in after an opener, he's been absolutely lights out, and when he's had to start games, his first innings are about as bad as anybody in baseball. I don't know if that's what's going on with Miles Michaelis, but it looked like it today. 00:09:32 Speaker 1: It avoids you facing the top of a lineup three times in a start if you don't want to. Oh, Miles Michaelis could have started today's game and probably just dominated right. And the fact that the Mariners ended the game today this probably helped Miles uh without from their opening day lineup without Cal Rawley, Randy Rose, Arena, Josh Naylor, Brennan Donovan and JP Crawford. 00:09:53 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a lot that'll help a lot. 00:09:55 Speaker 1: That makes the Mariner's lineup look a little bit more like the Tacoma Rainiers rather than the Seattle Mariners. So there's like a combination of things when it comes to the Mariners not succeeding on the road. But you just you go into this weekend and you had won eight well, you'd almost won eight in a row going in, you'd won eight of nine going into this road trip, and look at you look at the schedule and you're like, we have three teams that you should at least win two or three against, or in the case against Baltimore, you split two of two, which is it's fine, but winning the losing the series against the Tigers, the series they should have won that they blew. And then this series against the Nationals where you always look on paper and you say, I like this matchup Miles Michaelis versus Emerson Hancock. I'm feeling pretty good about that based on what I've seen this season. Miles Michaeliss with his eerra over six, I think at least entering the game through seven shoutout innings and Emerson Hancock got shell today. It's like the Mariners played five games on this road trip which they had a chance to win the series, and they lost all five of those games bad. Like when you talk about other sports that go like that have point scoring like F one or like hockey points like you always you're always looking to get points. The Manners are able to win a series, they don't come out like neutral, Like if you win three or four against the Orioles, you are two games above five hundred instead of one game above, instead of zero games above five hundred in that series, and something like that can mean a lot as you get later into the season and give yourself a leg up. But the Manners didn't do that. And this has kind of been on par with what they've done all season long, and the reason why they're staying right at five hundred. 00:11:40 Speaker 2: I mean, how many of the same storylines do we have to continue to talk about? Unfortunately a lot of them, because it continues to be the story six man rotation is causing issues. They continue to play inconsistent baseball, They continue to not be a good defensive team, they continue to not get the absolute most of what they eat out of their starting pitchers, because speaking of the six man rotation, it's not like these guys are working deep into games. Since they've started the six man it just continues to be inconsistent start after inconsistent start, and they're not working deep and they're not being extra efficient. And except for well, Bryce Miller's been unbelievable, but aside from him, it's just costing him. Yeah, a lot of the same storylines. 00:12:26 Speaker 3: And by the. 00:12:26 Speaker 4: Way, injuries, a lot of injuries, and that I mean some of it might be overuse when it comes to the bullpen arms, because I mean Andrei's Munhos left the game today. 00:12:39 Speaker 1: If it couldn't get any worse for the Mariners, they've now at some point this season lost Brash, Munnos and Spire to injuries. The only two guys who have not of the leverage guys who have not been hurt are not been sent down, have been Edward Bizardo and Jose Ferrer. But everyone else has been nicked up at some point. And the Moony thing always makes me nervous. He's always dealt with the back stuff. Was it twenty four he was pitching with a back brace or was it last year? Like he had back issues and had to throw with a back brace on. 00:13:10 Speaker 3: I'm trying to remember. 00:13:11 Speaker 2: I want to say it was twenty four because he was one. 00:13:16 Speaker 1: Of those years well, because he had some back problems. 00:13:19 Speaker 2: He was so dominant last year that I don't think that was the year he was battling injuries. 00:13:26 Speaker 1: So then it might have been twenty four. Yeah, but this is not a new thing for Andres Muno's back problems are not good for athletes. Backs are really tricky. Anyone listening to this that is I don't know, thirty year older know that you sleep on your back wrong. I mean even I do this, you sleep on your back wrong. You just feel a crap for the next day. And it's not as fluid and flexible as it used to be. And now imagine having to throw a ball one hundred and one miles an hour and close out games. It just it gets tricky. And when I see that with Andres Munos, he got a whole week off and then he comes out of the bullpen and then gets hurt, It's like, oh, that makes me nervous. This makes me nervous, and this has a chance to now, like combined with the six man rotation, you're getting injured in your bullpen with some of your best arms, and your starters are forcing your bullpen to throw more innings. The success that they've had with their bullpen this year, which has been very productive, one of, if not the best, in the American League from a run prevention standpoint so far, it's gonna tilt because the math just doesn't math on having not as many good relievers and having to cover more innings. It's hard to sustain. And Jose Ferrer can't throw every single night even though he's tried. 00:14:42 Speaker 2: So what do you do Because obviously Munos has not been himself this year. Now he's battling an injury. Brash is already out. You clearly need help in your bullpen, and it was a bullpen that we already said needed more leverage arms at the start of the year before the injuries. What do we do here? Because Monday is gonna in action day. When you're listening to this, off days are off in action days. Are we going to see something happen on Monday? 00:15:07 Speaker 3: Ken? 00:15:07 Speaker 2: No, for sure, there are some possibilities of some transactions that will go down in the next forty eight hours because cal Raley's gonna come back. JP Crawford's gonna come back. There's going to have to be roster moves made. Is there more than that? I mean, are we talking about the end of the six man rotation starting on Tuesday? 00:15:25 Speaker 3: I as sure as hell hope. 00:15:26 Speaker 1: So, I think. So let's run through those options. But before that, let's pause here for a nat. We always want our listeners to be informed about the game of baseball, and the Mariners, believe it or not, there was a time where we had to learn what catch probability was or why a manager only uses his closer in the ninth inning. And it's our goal to make sure everyone understands these things when they listen to us. You can think about accidents and Davis Law Group the same way. They want you to know your rights in the case of an accident. That's why Chris Davis, founder of the Davis Law Group, wrote a series of Washington accident books. He turned common questions into easy to understand books to help people navigate the process, and they've given away over one hundred thousand free copies to people across Washington. 00:16:06 Speaker 5: They want you to be informed. Davis Lag Group has been representing accident victims since nineteen ninety four. They're one of the top rated locally owned personal injury firms on Google, and their in house investigation team can handle complex cases and will prepare every claim like it's going to trial. They only take cases when they believe they can truly help, and you don't pay a fee unless they get you a result. If you've been injured and want to better understand your options, you can request a free, no obligation case evaluation with their team. Just click the link in our bio or visit DLG sattle dot com slash baseball to learn more. That's DLG sattle dot com slash baseball to learn more. I wrote out in my opinion every possible action that can come today, on Monday or tomorrow on Tuesday as of this coming out, so let me know if these all sound right to you. I believe on Tuesday, both Cal and JP Crawford will be active and on the Mariners roster off theil. With that, the Marriors are going to need to make a decision on their backup catcher, whether it be Mitch Garver or Johnny Pareda, and then I believe Patrick Wisdom would go back down to the minor leagues. 00:17:14 Speaker 1: With JP Crawford coming back, Miles Master Bony's back, so he's taking the utility spot on the roster. Then I also think JP Crawford, as of Tuesday, will be starting in a Seattle Mariner's uniform at third base. In Washington, he only was taking ground balls at third base with Perry Hill. Mariners haven't officially announced anything yet, but I just have a feeling that's how it's gonna work. Because they've gotten Colt Emerson in a shortstop now with JP out, and I don't think they want to move him off there. Then I think this is gonna be the end of the six man rotation. What exactly they do after that is, I think, is what is up for discussion. So which one of these do you want to talk about? 00:17:56 Speaker 3: FIRS? 00:17:57 Speaker 1: Should we just talk about the pictures first and then we can talk about the position players? 00:18:01 Speaker 3: Sure? I mean, what is there to say? Man? 00:18:06 Speaker 2: You say the six man rotation is about to end, so clearly you either have to do one of two things, go back to a piggyback, which I hope they do not do. It's sure as hell not going to be with Bryce Miller if they go back to a piggyback, that's for sure. He's earned the right to keep starting every fifth day and be the lone starter pitching. 00:18:25 Speaker 3: So do you. 00:18:25 Speaker 2: Piggyback with somebody else or do you just finally make a decision on one of these starters and go back to a five man rotation. Because, by the way, on Saturday's loss where they lost eight to three, Luis Castillo five and two thirds innings five runs to his credit, only two were earned, struck out four, but still gave up five runs. As a Zra sits at five even for the year here in June the fifteenth. 00:18:54 Speaker 1: Let's analyze these two options. I think. I think if they are going to piggyback, there are clear options that are not named Bryce Miller like I think it's it's hilarious to think about. This is going to be either Logan Gilbert or George Kirby who gets piggybacked, if that's what they decide, Because Logan Gilbert and George Kirby have not shown the ability to get past the fifth pass into the sixth inning and beyond this year. Logan Gilbert in the sixth thinning this year has an area of eight and allowing eleven hundred ops. Third time through the lineup, he's allowing an ops over one thousand. George Kirby this year, in the sixth inning is allowing an area of thirteen with an eleven hundred ops. He's allowing an eight eighty one ops third time through the lineup. Those are just numbers through now two and a half months of the season that are telling us that these pitchers are really really struggling to get three times through a lineup, or even into the third time against an opposing lineup, which the piggyback is meant to balance out by saying, all right, you guys go through this lineup through five innings and then they're gonna get a different look for the final four innings of that. Those are my two candidates. 00:20:08 Speaker 2: And by the way, this isn't new with them. Those were the two guys that had serious issues the third time through the lineup last year. Why did we hit home that Carry Carpenter thing in the playoffs so hard because of the numbers that George Kirby was rolling out the third time through the lineup. He gets crushed the third time through. It was true last year, it's been true this year and it's not a new trend unfortunately. 00:20:31 Speaker 3: So if you're going with. 00:20:32 Speaker 2: The idea of avoiding seeing a lineup the third time through the order for one of these starting pitchers, that would if you're the Mariners, that would be the idea behind performing the piggyback. You're right, But at the same time, how long do they keep letting this roll out with Luis Castillo? You need help in your bullpen, and he just continues to have rocky starts. I know a couple of those runs weren't his fault on Saturday, because three of those five runs were unearned. But he's not out there pitching ultra efficiently either. 00:21:08 Speaker 1: No, he's not. And let me add into this, I think Emerson Hancock would be in the piggyback boat as well as well. As he's pitched this year and his era is even after today's start, which was not good as Yura jumped before a full run, it's still among the best on this team. He's in the same boat as Kirby and Logan Gilbert. He's allowing almost eleven hundred ops in the sixth thinning. Third time through, he's allowing an ops of eight to eleven. It's not been as good for him as he pitches deeper in the games as well, and some of those, some of these starts have really reflected it from him, especially recently. So you have three guys whose numbers look almost identical once they get third time through into the sixth inning. So I think those three, George Kirby, Logan Gilbert, and Emerson Hancock, if they decide that Luis Castillo needs to be one needs to be piggybacked, and that's the strategy, those are your three candidates. If they do Bryce Miller again, like that's insulting. I don't. I don't think the Mariners will do it. But if they, if there is like this one percent chance they do do it, I think they would be insulting to Bryce. 00:22:06 Speaker 2: Miller, and it would be just not looking at the numbers at all. Here's here's three starters legitimately struggling the third time through the order. Here's a guy who's not I mean, that's not getting the best use out of your roster. 00:22:20 Speaker 1: If you do that, No, I know, I know, it's not giving yourself a better chance to win. 00:22:24 Speaker 2: No, I mean, I know Kirby and Logan Gilbert are the longer tenured pitchers. But again, the results are what they are. They have had issues the third time through the order, and it's not new. As of the last five weeks. This has been a recurring thing with them now, both of them. 00:22:39 Speaker 3: So that is an option. 00:22:41 Speaker 2: After all that went down with the piggyback the last time they tried it, and how unhappy it made all the players. I don't know if they go back to that again, but one way or another, if you're making Luis Castillo not a starter, you're gonna quote unquote I don't know if make him disgruntle the right word, but he's obviously not gonna be in his ideal situation. However, like at some point you got to make a decision with this on. 00:23:11 Speaker 3: Him, you do, Yes, he's not throwing the ball well. 00:23:15 Speaker 1: Enough, which leaves the other option, which is putting him in the bullpen, which I think, I honestly think at this point you just have to do because you are running out of bullpen arms. Your high leverged arms are dropping life flies. And while Luis Castillo's probably not Matt Brash, he's not Andres Munnos. He can still be in like an inning spurt good with his fastball pitching at the top of the strike zone because you're not overexposing him. His lack of efficient secondaries is not going to kill him when he's coming in out of the bullpen and he's maxing out for three to five outs, three to six outs, depending on how much you on him. That one benefits the Mariners, I think more than what it's currently doing right now, where he's essentially a negative warpa. 00:24:00 Speaker 4: On the mound. 00:24:00 Speaker 1: What is this war now? Is it? Is it zero or is it negative? Let's say that's oh yeah. 00:24:06 Speaker 2: Here by Baseball reference it sits at negative zero point seven, so. 00:24:11 Speaker 1: Right now, and then on fangrafts it's positive zero point six, So let's call that even he's zero right now. He's a replacement level pitcher on the mound. He can give you above replacement level production as a bullpen arm and be more valuable to you if you put him in there right now. But as we said on Friday's podcast, this is no longer a demotion. It's not Luis, You're not good enough to be in this rotation. You're going to take a back seat roll in this bullpen. The Mariners need bullpen arms. They have two months until this deadline comes around, and their current bullpen arms, whether it be through overuse or bad luck, are getting hurt and they're going to need guys to throw innings in that bullpen and help them win games. That's just the situation. 00:24:53 Speaker 2: This is well, I think it can be both. It is a demotion. You're telling what he's Castillo, He's no longer good enough to pitch in the rotation. Brian Wo's not the one getting put in the bullpen. Who by the way, that's a conversation in its own right, because he has really struggled in his last handful two or so it starts, But Brian Wo's still not getting put in the bullpen. Luis Castilla would be getting yanked out of the rotation. But that all being said, the Mariners can absolutely Sales pitch him and phrase it to him in a way that is, we need you like we need you in a role that is going to best help the team win. And right now, this team does not have relievers that can pitch in high leverage. We need you to help lock down games, and by the way, you could do it for multiple innings. Louise could be a two inning reliever. Couldn't do it with them every day, but he could go out there and throw two innings. 00:25:48 Speaker 1: It just the current role at its production shouldn't be continuing. And like, we just see all the side effects of the ways the Mariners are trying to keep Castillo in the rotation, whether it be running a guy short in the bullpen or having unhappy players when you're piggybacking, and we just don't really want any more of that. And the situation is laid out to where it actually kind of works for Luis Castillo, and like I know, they'll probably they might not even bother mentioning this to Castillo because it's kind of a given. But at some point the check clears no matter what, Like, he signed his contract, he's making that money, and in his current state as a starting pitcher, he's not getting another contract even close to that's it would need to drastically improve on the mound for that to be the case. But also Louis Castillo has a year and a half left on his contract, so it's like not even something you should be worrying that much about right now. It feels like a pretty easy decision to me that you're sending Louis Castillo to this bullpen right now, and Kit Anderson. By the way, since we last recorded a podcast through another six and two thirds shutout innings in Arkansas, his ear ray for the season is now one point one three. So yeah, I think he's ready in case, it's just not as obvious as humanly possible. You have starter depth in the minor leagues, you have a major league starting pitcher throwing in Double A. 00:27:19 Speaker 2: And somebody floated out a really crazy idea online over the weekend that said, what if you move two starters to the bullpen and bring up Kate Anderson to start as big league clock and begin pitching and starting in the big league rotation. It is certainly a thought provoking idea, but I don't think the Mariners are moving two starters to the bullpen. 00:27:39 Speaker 1: I don't think this would happen. But let's talk the baseball strategy of it. The idea behind this would be, we think kan Anderson is at least better than half of our rotation right now. 00:27:52 Speaker 2: Yeah, which would be a pretty crazy thought because again, he's still never thrown in the big leagues. I know, he's just been dominant in Double A. And maybe it just comes up in the world on fire, wouldn't shock me. But you don't know, he hasn't thrown major league innings yet, and there could be an adjustment period for him too, So yeah, I don't know that would be putting a lot of eggs into the Kate Anderson bucket when you already have a rotation of guys that have proven it in the big leagues. 00:28:20 Speaker 1: You know, when I could see this in September. 00:28:24 Speaker 2: Sure, Like, let's say in September, right you, Luis Castillo has already been moved to the bullpen and Emerson Hancock hits an innings limit because I'm guessing we talked about this over the weekend. I'm guessing he'll be on some sort of innings limit this year. I'm not saying they're shutting him down at one hundred innings, because that's not gonna happen. But it would be a really, really big jump for Emerson Hancock to go from what he did in twenty twenty five, where he threw a total of what was eighty innings, and then throw two hundred and twenty twenty six, which would way more than double a career high for him. So I'm sure he's on some sort of limit. And if by September you say, okay, I don't know who the Mariners would pick to start in the playoffs or not at this point. I mean it could be Emerson Hancock, and if that's the case, he's not the one in the bullpen. But let's say the Mariners just moved Castillo and somebody else to the bullpen in September and then call Kate up to start starting games. Yeah, that could happen then, but I don't think it happens now. 00:29:29 Speaker 1: If they want Kate Anderson throwing in their playoff rotation, I definitely, well that's out. That would be a thing. 00:29:36 Speaker 2: Well that's funny because then that would make three starters set to go to the bullpen, because you don't pitch five in a playoff rotation. You usually pitch four. Some teams do three. So if you're the Mariners and you're serious about Kate Anderson pitching in your playoff rotation, then that means you're sending in the postseason Castillo, Hancock, and Kirby all out there. 00:29:57 Speaker 1: You know what, I'm actually going to rescind that state. He doesn't even need to be in the playoff rotation a pitch significant playoff innings. It's not just a bullpen roll that he could occupy. They could quasi piggyback in the playoffs, and by the way, piggybacking in the playoffs very acceptable. Like you're pitching whoever you need to win games, like designated roles do not exist, like throwing andre'smunus in the seventh inning of the game seven in the highest leverage spot. Anyways, you would like in the situation last year where the Mariners would have starters like get through four shutout, but it's four of the most stressful laborist innings possible. Kate Anderson then comes in and dominates the next three innings for you out of the bullpen like he's he's like long relieving, but he's throwing like a starter's load out of your bullpen. And by this point, Kate Anderson also will probably be closer to an innings limit because they've been load managing him this season, and you could be a little bit more flexible with him as opposed to starting him on the mound with a lot more veteran starters around him, where it's just it's just so unlikely when you have this many established big league starters and then a prospect comes up and starts taking their innings away right. 00:31:10 Speaker 2: And by the way, if Kate pitches in the playoffs for the Mariners and he comes out of a piggyback roll, he'll be piggybacking one of the guys that struggles the third time through the order. You there's a reason starters get yanked early in playoff games because usually the numbers the third time through for a lot of starters are not good, and you want to keep you want to keep things changing. If you're a team, you don't want to let the team get the same looks too many times, because that's how you get burned. It's how George Kirby got burned in Game one against the Tigers. He's not good the third time through. The Tigers had seen him too many times and carbon Or crushed him. If Kate and that, if Kate Anderson came in after four innings and goes three of his own, not only could he put up three dominant innings, but then you've just cut your path to the back of your bullpen. 00:31:57 Speaker 3: Like out. You're at the eighth inning, there's there you go. 00:32:01 Speaker 1: Well, it's not only that, in a playoff series that you'd play each other, however many games in a row, so the guy, the players on the other teams are going to get a ton of looks at you. So you've got to be able to be flexible and change it up as much as possible. That's something the Manners could have used last year in the playoffs when their starters, I mean weren't getting deep into games at all. You had the one six inning start from Bryce Miller and that's it, right, He's the only one I pitched past the sixth inning? No, oh, Logan did I think against the Tigers that was it? 00:32:32 Speaker 3: So Logan, I think Logan went six. 00:32:35 Speaker 1: So Logan threw six against the Tigers and Bryce threw six against the Blue Jays. 00:32:38 Speaker 3: That's it, right. 00:32:40 Speaker 1: Yeah, So when you have more starters that it would give you a little bit more flexibility in the playoffs. And I think the same would go in September when you're making these shuffles or you're preparing your roster for postseason play and you're trying to like run through these these situations a little bit down the stretch run of the season. But here in June that's probably too aggressive, because you then you're burn Then you really are burning your starter depth. While you would have your thirteen best pictures pitching in the big leagues in your organization, at the same time, it would put you in a tricky situation if someone got hurt. 00:33:16 Speaker 2: Yeah, I do wonder if Kid's gonna go to Triple A at some point. I mean I keep wondering that just to give him some new challenge. I don't know what he has left to do in Arkansas. 00:33:26 Speaker 1: I don't know, I honestly, Like I hope someone can comment and tell us this, Like I'm not sure what kid has to benefit in Arkansas besides playing with more guys his age, right, and like the Mariners are big on growing relationships and guys coming up together. At some point he's a big leaguerat somebody's a big leaguer, or he's on the big league doorstep, and you just want him to go into an environment that will challenge him more than the current environment is challenging him. Like the example is that I don't know how many of you watch that Rockies as series over this weekend, Like that's a Triple A ballpark that they were playing in in Vegas. Then the ball was flying out of the yards where it's like, all right, Kate, if you give up a hard fly ball, it's not getting caught on the warning track anymore. It's going like four hundred and forty feet, So let's keep those keep those pitches down right? 00:34:20 Speaker 3: We got anything else? 00:34:22 Speaker 1: Do we have any updated thoughts on where how this roster is going to shuffle out when Cal comes back? Inevitably talk about destroying triple A. Cow Raly is man handling the PCL on his rehabit sign, So that's good to see. 00:34:37 Speaker 2: Definitely, unfortunately, and it's too bad because he's really done a nice job. But I think because he has options, that Johnny Pareda will be the one that just ends up going back down to the miners. And again it's it's really too bad. But Mitch Garber's hitting lefties really really well. I think it's a weapon they want off the bench. And Rob Refsnider, whether everybody's happy about it or not, has hit the ball better in his last couple of weeks, And because of that, I just don't see them making a significant move taking one of those. 00:35:07 Speaker 3: Guys off the roster. 00:35:09 Speaker 2: Parada has the options, and I think that ends up being the move, and. 00:35:12 Speaker 1: If they change their mind on ref Snyder they want to cut them. I mean, Preda only needs to be down for ten days and then they could bring him back up. So then you could truly put Mitch Garverer in the Rob Refsnyder role where he's never playing in the field, he's dching against lefties and Pareda is the backup catcher. I still think they could do that, but like looking around the roster, they would have to cut rough Snyder, and while Rob is probably played poorly enough to deserve getting cut this season, I don't know. I don't think that's gonna happen yet. 00:35:45 Speaker 3: Yeah, I just don't unfortunately, which is. 00:35:48 Speaker 1: Why parade is the option they It would make them. I think it would make them better they cut Rob refsneinder, but they're not gonna do it, not yet. I think they're still hoping there's some bounce back in his where he can somehow over the course of the next three and a half months be a one oh five worc plus bat somehow some way scrape it together. 00:36:13 Speaker 2: And if he does that, that gives them something from him against lefties. Even if it was it wasn't what they were expecting and why they paid him the six million bucks. 00:36:20 Speaker 3: It's something so. 00:36:22 Speaker 1: Yeah, i'd say the last thing for me Lyle's I really don't think we've ever seen the Mariners this injured. When we've been doing a podcast. You heard all those names I mentioned earlier. As of the end of the game here on Sunday, Col's out, Randy's out, Naylor's out, Donovan's out, JP's out, munnos Is out, brashes out. 00:36:40 Speaker 2: Yeah, look, man, that is the other side of this. They're not playing good baseball. I don't think anybody's sitting here and saying that they are. But when you don't have half your big league roster offensively, especially some of your most important offensive players, this is what happens. There's no team that can sustain injuries like this throughout the course of a season. Your best player not out there, and Cal Rawley, your leadoff hitter, is not out there, and Brendan Donovan. 00:37:04 Speaker 3: It's just not the full lineup. 00:37:06 Speaker 2: You would hope when they come back it's gonna look a lot better, But at some point those guys do have to come back and it's gonna have to turn around. Also, don't know when you're getting Donovan back. Hopefully Calm JP being back ignites something. 00:37:20 Speaker 1: I think both can be true. They're not not playing well, did not play well on the East Coast, and the roster is just not in a state to be good enough. 00:37:29 Speaker 2: No, if you want another glass half full thing, when you look at the Mariners East Coast road trips over the years, I mean, they're never very good. 00:37:38 Speaker 3: They're they're almost always under five hundred. 00:37:41 Speaker 1: In the last three years they've had one winning East Coast trip. 00:37:44 Speaker 3: Yeah, they don't do it a lot. 00:37:46 Speaker 2: So let's hope when they get back home, when they still have some easy games ahead of them here, it can take advantage of the Ools, take advantage of the Red Sox, and at some point just turn this thing around. At some point, it's something's got to give, right, and you would hope Calu and jpbing back does something. 00:38:01 Speaker 1: You'd think so playing two teams that also again aren't good, go back to the past. It might have been like three episodesk Ago. We laid out like the schedule in front of the Mariners before the All Star break. Yes, should be pretty easy. Not a schedule that you should not be going four and six and ten games against no and. 00:38:18 Speaker 2: They got a whole another month till the All Star break to really capitalize. 00:38:21 Speaker 3: On that, so let's hope they do. All right. 00:38:24 Speaker 2: That just about wraps up this edition of the Marine Layer Podcast. You guys know the drill. If you want to listen to the full form podcast, you can do so wherever you get your audio pods, make sure you download. If you're listening, go rate and review five stars. It helps a ton. If you're on YouTube, hit that subscribe button. It helps the channel a ton. Also, drop alike on the video, leave a comment. And then if you're on online, which most of you are, you can go to our website marine layerpod dot com. You can find all of our episodes there, merch is there, patreons there, it's a big one stop shop that's all over at marine layerpod dot com. 00:38:56 Speaker 3: And then find us on social media. 00:38:58 Speaker 2: We're posting content every single day everywhere at Marine Layer Pod. 00:39:02 Speaker 3: That's t J. I'm Lyle. It's always we Thank you guys for tuning in. We'll talk to you soon.