Episode 63: Mike Salk (Seattle Sports), And Grading Mariners' Infielders

00:00:00 Speaker 1: Welcome to episode number sixty three of the Marine Layer Podcast. We welcome on Mike Salt, the host of Brock and SoC on Seattle Sports, talk a little bit about the Mariners off season, his career, and a couple other things as well. We also have our Mariners infield grades for this twenty twenty three season. 00:00:18 Speaker 2: You're a reminder before we start the show. If you're listening to our audio side of this episode, check us out on YouTube too. We've got a video side to the podcast. It's over on YouTube. You can like, comment, subscribe, and turn the notification bells on when you head over there. If you're watching us on YouTube, listen to us too when you're at the gym, in your car, on a walk, wherever. 00:00:38 Speaker 3: You might be. 00:00:39 Speaker 2: If you do that, you can download our episodes, follow us, leave us a five star review. The downloads and the reviews really do help us out a lot, So just take a few extra seconds and do that. And then on social media where we're always active, We're on Instagram, TikTok, Twitter, and YouTube shorts. You can follow us there at Marine Layer Pod. 00:00:58 Speaker 1: Let's get it rolling, and we welcome you to this episode of the Marine Layer Podcast. Part of the Just Baseball podcast network, recording here on Monday, October ninth. Not much has happened in Mariner Land over the last week since the Mariner season ended, but there is one takeaway, Lyle that we can have in the baseball world since then, these playoffs have kind of sucked or really sucked. 00:01:32 Speaker 2: After this Braves Phillies game too, I'll move it to kind of sucked. If you had asked me a couple hours ago, I would have said really sucked. But now now my grade's moved up the totem pole a little bit because the Braves just came back from four runs down to win five to four. Actually, that game just concluded a few minutes before we started recording this. Besides that, though, yeah, it's been bad. These series have been uncompetitive. I know the Twins took a game in Houston. I still have a hard time believing they're gonna really dethron the Astros. It's just it's been a lot of uncompetitive series. Like, we need more fight, we need more teams to punch back. We want some four or five game series in here, guys. 00:02:09 Speaker 1: At the very least, can we get a competitive wild card series isn't it that we've only gotten one wild card series in the two year sample size of this playoff field that has gone to three games, So that would be eight series. Out of the eight series that have played, seven of them in the wild Card round have been sweeps. And it was all sweeps this year, which makes for depressing television. 00:02:33 Speaker 2: It does, thank you Blue Jays, though was not depressing last year. This year, however, it's depressing. 00:02:40 Speaker 1: And I guess one last thing that has come up, Lyle, it has seemed now that the buys have come through and gone and now every team's playing in every team's back playing in the playoff field that's still alive, all of a sudden, Apparently having a buye is a disadvantage. I didn't know that until today, and I'm sitting here trying to think. It's like, huh, so, Zach Wheeler pitching well means Major League Baseball should get rid of the buye. 00:03:06 Speaker 4: Hmm. 00:03:08 Speaker 2: You know, it's funny when you look at the first year this was implemented last year when the Astros won the World Series. You look back to that wildcard series they played, and they had a lot of momentum in that one honestly, it sparked their whole run. Didn't wait, sorry, they didn't play in a wildcard series, did they? No, they didn't. They had a first round by and won the whole thing. They nearly won every single game they played. People making this argument sound ridiculous. I'm sorry that the Braves lost their first game. I'm sorry that the Dodgers got blown out in their first game. Aren't the underdogs supposed to have some advantage? What is the point of the postseason? Actually, what am I even saying? I said, aren't the underdogs supposed to have an advantage? They don't have an advantage. The higher seeds have the advantage because they get to rest. And I'm sorry, I'm not buying this whole time off kills your momentum thing. Momentum is fake number one and number two, you are more rested in your rotation and bullpen. That is an advantage. So I'm sorry, but I can't hear this argument. 00:04:05 Speaker 1: If you go ask any clubhouse, it's like, what would you rather rest for a week before playing in the playoffs after the season or would you rather keep playing? Everyone's gonna say rest. So just a little background, There was more sediment on Twitter the past couple of days. Well, the Dodgers lost Game one, the Braves lost Game one. It's like, oh, having a buy is actually a disadvantage. What is major League Baseball doing? They need If the Braves lose this week to the Phillies in a series, they should do away with the buye. And I'm like, what are we what? How are wed? How does this work? 00:04:39 Speaker 3: A team loses in the playoffs? 00:04:41 Speaker 1: Yeah, we need to get rid of the one thing we think is causing them to lose in the playoffs. That's like me saying, oh, yeah, the Mariners lost in three games in a three game scoop to the Astros last year. Let's make the divisional series seven games. Oh wait, nobody's saying that to get the fuck out of. 00:04:58 Speaker 4: Here, dude. 00:05:00 Speaker 3: Listen. 00:05:01 Speaker 2: So it was Ken Rosenthal who wrote this, And let's be clear, like we think Ken Rosenthal is absolutely fantastic at his job. He is one of the best reporters in the entire field, if not the best reporter, and he makes a lot of really sound points. He is baseball smart, he's well spoken. But we can disagree with somebody from time to time, and here we disagree with what he said, and I think a lot of other baseball fans disagree with it too. This whole get away with the buys thing does not make any sense. And I don't think they're going to funny enough or not even so funny enough, just period. But the fact that was even thrown out there, I just scratched my head a little bit because it doesn't make any sense. 00:05:40 Speaker 1: Let's get to our mariners infield grades. This season should be an adventurous trip around the base bats. We're not gonna be taking any buys while we go through this. We will be touching on everybody. Okay, up, first catcher cal Rawley. What's his grade? 00:05:53 Speaker 4: Lyle? 00:05:55 Speaker 2: He gets an A and he could have gotten an A plus if his offense had just He's in a tad bit better this year. And I know that sounds funny for a guy that hit thirty home runs, but some of his numbers did decline on the offensive side of the ball this year, as WRC plus went down a little bit. 00:06:10 Speaker 3: Again we're nitpicking here. 00:06:12 Speaker 2: His ops went down a little bit, but that's the only thing you could possibly knock the guy for. Cal Raley was healthy. He took a ton of hits this year. He caught a ton of games. He hit thirty bombs. He was top five among all catchers by WRC plus. He was top three among f catchers in F four. I'm rattling off all these numbers here to say cal Raley is one of the best catchers in the game of baseball, and nothing less, nothing less. And when you're one of the best players at your position in baseball and have a year that says so you get an A. Cal Rawley gets an A in my book. 00:06:48 Speaker 1: If we're talking about expected grades, we're giving out actual grades here, and his actual grade for me as an A minus. And you mentioned, well, his offense actually went down this year, so that's why I gave him. Sorry, that's why give him an A instead a plus. I also gave him an A. I just misspoke. But if we're looking at expected grades, Lyle, his expected offense actually went up this year as expected batting average is expected slugging percentage. His ex wOBA also went up. His average eggs of velocity also went up. Lyle, He's chasing for that expected A plus, but he only gets an A from me. Talk about durability. One hundred and forty five games as a backstop is pretty fucking bonkers for a guy. He did take some some dhds, but that's pretty ridiculous if we think about that for cal while also manning not one, not one, but two different swings. Contextualize that two different swings. Thirty bombs for cal Raley. What a magnificent season for him. And just to put some context, we're here trashing on his offense kind of not really, but all one eleven one eleven WRC A WRC plus, he realized only half the qualified catchers in baseball are actually above average hitters. Like, that's what you need to put context there. It's like, oh, only thirty home runs in a one to eleven WORC plus. Well, it turns out that's like eighty fifth percentile catcher hitting right there, if not higher. 00:08:16 Speaker 2: When you look at his war, which again he finished third, he finished behind William Contreras of the Brewers, who had a phenomenal year, and Atlie Rushman. So all your other favorite catchers out there were behind cal Raleigh. Sean Murphy, by war was not better than cal Raleigh. Wilson Contrera's is not better than cal Raley. Any other catchers you might want to throw out there that had great years, they were not better than cal Raleigh. So cal Raley is every bit the way a top three to five catcher in the sport at this point. Will Smith, there's another did not have a better year than cal Raley. He absolutely lit it up this year. And it's funny we talk about his offense going down a little bit, but there are parts of his game that absolutely took steps forward. And we can get to his defense here in a minute, but if we're staying on the offensive profile, strikeouts went down, walks one slightly up, that's another step he had. Like again, he gets an A for every reason that we're outlining he had a phenomenal year. 00:09:13 Speaker 1: You're forgetting the most important stat lele he hit two thirty two. We said, can cal Rawley hit two thirty at the beginning of the season, And you bet your ass he did hit two thirty. He listened to us, he wanted to get above that two thirty benchmark and he certainly made it. There are like, I guess we can nitpick here with his offensive stats, but whether you know whether you're that concerned or not, which you probably should be concerned with his offense, He's probably gonna be a guy who strikes out a bunch in his career because he hits for a bunch of power, and usually when you hit for a bunch of power, more likely than not you're going to strike out a decent amount. And he's not even the worst at king on his own team, as we know, and we've highlighted on here. But his defense that you're about to mention lyle the two very important things he does. He frames really well, which as long as a manual umpire is back there is so important. ABS might take away from that a little bit, at least the challenge system, he won't be able to steal as many strikes, and his caught stealing above average, which I think in the middle of the year it was like he was like league average, but down the stretch here, I mean, my god, he was saving runs off the board by what he was doing, thrown out guys at second base. 00:10:24 Speaker 2: People stop running on him by the end of the year, and the people that tried him didn't work. You saw him hose and runners left and right. It's hard to bind catchers that do it on both sides of the ball. To be that good offensively and that good defensively. 00:10:38 Speaker 3: That's what he was. 00:10:39 Speaker 2: And you'll take the strikeouts when you have everything else. 00:10:44 Speaker 1: It's hard to nitpick, it really is. And we're appreciated of cal Rawley over four and a half win season as a catcher. Go back to the start of last year and say cal Rawley in year two, full year two in the big leagues, is gonna have a four and a half win season. You sign up for that every single day. How about Typhran Slyle. 00:11:04 Speaker 2: Let's get to him in just the second here, because before we do, let's talk. Let's talk a quick word about our friends over at Pigotcha's Pub eight five. So one of the restaurants that we love, Pigotcha's Pub eighty five. It's here in Kirkland. It's just off of four oh five, east of four oh five. It has some great parking, it's got some great pizza, awesome food, and it's got some great drinks. And if you need more than that, which that's already enough in itself, but you can watch all the sports you want in there because there's twenty two TVs. So if you want to go watch the playoffs some baseball, you got what you want to go watch NFL football on Sundays. You want to go watch college football at some point over the course of the weekend on a Saturday, head over there to Pigotcha's. 00:11:43 Speaker 3: Pub eighty five. 00:11:44 Speaker 2: And if you do so, and you decide you want to head over there early, especially during the weekday, they have some happy hours. It's Monday through Friday two to six pm. They've got three dollars domestic beers, four dollars, Manny's Blue Moons, four dollars, Mac and Jacks four dollars, Wells four dollar house wines. All of that is over at Pagatcha's pubbety five in Kirkland. 00:12:04 Speaker 3: Go check it out. 00:12:09 Speaker 5: This fall, stream your favorites and discover more with Disney Plus, Hulu and ESPN Plus together. Watch the highly anticipated new season of Loki and see the ghost materialize in Haunted Mansion on Disney Plus. 00:12:23 Speaker 1: Catch more frights with. 00:12:24 Speaker 5: The Boogeyman, an American horror story delegate on Hulu and on ESPN Plus. Get into the action with college football and NFL. All of these and more streaming now. Get the Disney Bundle with plans starting at nine to ninety nine a month plans with ESPN plus starting at fourteen ninety nine a month terms apply. See Diisney Bundle dot com for details. 00:12:49 Speaker 2: Okay, ty France, I gave him a D plus and we had to give out some hard grades on this one. And I know by his WRC plus he was technically above league average. He was at one O four, But one O four in terms of your WRC plus, it's not good enough from a first basement, especially a first baseman that hit twelve home runs for the year. Ty France really took a step back with his bat this season, and when you look at his numbers among first basement across the league and much of it, he was in the bottom third. So when you compare to the when you compare him to his counterparts across baseball, he just wasn't cutting it. The season he had is just playing and simple not good enough for what the Mariners need from him. 00:13:30 Speaker 1: It was replaceable, is the terminology I used. He got a D plus from me as well. If you look at his ranks among first basemen, he was twenty third in isolated power out of twenty four by the way twelfth and on base percentage twentieth. Then weighted on base average thirteenth, the expected weighted on base average eighteenth in WRC plus twentieth and f four for a first basement. It's just not good enough and it's disappointing. We look at ty France's stretch as a Mariner at the plate. In twenty twenty one, he had a one to twenty nine WRC plus was worth over three fangrafs wins above replacement. Twenty twenty two a one to twenty five WRC plus and two and a half fangrafs wins above replacement. This season, he took a nose dive down to a one oh five and half a win above replacement for a first baseman who, by the way, is defense is not loved by fangrafts thirty six fangrafts. By Baseball Savant thirty six percent tile and outs above average. He is poor on the base paths fifth base running run value. He is fifth. That's a Baseball Savant set right there. He's also just seventh percent tile and sprint speed as well. There's not a whole lot of positives out here. Besides the fact he is in the top half of the league and not swinging and missing and striking out. That's it. Everything else is down across the board, and having a slow first baseman who doesn't hit for power is like the worst combination possible. 00:15:02 Speaker 2: You mean he's in the fifth percentile right in terms of his base running value? 00:15:05 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I think that's what I meant. There's a lot a lot of numbers jumping up. 00:15:09 Speaker 2: I might have misheard you. I thought you said fifth, and I was like fifth among first basement. 00:15:14 Speaker 1: That can't be right, fifth percentile? 00:15:16 Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, yo, Look, first basement usually are not fast. But we know Ty France does not run well. What his roster spot becomes here in twenty twenty four is TVD. He may very well be back on the roster. I guess there's a chance he could get traded. The fact he's going to drive line is a very good sign and hopes that he could turn last season in the rear view mirror and get back to what he was doing in twenty one in twenty two next year. But as we sit here and give him his grade, I think this is a fair grade. I think most people would say it wasn't good enough from Ty Francis here, and that's what we're sitting here. Saying the numbers don't back it up, even if you want to throw all the saber metrics out the door, which we love to use. Twelve home runs from a first basement. Twelve home runs, and he was fully healthy. He just was not hitting the ball over the fence and at a premier offensive position. He kind of need the guy to do that. And if he's not gonna do it, by the way, if he's gonna hit fifteen to twenty, which sometimes is what ty Franz does, then his WRC plus numbers and his advanced stats have to be better. His WRC plus probably has to be in the one twenties, but that wasn't the case either. 00:16:24 Speaker 1: And he also just needs to slug more man Okay, in the sense of him having fifteen to twenty home runs. This is actually what I meant to say. He needs to get on base more, and I can't believe I'm about to say this. He needs to hit for a better average, He needs to get produced more at the plate if he's not gonna hit as many home runs. He did that the last two seasons, but this season he just didn't. He was also, by the way, horrible base runner. I mentioned base running value. But if you go look at the Fangrafts one as well Fangrafts base running runs, he was four times as worse as his next closest season on the basement four times. So like either ty France goes to drive line and starts crushing fastballs again, which is a big part of his success each of the last two seasons, and becomes what should be his one of his peak seasons at the plate at age thirty. Either he does that or the Mirrors do seriously need to consider what their other options at first base are next year, because if ty Franz does what he did this past season at the plate next season, not only is it a failure on him, but it's an organizational failure as well to not see that and to not act on it. 00:17:38 Speaker 2: If they don't trade for a first baseman this winner, they'll roll out with ty France to start twenty twenty four. They'll see what his changes look like after going to drive line. But if we get into the summer here, if we get around the All Star break of the trade deadline and ty France is in tutnet again, they may look to go get a first basement at the deadline next year, or they may be calling Tyler Locklear's name, depending on it and how he's doing in the minors. So I think the first half of twenty twenty four is going to be pretty pivotal for ty Frans. Obviously, this year was not the year he wanted to have. Let's hope he can flush it for next year. Moving on here to second base, Josh Rojas didn't have the largest sample size in Seattle, but for the time he was here, TJ what great did you give him? 00:18:21 Speaker 1: I give him a B minus slash incomplete. So I say incomplete because he was only here two months. It's hard to get a true grade based on that sample. Although if you look at what he did while he was a Mariner an ops a little over seven twenty two seventy two, three twenty one, four hundred a one oh four WRC plus, slightly above league average as a hitter, but he did gain nearly a win. I think it was zero point seven Fangrafts wins above replacement or that was Baseball Reference actually wins above replacement as a Mariner. And if you contrast that to what Colton Wong produced as a Mariner this season, just him being here for two months. Was a one and a half win upgrade over Colton Wong. That's carrying a lot of weight in his grade right here, and we saw what he could do at his peak when he's hot. In August he had a one to nineteen WRC plus opposed to down the stretch hit an eighty six WRC plus. But there's a lot of things he does well. He ranks as a plus bas runner. He ranked as a plus based runner this season, and he also ranked very well on defense, which if you told us at the end of the year Colton Wong would be playing good defense, be a good base runner, and have a one h five WRC plus, you'd say, well, that's good enough. Mariners probably make the playoffs if that's the case. But that's what Josh Rojas had to come in and supplement and Coultwong did not do. So that's where I'm at with with Josh Rojas. 00:19:50 Speaker 2: We're three for three on our grades. I gave Rojas a B minus. I think he was very productive in the time he was here. We also need to see more from him now. To his credit that time he was here. If you pro rate his war over the course of about a full one sixty two. He's right around a three win player, honestly, maybe a little bit above that. So that is a guy you can rely on. And it's funny. Most people wouldn't think this off the top of their head, but Josh Rojas slugged four hundred in his time here. That's pretty good. I'm not saying it's gargantuan, but that's pretty good, especially from the second base production they've had the last few years. I think you'll take that, combined with the good defense, the base running, the fact that he simply can actually put back to ball like so many of the second basemen have not. Yeah, I think this is a guy that he's not gonna be the best bat in your lineup, but he's certainly a guy that toured that nine spot, can help and can flip the lineup around. 00:20:46 Speaker 1: He's not Marcus Simeon, and yeah, we do wish Marcus Simon was Mariner. But I think this version we saw of Josh Rojas for two months, if he were too, like you said, a strap plate that over a full season for what we've seen at second base, I think a lot of people would take that. Again, I think that would be the math works out. I think it would be a little bit over two wins. But if you're saying the Mariners would have had a two win player at second base this season, that would have been a three win improvement over what they had what they planned for at the be any of the season. 00:21:14 Speaker 3: So, yeah, he. 00:21:15 Speaker 2: Looked like Joe Morgan compared to Colton Wong no offense. 00:21:18 Speaker 1: But yeah, we'll get to our Colt Wang grade by the way at the end of the segment. So if anyone was really wondering if we're going to grade him, no, we didn't forget. We didn't forget. We'll give him his time. Overall, though, there's not many better options out there for them to truly upgrade at second base, which is why we both, I think agree that Josh Rojas is going to be your second baseman this year next year. The only reason why he wouldn't be is if you go swing a trade for one of those Orioles guys and JP sticks at shortstop, one of those those young Orioles infielders, that you give away one of your one one of your young pitchers. 00:21:54 Speaker 2: For the last thing I'll say on Rojas is an area I'd like to see him improve a little bit next year. Is bumping up that walk right a little bit because most of his career he's actually walked at a pretty good rate. In fact, his first few seasons in the big leagues he was walking over ten percent of the time. It was about seven point seven percent as a whole this year, but his time in Seattle was under seven percent, which is a little below league average. So Josh Rojas has walked a lot of his career. And if he bumps out on base up next year because he's on base was about three twenty and he can walk a little bit more, he actually gets even more valuable, so he can be even better than he was this year. That's just an area I'd like to see him get a little bit better next year. 00:22:33 Speaker 1: And do we think they're gonna platoon him next. 00:22:35 Speaker 2: Year depends on what Ryan Bliss does. Actually, it depends on what jose cabiiro does too, because people might not like it. But he did hit lefties this year, so we'll see. 00:22:45 Speaker 1: Is that something you'd be okay with. 00:22:50 Speaker 2: TVD if Ryan Bliss really like proves to be a big leader. Because he started to hit toward the end of the year in triple A, and we know how he hit in double A, which was exceptionally well, yeah, I'd be all right with it. And again we'll have to see how Cabby does. 00:23:04 Speaker 1: I think I meant the I'll think about it stage because we got a lot of off season left to digest all these modes. 00:23:09 Speaker 2: How about this, If there is one platoon one, I'll be okay with it. I am not okay with four. If they do one platoon at second base, I'm okay with it. 00:23:20 Speaker 1: I'm with you. Way to finish that off. I like that before we get to the shortstop, JP Crawford. Let's hear about betterhelp. Is something interfering with your happiness or preventing you from achieving your goals, regardless if you have a clinical mental health issue like depression or anxiety, or you're just a human who lives in this world going through a hard time. Therapy can give you the tools to approach your life in a very different way. That's why I'm excited to tell you about today's sponsor, Better Help. Betterhelp's mission is to make therapy more affordable and more accessible, and it's an important mission because finding a therapist can be really hard, especially when you're limited to options in your area. 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Did you know JP Crawford with thirteenth in baseball in WRC plus he was sixth in the American League sixth and by the way, that's better than Julio sixth in the American League. JP Crawford, Now, who was saying that at the start of the year, that's an a His offense was absolutely marvelous this year. 00:25:15 Speaker 1: And if you look across the board in his shortstop ranks, the only shortstop who's definitively better than him in every category was Corey Seeger, Who's gonna finish second in MVP. That's the kind of season JP Crawford put up as a shortstop. Like catcher, shortstops don't always hit. But JP Crawford turned himself into not just a good player, but a borderline elite offensive player in one season. We're talking about a shortstop who nearly cranked twenty home runs, walked nearly fifteen percent of the time, a one thirty four WRC plus, nearly five fan grafts wins above replacement Among shortstops he ranked first, and walk rate second, and on base percentage eighth and slugging second, and weighted on base savage second in WRC plus and tied for fourth in wins above replacement. And oh, by the way, we'll get to this, but if his defense was better, he'd probably be clearly second in wins above replacement behind Corey Seeger. 00:26:15 Speaker 2: Oh, if his defense was the way it was in twenty twenty one, we're talking about a world where he'd be top five in baseball and war. We're talking about a world where his f WOR might be ahead of show Hayes this year. Because show hayes f OR for the year was six point six. JP's was about five. If he was playing gold glove defense, we're talking about a potential seven war player. So let's just get into it now. Because we're talking about his glove. That's why his grade is not an A plus. His glove was not good again. And I know there's people out there that'll say, oh, no, he played good defense this year and he was solid. I don't know what you're really basing that off, because none of the defensive metrics favor him. If this was a world where, oh, he ranked well in defensive run save but not outs above average, or he didn't rank well and outs above average but his USR was good, all right, there'd be an argument for it. None of the metrics really favor him. In fact, they don't favor him at all. His outs above average was in the fifth percentile at negative eight, like he can still improve on that defensive side of the ball. He can still get better, and not just better, but we know he can play great defense. He just hasn't done it the last couple of years. But let's not harp on that too much because that's the only thing knocking him down. Again, He's an a for every other reason. 00:27:26 Speaker 1: Defensive run saved doesn't have him terribly. It's minus four with the amount of innings he played. That's slightly below average. If he was if Fangrafts thought he was the worst thing on planet Earth at shortstop, he would be I think around minus twenty. That's usually where the worst players in baseball are. He's not quite at that mark. But out's above average hates him fifth percentile minus eight outs above average is not great, and I suggest watch JP Goto is right. That's where most of the issues stem from. JP Crawford's defense. My question is just drive line do a defense class ause? If so? You know, his offense took a marvelous step because of that, and I think his defense could use that too. I'm not quite sure if there, If he's like at the point of his career where they'd move him off shortstop, I don't know, it'd be interesting. 00:28:16 Speaker 2: This is why we talked about the whole shortstop thing this winter, and again I didn't lose sleep over the fact that they didn't overpay for one of those guys. That being said, we did talk about the idea of moving him to second base because it seemed like his range was starting to deteriorate, and that's a big thing. That out's about average takes into account his guy's ranged and JP the last two years is not graded while there. So maybe at some point they'll move him off and put him over at second base. If he's still around when Felon and Selliston gets up, maybe that's the time he moves over. But that's a long long while. I was gonna say that is a long way away. So that's just a hypothetical. 00:28:52 Speaker 1: Is there anything else we want to see offensively from him? I'm trying to I was thinking about it, and I'm like, I don't know if there's really anything else after what we saw they has to do besides sustain it. 00:29:05 Speaker 2: I agree, this is the guy they thought he could be when he was a top five prospect. Can I just read you the five guys in the American League that ranked ahead of him by the way in WRC plus because it is show Hey who's gonna win the MVP, Corey Seeger who's gonna come in second, YONDI Diaz of the Rays who had a phenomenal year, Kyle Tucker who's gonna finish top five in the MVP voting, and Esach Parades of the Rays who also had an amazing year. Those are the only five three of them including show Hey, Corey Seeger, Kyle Tucker ahead of JP Crawford. 00:29:38 Speaker 3: Like what a year? 00:29:40 Speaker 1: Yeah, pinch us. The fact that JP Crawford landed in that group in terms of offense, We're like, can he just put up a one to fifteen? I mean, that's all we're asking? One fifteen? No, No, it was it was significantly better than that. Okay, au Hennio Swarez at third base, lyle, what's his grade? 00:29:59 Speaker 2: This was the this guy for me to try to give a grede too, So I gave him a B minus. And here's why he still put up above three war for the year. That is, by all accounts, a good season. You put up a number like that, it's not elite, it's a good year. 00:30:13 Speaker 3: And what is that? 00:30:13 Speaker 2: Because of Well, it's because of his defense. He was phenomenal on defense this year. His offense not so much. And the problem with him is when you need one of your thumpers in the lineup, one of your true impact bats to be that, and he isn't, it's really hard on the team, and I think that played a factor into why they're not in the postseason right now. So it was a B minus for me. 00:30:33 Speaker 1: Especially after coming off a season with a one thirty WRC plus and the Mariners enter this season thinking Gino is gonna be could be your third best hitter, third or fourth that leads it would be some combination of Julio, Taoscar, Typhransen au Henio. The problem is three quarters of that group egregiously underperformed, and Gino was definitely part of that. I was one notch below you. This is where we will not agree. I gave Gino a C plus because third baseman need to hit. Out of twenty one third baseman, he was sixteenth in WORC plus. He was eighteenth in slugging for a guy who's supposed to be one of the best power hitters in baseball, eighteenth in slugging percentage. It's just he's taking everything that made his game different than everyone else in which made him a successful big league player, was not there in his hitting profile this season. He had the strikeout rate of a big thumper, but none of the production. 00:31:33 Speaker 2: You can't slug three ninety one if you're Gino. The Mariners just need so much more from him than that. You need your third baseman to hit. He wasn't hitting enough, and it's funny. He's not a guy that chases a whole lot. The thing with him is he just swings and misses, and that's what continued to happen this year, and more than ever, he wasn't barreling up the baseball, which is what led to a down offensive season. Do I think he is the third baseman next year? 00:31:57 Speaker 3: Yeah? I do. 00:31:58 Speaker 2: He's only got a year left on his contract and absolutely played well enough to be back there next year, especially when you put up three wins. But they do need more offense from him. We speculated, who could it be that Jerry was alluding to that may spend time at drive line this winter? I think we both agree Gino goes and spends some time at drive line probably help him. 00:32:16 Speaker 1: Yeah, probably would, and I gotta say, if the powers declining for Gino, he's got a fun way to strike out less, he's got it because those two don't mix. Thirty one percent strikeout rate with the slugan percentage under four hundred makes it pretty difficult. Now, I will know he did to get a little unlucky. We highlighted the stat I think like in the middle of the season didn't change a whole lot. His expected slugging against fastballs this season ended at five ninety nine, but obviously didn't translate a whole lot into his actual production on the field, which was a little unfortunate. 00:32:52 Speaker 2: It is unfortunate. Maybe next year the luck turns back in his favor. There was certainly some bad luck in Gino's profile this year, But ultimately we're not giving out expected grades, right, We're giving out actual grades. And for that reason, you gave him a C plus. I gave him a B minus, and you can only hope he turned it around next year. 00:33:09 Speaker 1: I will leave this off with my last note. So you said you almost guarantee that Geno's on the roster next year. I'm pretty sure Geno's on the roster next year. I have no knowing Jerry. It doesn't seem like there'd be any real reason they would move off of him, knowing how he thinks and how he constructs his roster. However, if there was an upgrade out there, I just wouldn't totally be shocked. I wouldn't totally be shocked. But you know, here nor there, we have a while to go. 00:33:36 Speaker 2: I didn't guarantee it, did I said, I think he'll be on the roster. 00:33:39 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, okay, so I think we're both in the think not for sure. 00:33:44 Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that's right. 00:33:46 Speaker 2: Okay, the last few guys, we're gonna try and rip through him here fairly quickly. But we'll start with Mike Ford. What's your grade? 00:33:53 Speaker 1: Mike Ford for me gets a B minus because he did everything he's supposed to do coming up. You call up a triple A guy for the most parts, had cups of tea around the big league so far, and he comes up to the Mariners and has his best stretch in the big leagues that he's had over the longest period of time he's been in the big leagues as well. You wanted a guy to come up and slug, Well, that's what he did. Eighty four games one twenty four WRC plus, including his first full month when he slugged when he had a one forty nine WRC plus. Like, that's what you want when you call up a guy. It's like, all right, just swing for the fences. Well, it worked right, so he filled the role you wanted and was able to at least supplement that dhroal. 00:34:37 Speaker 2: I gave him a B minus. Also, his numbers were good. I figure when he got up in early June, it'd probably be a cup of coffee for him. That's been the story of his career the last few years, and then he'd probably be back in the minor leagues or with another team. That wasn't the case. He was a mainstay of the rest of the year and he hit. He had some big moments. That home run Felix Patisa the one is the one that's drilled into my mind. He helped this team this year. It wasn't perfect, but that's why I gave him a BE. He definitely helped the team. So I think we're in agreement there. 00:35:03 Speaker 1: On Mike Ford, we saw like he had some struggles throughout the season. Did you know he actually didn't have a month with less than one hundred w ORC plus. 00:35:11 Speaker 2: That's pretty good. Yeah, it's really good, Okay, Jose Cabierro. 00:35:17 Speaker 1: Jose Cabiiro gets a B minus from me. Again for the role he was supposed to fill. It was good enough. He was replacement level at the plate or league average at the plate. There's a difference between lee average and replacement level. But was rated as a plus fielder and a plus runner and got in the head of the other team. That seems like three positives for an ideal bench guy that you would want. So B minus for me. 00:35:44 Speaker 3: He did hit lefties for the main portion of the year. 00:35:48 Speaker 2: I know people weren't happy about what was going on with the lineups toward the end of the season, and I get it. But objectively, Jose Cabiiro put up a one twenty six WRC plus against left handed pitching this year, and he put up a war above two, which, by the way, among al rookies that was seven. Josh Young was a two and a half. Jose Cabiro was a two point two. 00:36:08 Speaker 4: Wow. 00:36:08 Speaker 2: I know people, I know people didn't yeah, talk about that. I know a lot of people weren't happy about the lineup at the end of the year, and again I get it. And here's why. What did Jose Cabierro do against lefties in the final month forty one WRC plus. 00:36:22 Speaker 3: So that's where I think we agree. 00:36:23 Speaker 2: Well, maybe there should have been some adjustments down the stretch, but year as a whole, play great defense, hit well against lefties at least, and was a good bench player. Now again, he wasn't perfect. He made a flurry of base running mistakes this year, and he again was not good in the month of September. But I think he's a bench player that the Mariners can use next year. 00:36:45 Speaker 1: Yeah, bench player is I think what you and I agree on it. After he had a really good month of May. I think that carried most of his offensive profile June first on eighty eight WRC plus, which, again for a guy who's gonna play defense and run the bases off your bench is okay, that's fine, But we'll see what the Mariners think about his role for next season. Staying on second base, Lisle Colton Wong, I. 00:37:10 Speaker 2: Think it was you that wanted to give this grade more than anybody, because he obviously didn't finish the year on the team. I don't really think there's a grade you could give him other than an F. 00:37:18 Speaker 1: Yeah, he got an F from me and I the only line I have for this were to draw a comparison of what Colton Wong's grade is in on this podcast, and then what a grade that would be in real life. I thought it would be a good comp dog. It would be like if you walked into Bio one oh one at ASU and and tried taking that class. What did you think about that? 00:37:40 Speaker 3: Yeah? 00:37:40 Speaker 2: I did not take Bio one oh one, by the way, for that exact reason. Wouldn't have gone well. Kind of like Colton Wong's season here in Seattle. So yeah, not good. It's a shame that one didn't work out. They really could have used them, and he wasn't the player they thought he was gonna be. 00:37:54 Speaker 3: Did. 00:37:55 Speaker 2: Okay, we've got two more guys left here, Tom Murphy, I'll just start with this one. I gave him a B plus. Look, he was not healthy. We know it's been a problem in his career that he can't stay on the field, But when he was on the field this year, he was crushing it and he played some solid defense. So quickly, Tom Murphy when he was playing this year was good. 00:38:13 Speaker 1: Yeah, I'll give him a B plus as well, especially when they missed his bat down the stretch, the lineup slumped. They could have used a couple of dh das from Tom Murphy to ignite that lineup, and they didn't have it. He had one of his best seasons as a Mariner outside of a juice ball year, so that was very nice to see from Tom Murphy. I'm not sure if they bring him back. They probably need a little bit more reliability out of their backup catcher to not get hurt because, as we've seen down the stretch the last two seasons, cal Ralely's gotten worn out and they haven't had a quality backup they trusted to put in there against any sort of real competition. Sam haggerty Lyle, I. 00:38:49 Speaker 2: Think this is our last guy, right, Yeah. So he's kind of an incomplete grade because he wasn't playing a ton this year. He got sent down to Tacoma a couple of times, but I gave him a C for the role he was in was a ce. His WRC plus was still above league average. He walked, he doesn't strike out, he steals the bases, so he's not perfect. He actually didn't play great defense this year, but again for being the last guy on the bench, he was serviceable and serviceable as a CE. 00:39:17 Speaker 1: I gave him B actually just because of his role. I thought he'd filled his roles. He's fast, and he played six different positions and wasn't an absolute travesty at the plate, and usually that checks all the boxes for me when you're looking at a bench player. 00:39:32 Speaker 2: All right, so maybe see's a little tough. Maybe C plus or B minus is more in the range. I should have given him the grade because you're right that for his role he was fine. 00:39:41 Speaker 3: He just wasn't. 00:39:42 Speaker 2: He wasn't quite the way he was last year, and maybe that wasn't fair to expect out of him. But he didn't hurt the team by any strategy. 00:39:50 Speaker 1: Probably an anomaly year for him, but his role off the bench be one of the fastest guys on the field. I think the Mariners are gonna take it. So I think that puts a rap on our in field grades could definitely be better. We were expecting more, but this is what happened in the twenty twenty three season, and that's good. We talked a little bit about these infielders with Mike Salk and it was good to get him on. We've been wanting to have Mike on for quite a while now finally able to make the connection. You made the connection in the Team Mobile Park press box and we were able to get him on. It's good to hear a little bit about his career and everything else Mariners Late. I mean, this dude wakes up four point thirty every morning to do his show six to ten on Seattle Sports, and it's like this is all he talks about. And he was a great interview and very authentic, very much like he is on the air. It was good. It was good to finally get him on. 00:40:42 Speaker 2: Yeah, very smart, very knowledgeable, passionate as you could tell. And he knocks his show out of the park every morning, by the way, both him and Brock do on. Brockensaut because you know, it's not easy to get up that early and do those shows. I don't know if I'd have the energy for it every morning for years and years and years, but Mike does it, and he does it as well as just about anybody in the business. So to have him on and talk Mariners with him and his career, it's pretty cool. 00:41:06 Speaker 1: So to get the full circle of Brockensack that we've actually now had on this podcast. We have the full circle of it on all fourteen years. Let's get to our interview with Mike soft. 00:41:18 Speaker 2: All right, we've got Mike Sack on with us, host of Brockensauck on Seattle Sports. He's joining us after what a pretty slow news week. Huh. 00:41:26 Speaker 4: Yeah, this was unique, that's for sure. I mean, you know, with the Mariners season obviously coming to the end, and then Cal's comments and then JP's comments, and then Jerry's comments, and then yeah, we have the opportunity to talk to Jerry today. It was unique, to say the least. It was. You know, look, doing an interview like today with Jerry is it's one of the highlights of the job because you know, you know there's gonna be a lot of people listening. I sort of made a joke about earballs on it today, and you know there's gonna be a lot of people listening to it, and that it feels like kind of a big responsibility the fan base is entrusting you with to ask the questions that they want in a big moment like that. And at the same time, as I've mentioned a bunch of times, on the show. Jerry's under no obligation to do that interview everything. He doesn't need to, he's not paid to do it, he's not required by contract to do it. So you know, there is a bit of a line to be walked. And I know there is a probably small segment of the fan base that wants blood in every one of those moments that wants you to go for the juggular and wants to do what they can't do, which is to yell at Scott or Jerry or whomever it is that they're frustrated with. But the reality is it's an interview. It's an opportunity to gain information and opinion from the guests, and so tried to give him and put him an opportunity to do exactly so. 00:42:54 Speaker 1: Mike, you mentioned with the interview you were doing with Jerry today that you fell a little bit nervous for it, And I don't know if that was nerves for the responsibility of you doing the interview and wanting to get the right answers, or on the other side, worried what kind of answers you were going to get from Jerry. Which one of those do you think it would have been. 00:43:15 Speaker 4: I think probably more of the first one. I mean, you know you doing it. Brock and I have been doing this, what fourteen years, the better part of fourteen years. We've interviewed a lot of people, We've done a lot of it together, I think in our time. The biggest one I mentioned that we've done is probably Pete Carroll the morning after the Super Bowl loss, where he's got to come out and explain himself and what happened in this absolutely you know, watershed moment for the organization, for the city and for the fan base, et cetera. And you know he'd handle that, and ten out of ten, of course, he just absolutely nailed it. You know. I think it's just sort of knowing that everything is going to be judged afterwards, right, Jerry's going to be judged, We're going to be judged. You only have a certain amount of time. It's not like doing a twenty twenty Barbara Walters interview or something where you can do it for four hours and then edit out, you know, create the absolute best parts. You get in this case some twenty four to twenty five minutes, and you want to make the most of it. You want to ask the right questions. We've taken some interviewing classes over the years, and you know some of the some of the quote unquote rules of doing an interview, right, trying to ask questions that will solicit a response and not yes or no and not give the opportunity for somebody to kind of dodge out of it. So yeah, I think it just requires a little bit more extra preparation than your average every day interview. And yeah, look there's sort of two types of radio. Right, You've got the interview you do weekly with somebody like Jeff Passen or you know, sort of a media person that may or may not be a friend. They're probably not looking to stonewall you, right, I mean, they're coming on because they want to talk. So we don't have to make such an effort to ask some great questions, you know, can be more of a conversation, and we try to do that a lot with our guests. With something like Jerry today, I mean, you're asking questions, you're trying to get at answers, and so just like a little bit of different style. 00:45:19 Speaker 1: So after what he said on Tuesday and now what he said now today on Thursday, of course, this interview is going to air next week when people are listening to this, But just just to bring it full circle, are you do you think they took enough responsibility for the result of the season. 00:45:36 Speaker 4: Yeah, look, yeah, I mean I've never felt like Jerry didn't take responsibility for the season. I mean, they fell short, there's no doubt about it. He is trying to make an argument, which I think has some validity that while the goals they fell short of their ultimate goals, they didn't make the playoffs, they didn't improve on last year, there were positives in sort of the foundation of what they're doing. He's right. I mean, if you go back, there's farm system is in better shape than it used to be, and they do have a young nucleus. There are there's a lot of reasons to be excited. If you're a Mariner fan, I would certainly hohe The flip side of that, though, is they lost two more games than they did a year ago. They didn't make the playoffs. Teams around them, specifically the Rangers, obviously got better, and you know, there's now some question marks due to Cal's comments and JP's public comments about you know, what the strength is of and the belief is inside that clubhouse, right. You know coaches and managers that are often talk about buy in. You know, all of a sudden, we've got a question about what the level of buy in is to what they're doing. 00:46:49 Speaker 2: Did you know these quotes were going to go as viral as they were because I was sitting a few seats down from you during that press conference, and that was the first real sit down presser I'd been in, So maybe I was a little bit naive, and I was also trying to soak in an hour's worth of content. But I read your your article on seven ten sports dot com this this week in Seattle Sports about what that press conference kind of resulted in and how fans took it and everything, and you said you were pretty appalled after Jerry said that we're doing the fan base a favor thing. So did you think this was gonna kind of spiral the way it did? 00:47:22 Speaker 4: Well, Yeah, you were sitting just a couple of seats down for me. I'm I'm, I'm. I was curious if you heard me gasp, because I did, and when he said I went, I was. I was fairly shocked that those words come out of his mouth. I knew it had the capability of becoming that big a story. I didn't know. You never know whether everyone else is going to pick up on it the same way. But I sure wasn't surprised. I mean, that was, you know, unfortunately for Jerry, because I don't think it's it's what he meant to say. It drowned out everything else that he said over the course of basically an hour, and I don't think he had any choice but to come out a couple of days later and walk those comments back, apologize, say he was embarrassed, say that it's not what he meant to say. And I think he tried to do a lot of that when he came on the show. 00:48:13 Speaker 1: What's Jerry's biggest flaw? 00:48:17 Speaker 4: You know, I don't know that I know the answer to that, and I feel maybe a little uncomfortable answering the question. I I don't know what he's liked to work with, what he's liked to work for, what he's like for the other gms. You know, I think Jerry, I don't know if it's a flaw or not. He would probably tell you it's a strength. He likes to separate himself from the clubhouse. He is not, you know, It's funny because he's such an engaging person. He's not tried to be a relationship guy inside the clubhouse. It seems as if he's sort of left that to Scott and to the man, you know, to the managerial staff, et cetera, the onfield staff. You know, it seems to have led to some interpersonal things with Kyle Seeger with right over the years, and now you sort of have this series of issues over the course of the last week or two or three. Maybe if you want to go back to George Herby, you know, I think that one's certainly a question mark. But you know, it's really hard for me. Ultimately, what is his job as the president of baseball operations Build a winner, right, And he's done such a great job. I think of building a developmental system, drafting very well over the last few years, especially building something where pitchers are turned from average to well above average. I mean, they seem to have a pretty good system going. Where Jerry has yet to really succeed in his career is taking a good team and turning it into a great one, right, Taking a team, And I think that's why fans and everybody else were so agast at the fifty four percent comment because it's it fits the easy answer, right, Hey, how come this guy's been able to get teams to a good place but not a great one. Well, if he's only looking to win fifty four percent of the games, that makes sense. You get, you know, you're perfectly designed to achieve the results you get. I don't think Jerry wants to win fifty four percent of his games, and he said today very clearly that is, you know, a baseline, not an average. But I think that's still the biggest question mark about Jerry. I won't call it a weakness, but I would definitely call it a question mark. Can he take a team that's good and has a good nucleus like this one and turn it into a great one. But last time he tried to do it, he had an older veteran team that wasn't gonna get much better and didn't have much in the cupboard, in the in the farm system in terms of assets to help it improve. Was also at the top of its spending. It wasn't going to improve. There was no real avenue to go from good to great. Now he's got the avenues. The players are you know, the core is young, it is legitimate. It's got, you know, room to grow, you would hope in terms of payroll, and more than anything, it's got a farm system behind it that it can either add to what you've got here by by coming up and helping themselves or by helping to acquire the players you need to get over the top, and it's up to him to show everybody that he can do that. 00:51:11 Speaker 2: So going off that, and you answered it a little bit there in that answer of yours, but what do you think Jerry's biggest strength is? 00:51:17 Speaker 4: Well, yeah, I again, I still feel a little uncomfortable answering not, you know, just because I'm not around the guy every day, and you know, I think that what Jerry has done. I also think we misunderstand the role of somebody in his position, you know. I think we tend to imagine someone like Jerry GM president baseball offs whatever, as like on the phones all day talking to every other GM, pulling trades right like, you know, get ready to sign free agents, and that that's where they spend all their time. Certainly that's a part of the job, but there's a reason it's general manager in these days, management of a gigantic staff below you has become an enormous part of that job. I forget how many people are in baseball ops for the Mariners. I don't know if it's one hundred, but that number doesn't sound insane to me, so don't quote me on the number. But remember that there's a huge staff underneath Jerry and justin Hollander. They've got, you know, analytics people and scouting people, advanced scouts and pro scouts and amateur scouts. They've got minor league coordinators, minor league people, the minor league coaching staff. And some of that job is managing that enormous staff of people. And you know, that is something that I know had been a problem for previous regimes with the Mariners. How do you organize and manage all of that information and all of those people. From what I've been told, that has improved greatly in under Jerry's tuolage and leadership over the course of the last few years. And it's important, right, I mean, if you can't manage the people, then you can't do that job, even if you were the greatest of value of talent in the world. Jerry's done a pretty good job of choosing a lot of the right, young talent. I think there's still some question marks about choosing some of the major league talent that you're bringing back in trades at Sea. 00:53:13 Speaker 1: So that group has a really big responsibility this offseason through a number of different avenues to improve this baseball team. There is one big ones. They have a lot to plan out, and I think you do too, Mike. I was curious, do you already are you already sort of thinking ahead, like what a show might look like if the Mariners actually managed to sign show Hey, o TONI versus Okay, what are we gonna say if they don't sign him? Because the reaction will be quite strong either way. 00:53:44 Speaker 4: I wouldn't say I plan it out now. I mean that would be impressive if I have I mean, that would be great. I'd sleep more, that's for sure, Like, oh yeah, all right, hey guys, load up the pro show Hey, Show let's go. That would be awesome. In fact, now I kind of have to think of a good idea. No, I mean, you know, you've got to react in the moment, and certainly Show Hey will be a conversation. But look, you know, is the reaction going to be negative if they don't sign Show Hey? Probably, but you're setting yourself up to be upset if you are banking on Showy Tony signing the Americas. I just don't know why he would. I mean, you know, if I'm him, I'm leaving a dumpster fire in Anaheim. I'm going to come to a place that has, you know, gone through this public issue here over the course of the last few weeks, real or not real. I mean, the the actuality of the situation might be that being here is awesome. But if I'm show Heyo Tommy, and I'm looking at this, the perception of it is probably pretty challenging. So I don't know what's going to motivate him. He's kind of a mystery to everybody. Is it going to be location. Is it going to be star power, Is it going to be ability to win? Is it going to be money. Is it going to to be the nucleus, the manager, the pitching coach, the hitting coach. I mean, we don't have any idea what's going on in Shoeotani's head, but I think we do know that he's already not chosen to be here once that there's a lot of very real reasons to go to La where the Dodgers seem to have everything in line, and you know, my guess is that's where he's gonna end up, where it's all said and done. So am I gonna be angry with the Mariners for not signing show? Hey? No, I just I don't. I don't think that's a reasonable position to take. Do I think they need to give it there all? Yes? But I also think they better be ready to pivot incredibly quickly because the next best player available to them is Juan Soto and he's not Shootani, nobody is, but he's pretty darn good. And if even if you only get him for the one season after you deal for him, I think that would be a much more realistic target because it's a little bit more in your control, not entirely, you need the other team to agree and like your prospect package, et cetera, and somebody else doesn't trump you, et cetera. But yeah, man, i'd want to be ready to pivot real quick to trying to get another impact player. 00:56:12 Speaker 3: Okay, So I have two follow ups to that. 00:56:13 Speaker 2: Number One is it sounds like you feel like what's gone on over the last few weeks between Kirby between Cal between Jerry's comments may have negatively impacted how Shohe is viewing Seattle. 00:56:24 Speaker 4: I mean, I guess may it may have. I mean, I guess I have felt all along like shohe Atani is going to go to the doctor. So it's it's been difficult for me to look at this and say, oh, yeah, no, this is you know, the nail on the coffin. It's not going to happen. I never really thought it was going to happen. I think it's in fun argument and a fun conversation. It's great to be excited and hopeful, but I've always felt like that was kind of setting up most fan bases for disappointment. And you know, unfortunately, I think the results of this year may all of a sudden put the Rangers into a category of being an intriguing second option for him. So, you know, if you're a Mariner fan, I'd be really almost hopeful in some ways that he goes to the Dodgers and exits the division. Just stop being in the AO West, please. So yeah, I don't know for sure. Again, nobody knows what's going on in show his head, but I don't think the perception was great. So I don't know how it would have helped. 00:57:20 Speaker 2: And then my second follow up to that is, now you bring up one Soto, who is an incredible talent. However, he is also a Boris guy, and he's starting to sound like Trey Turner a little bit in terms of having an East Coast preference. So if you're the Mariners, do you truly give up a haul for one year of one Soto? 00:57:36 Speaker 3: If it's you, I. 00:57:37 Speaker 4: Don't know whether it is a haul anymore. I think that's sort of the difference. Whereas if you were trading for Juan Soto when the Padres did, you were going to get what at that point, two almost two and a half years of Juan Soto. Now you're trading for a year of Wan Sodo. The reality is that's just not as valuable in the market as it used to be. Right, what does Wan Soto cost? I know, Passing said, you know, kell Nick, a picture and two other prospects. I don't know if it's that much, To be honest with you, I don't think he you know, I would guess it's more like Kellnic and a prospect maybe a second. And you know, some of that depends the Padres, like kelnict. Some teams probably do, some teams probably don't. I mean, like, it's easy for us to just throw out a name, but Aj Preller is a human being who has preferences and has his own baseball you know, organization with hundreds of people that are all going to do their analysis, and maybe they think they can unlock Jered Klnick. Maybe not. So it's easy for us to say, like, ah, just Kelnic in a prospect, Oh, how come they didn't get it done? Well, maybe Preller doesn't like it, Jared Kelnick, right, So it's it's there's real human beings involved. I don't I don't know whether the cost for one year of SODO is something that you can't get past. I think you can afford. 00:58:55 Speaker 1: And another guy whose name has been lightly floated as a guy you could trade off this roster is Logan Gilbert. I personally don't think they should trade Logan Gilbert. I think he makes their team better than whatever they could fetch on the trade market. So if Juan Soto is not worth, say what Logan Gilbert could potentially bring back in a trade package, Is there anybody anybody that you would I would say, trade him for? 00:59:19 Speaker 4: Yeah? I mean, I think there are some ways in which you trade Logan Gilbert, and boy would I hate it. I love Logan Gilbert as a person, as a guy to talk to, as a dude on the mound. There's nothing about Logan Gilbert I don't like at all, like zero. So I love having him on the team. And I think that nucleus of Fristillo and Gilbert and Kirby is the envy of most teams in Major League Baseball. I love it. So all of this is sort of hypothetical. The reason you think about it is if you could go sign pitching somewhere else and bring something in, can you I don't know, but there are more pitchers than hitters available on the market this offseason. If you think you could reasonably well replace that production, could you make a deal with the Orioles. Let's say the Orioles don't win the World Series. Let's say they lose in the ALCS and it becomes and by this point, maybe the Orioles are out by the time we have this airs some who the heck knows all sound still, but you know, maybe maybe the Orioles decide, all right, we just need it all. I mean, like We've put together this incredible lineup with this unbelievable farm system. We've got a bullpen, but let's face it, the starting pitching in Baltimore is not what it is and a few of the other towns. Yeah, we're willing to give up something big to go get a guy like Logan Gilbert, who they would then control for what four years I think it is at that time, maybe it's only three, but you get my point, Like, okay, maybe that is. I don't know if it's Gunner Henderson, but like, they've got some real dudes on that on that rostered in that organization, some of whom are major league ready. I don't think you're gonna get Jackson Halliday, but maybe there's that type of a dude who comes in and changes the game. Cedric Mullins, unfortunately is probably a little too old now to be that guy. But if he was a year or two younger and with more club control, I'd be like, yeah, what I trade Logan Gilbert for a Cedric Mullins two years ago? Yeah, I think I would in that situation where I could sign pitching and now all of a sudden, I got an outfield with Julio and Cedric Mullens and maybe I can go find one other bath. Yes, pretty intriguing. So you know, I think those are the types of moves that Jerry's gotta be. 01:01:36 Speaker 3: Yeah, the Orioles are an interesting one. 01:01:37 Speaker 2: So we've talked about the Cardinals, and we've talked about the Orioles just in terms of teams with some young bats that need pitching, because there was a lot of ties at the deadline, whether they were real or not between the Mariners and the Cardinals. Just in terms of teams that had needs. Yeah, that would be interesting, just because if if the Orioles weren't willing to trade Jackson Holliday or Gunner Henderson, and I'm assuming they wouldn't exactly be quick to move off those guys kind of becomes the core of there's Heston Kurstad or Jordan Westburg. There's some guys like that where I guess I'm just sitting here and thinking back and forth. Would those guys cost the Logan Gilbert. I guess if you get into the second tier of the Orioles prospects, maybe that's more in the wu or Miller category and May and I guess that becomes a question of what the Mariners deal one of those guys. 01:02:20 Speaker 4: They're all fair questions, I mean, and I don't know that they want to deal any of their pitching. I mean, they made it pretty clear on Tuesday that that was not something they're looking to do. So all of this is sort of, you know, not just hypothetical, but maybe hypothetically unlikely. But you have a lot of pitching, and you know, all of this conversation I think would be different if Robbie Ray was due back in April. But Robbie Ray being due back at the All Star Game at a minimum, I think maybe changes the equation a little bit. Yeah, you may get Marco back, which would be interesting. Do I think that's you know, like, I don't think that's going to be a big part of their season next year. You know, it sounds like like Emerson Hancock will be ready to go and he make him meat for a spot. That's great, But I be it's gonna be hard. I think without Robbie Ray coming back as that veteran that you have some level of faith in in the starting rotation, I think that makes a little harder for them to think about making a big deal. 01:03:26 Speaker 2: I guess if we were going to get into your career a little bit here, Mike, as I talked about something. 01:03:32 Speaker 3: I don't think it is. 01:03:33 Speaker 2: I think you've had some pretty interesting stuff happen in your career, and I mean, where do we even want to start? 01:03:37 Speaker 3: You know what? 01:03:38 Speaker 2: Here, I'll start with this because this is your third rendition of Brock and soft here. And I remember connecting with Brock a few years ago. We have a family friend who connected me with them, and he was telling me the story of your guys' start, and he was telling me how when he auditioned over at seven ten, they tried him out with a few different co hosts. And I'm sure he's talked to you about this at length. And he just told me a little snippet of it that when he was going through some of the potential partners, he walked away from it at the end saying, you know, most of them are pretty gray. But I don't know how I feel about that Salt guy. And now here you are, basically all these years later, and you're what I would say, the face of Seattle Sports radio. So my question is, how did your chemistry kind of evolve over the years to get as good as it is now. 01:04:22 Speaker 4: Well, it took time, that's for sure, because he's not the only one who came away from that meeting thinking I don't know if that's going to be the right fit. I was unemployed. The station I was working at in Boston was folding. I came out here for that interview literally after not sleeping. I had been on my honeymoon in Nicaragua, which our flight home got canceled by over a day, and I missed my connection back to Seattle for this interview. I mean, it was a disaster. And you know, I'm sitting there that morning because I've been out of country for the previous two weeks, and I'm over at the station knowing I'm going to do something with Brock, something with Kevin Collaboro and some other third thing. And I remember calling Albert Breer and Keith Law who were friends of mine in the business, and just like, Bert, tell me everything you can tell me about the Seahawks in five minutes, and he's like, okay, veteran team at a crossroads. Holmegroun just left. Here's where they're at. Like okay, quick scribbling down notes. Keith, tell me about these Mariners, and he's like, well, Junior's coming back old teen, this and that kind of a okay, got it, like wrote down all these notes furiously and then started doing the the mock shows and you know, I started doing it with It's funny too. The guy who hired me had told me I had the job. He was not accurate, but he had told me, oh, yeah, you got the job. We just want to come bring you out and figure out where the best spot is for you. So I'm like, oh great, this is awesome. I got the job. And uh so they do I do some stuff with Brock and Kevin. I'm able to basically, like you know, transcribe exactly what Keith and Bert had told me. And then they're like, hey, will you guys, you and Brock just do something that has nothing to do with toward us. And somehow Brock and I ended up talking about pew all up in the pig races and all of that, and I was just making fun of them, and and uh yeah, that was the thing that sort of caught the ear of a couple of people at the station who were like, you know what, that chemistry is unique. There's this like you know, conservative Christian good guy with this liberal Jewish East Coast, you know, paint in the butt, and what if we stick them together and maybe that sort of natural friction will work. Well. Unfortunately, the first year of it didn't work at all. I mean, it was awful. If any you know, I know, there's always people I meet people who are like, oh, I've been a listener since the beginning. I'm like, no, you are. Nobody was listening at the beginning. We got the ratings, we were like twenty eighth in the market, a point one share. Brock and I wanted to kill each other. We had no idea what we were doing. I'm trying to be coast hot take guy. Like everybody. I grew up listening to Brock's nodding along and not saying anything. Every time he doesn't say anything, I'm like, all right, I gotta go big, I gotta say something more interesting. People are getting mad. I mean, it was a disaster. So it did take us a long time to figure out that we worked well together and to trust each other and to lean on each other. And you know, as we sit here fourteen years later, you know, there's no one outside my family that I feel closer to than Rock. I mean, we we there are a lot of duos. I'll just sort of finish the answer on this. There's a lot of duos around the country, honestly, that don't care for each other that much. I'm not saying they outright hate each other. But they come in, they do the show, they leave, That's the extent of it. They're not that invested in each other's lives. They're just coworkers. Some actually don't like each other, but you know, most of them are just coworkers. I think neither of us are really capable of doing that. I mean, I think the way our show is set up, it's built on a friendship and a desire that each of us have to talk to each other. So yeah, I mean, I you know, don't make me cry, because I will occasionally cry when having this conversation because Brock does mean that much to me. So yeah, we we we like to give each other a lot of grief, but I think, you know, I think it hopefully comes through that that comes from the love and the trust that we have on the job. 01:08:23 Speaker 1: Do you ever sit back and think about how much the Seattle sports scene has changed since you guys started in two thousand and nine until when you guys reunited again last September, there wasn't a hockey team, right, The baseball team has changed drastically and the city has a championship all in that span from start to now third time through, and how you guys talk about it and how your chemistry evolved, Like how do you ever do you often think sit back and think about that stuff. 01:08:55 Speaker 4: Yeah, I really appreciate being called old right here on the podcast. That's great. I really appreciate that. Yeah. Look, I mean everything is since then. I mean, you know what I probably think of more, honestly, and I think more about how a city has changed since two thousand and nine. I think about how Brock and my lives have changed since two thousand and nine. Right, I mean I came out here, I was thirty years old on the button and you know, I'm forty five now and I've got two kids and Brocks kids who I met right when I first came out or in colle it. I mean, like it's such a complete Like I think we are so different in such different stages of our life that I probably end up thinking about that more. The Seal sports scene look it's different, but it's funny. I don't think of it as being that that different. The Sonics still haven't come back. They had left the year before I got here. The Mariners are still trying to figure it out and trying to become a championship team. And you know, they've made the playoffs once in that in that fourteen year stretch. And you know the Seahawks, Yeah, they've changed since year one. They haven't changed that much since year two when Pete Carroll came in. I mean, you know, he came in almost as soon as we got her as one year or mora and by the next year Pete was in. So yeah, it's a funny question because it has changed a lot. The fan bases have certainly changed a lot, the interest in what people are concerned about has changed a lot. Mariner's ownership has changed, Seahawks ownership has changed, Mariner's general managers. I mean like a lot has changed. And yet I actually feel like more is the same than more is different when it comes to the Mariners. That being said, as I've mentioned them before, sometimes I'm late to the party on these things, and sometimes I think things are still kind of moving in one direction, and I don't realize that the world's taken a left turn and left me behind. So you may be a lot more accurate on this one than me, But I don't know. I tend to kind of think that things are more similar than they are different now. 01:10:52 Speaker 1: And I've been curious about this to peel off from sports just a tiny bit, because you didn't start in sports, did you? 01:11:00 Speaker 4: And radio? I've never done any non sports radio, Okay, but I started my career in the political world right in Los Angeles working for a US congresswoman her campaign. Went from there to an LA City council person, and then to a lobbying firm in LA lobbying before I decided I wasn't so. Yeah, that was I was like twenty six, twenty seven something like that when I decided to get into this job. 01:11:30 Speaker 1: So you must have been the one in the break room just just fireing off, just whatever's on your mind. 01:11:37 Speaker 4: Yeah, I wish, I wish I could take you inside the lobbying firm I worked at it. It's probably the worst environment. Well I shouldn't say I had work second worst environment I've ever been in in terms of just a you know, just a really tough place to work, and it wasn't enough at that point to convince me that it's not what I wanted to do for a living, and just said, you know, out I always liked sports, I always liked radio. I never thought I would work in either field. But a good friend of mine from college, friend of my named Bristol, just said to me one day we were having dinner. She's like, do what are you doing? Stop denying your passions. Go try to be in sports radio. And I'm like, what's dumb? Never gonna work. Nobody gets into it. I'm not an ex athlete. I've never done any radio before. You know, the shot is won in a million to even break in. How many twenty six year old dudes think they want to get into sports radio, especially from Boston, Like, you know, I couldn't be more of just a number. She's like, hey, try for a few years, see what happens, because whatever you're doing is making you miserable. And she convinced me. I went home and talked to my then girlfriend now wife and just like, think I might do this. She was incredibly supportive, and you know, I went about it kind of talking to some of the right people in La. I knew people who knew people in you know, DJs or sports hosts or whatever. And Matt money Smith who was now on I forget which he's on. 01:13:02 Speaker 1: He's with Petros, isn't he with Petros? 01:13:04 Speaker 4: And he's great. At the time, he was doing sports for like the sports updates on the Kevin em Bean Morning show on k Rock, And I knew somebody who knew him and he talked to me. He spent an hour talking to me. He was awesome. A guy named Jose who was doing some of the same stuff I'm sorry, Joe Joe Grim Joe Grimm who was doing some of the same stuff for Big Boys Show in LA. He took me in and let me come watch him do a show one morning, which was awesome. And Ryan Roscillo, who I used to listen to every day in Boston on a defunct five thousand crappy station. Ryan took my emails and talked to me and got the phone with me and gave me a lot of great advice and actually ended up helping me get my first internship where I basically worked for Ryan, who I think the world of. So you know a lot of a lot of people who've since then been incredibly successful in their careers, were just really really nice to me, a generous with their time as I was trying to figure out my career. I also got lucky if I was trying to do I mean in a lot of ways. But if I were trying to do that now, it's harder. There are fewer internships, there are fewer stations. This stupid industry has killed almost every way for us to develop people. We don't have any more late night shows, we don't have any more weekend shows. We no longer have Sports Center updates or whatever you want to call them, on almost any station. There's so few ways to gain experience to get into the business that you know, I feel terrible when younger people come to me and say, hey, what do I do? Dude? I don't know. I mean, I do what you guys are doing. For sure, I do a podcast. I'd make sure I'm practicing every day. But I don't have a good answer for people, and I think it's one of the biggest problems our business has. We're not growing the next generation of hosts very well at all, and so when somebody like as Stacy Ross makes it onto the air and gets a show. You gotta support the heck out of her because she's so freaking talented, but it's hard to get the reps, and thankfully Stacey has. Stacy's the best. By the way, I think you're not far away from I appreciate what you said, Lyle about be in the face of sports radio in this town. I don't know if this is the face anybody wants to put on it, but I don't think you're too far away from saying that you know about bumping Stacy, but specifically about Stacy, who I think is just unbelievable talented. So h and that's not a shot bumps awesome too. I love all the folks at our station. We've some really good people. I just because Stacey and I do more of the same job right as people that lead the show. I just I think she's gonna be killing I think Charity is, but I think she's only gonna get better. 01:15:53 Speaker 2: Okay, I got one quick spin off since you talked about your little career journey there when you worked for Rissillo as somebody who listens to his podcast Life Advice good back. 01:16:01 Speaker 4: Then, so you know it's funny, Ryan and I have never gotten along that well. I don't think he likes me very much, which is funny. Maybe he would hear this and be like, no, I think it's fine. But I think that he and I don't have life, like we sort of rub each other wrong. I don't know what the reason for it is. I think he just I do know. I shouldn't speak for him. I don't really know, and I just I think he's brilliant. I think he's one of the absolute best in this business and has been forever. When he was on that station, I mean, this has gotta be two thousand and three, maybe two thousand and four, something like that, he did a bit that I thought was so freaking funny at the time, called the Sunday Night Girlfriend, where he was like, you know, I really think there should be some sort of a service for dudes on Sundays where you get a girlfriend just for Sunday night, and he's like, you know, just to hang out with, just to like, you know, watch the Sopranos with at the end of a weekend of like going out and partying, Like all of a sudden, all my buddies with girlfriends like disappear Sunday I'm looking around, like, you know, what do I do? And I just I thought it was the funniest darn thing in the world. Obviously he was joking, and it's probably not a bit that he or anybody else would do today. Different climate, different world, different everything, but it just always sort of struck me as sort of part of his ability to relate to the audience, which is Ryan's He's so smart, so talented in so many ways, but I think his best strength is his ability to relate to his listener, And especially then when he was in his late twenties, maybe thirty years old, he just felt like everything I was thinking in my head he was saying on the radio. So yeah, I think the world Ryan, I really did. 01:17:43 Speaker 1: There's an interview you did last year, very notable one that you guys had Richard Sherman on your show, and I think Low and I talked about this when you had it on it. If you haven't, if you have not heard this interview, I think it's still up on your Guys podcast page. You can go back and find it and listen to it and understand what we're talking about. But you know, Sherm, well, I think the way to say this is. You know, athletes won't always come up to you and say what they feel about what you said, even if they've heard it. They won't always do it. But Sherman, very on brand to himself, told you how he felt about that live on an interview. You were unprepared, You had no idea that's what he was thinking coming on that showy and he just he laid it on you right away. And I thought, and Lyle did too, did a great job of handling that and not getting flustered as and I all think about that. I work in radio two, and if someone did that to me live on the air, just totally catch you off guard like that, especially someone as notable as that, I don't know how it would react. But you handled it great, And I'm just curious, how how do you prepare yourself to handle a situation like that? 01:18:51 Speaker 4: You don't, I mean, like I guess I would say, I didn't know Richard Sherman was going to do that that day, and I really appreciate it. Thank you. That's a nice, a nice compliment. I appreciate it. I didn't know he was going to do that that day, but I wasn't shocked, you know, what I mean, Like, I mean, you know going into it that this is the same Richard Sherman who yelled at Skip Bayless and all the things that Richard had done over the years, and you know going into it that I've been critical of him for a million different reasons, and I stand by every one of them. You know, I wasn't shocked. I thought it was great the kJ was able to get him to come on. I thought and assumed that once he had agreed to come on, he was willing to have a normal conversation where we would sort of pretend that there was nothing going on that there was. And I didn't even know that he knew who I was. I mean, like, you know, I've heard sometimes that guys do and sometimes I have no idea. So I I wasn't shocked. I didn't know it was going to happen. And I guess I just I don't know. I've learned over the years not to get your dander up. It's against my nature. Probably I'm probably wired more like Sherman, probably more like Jared Toto in some ways to to sort of wanna, you know, go right back and argue things out. I just didn't think it was appropriate in that moment, and I've experienced a lot of different ways in which athletes have gotten upset at me. I know it's part of the job. I try to make myself accessible. It used to be before kids, going into locker rooms and clubhouses so that if I said something, you'd see my face. I don't like operating from an ivory tower. Admittedly I lost some of that over the years as kids become a bigger part of your life, and going down to the ballpark every afternoon for two or three hours just isn't a real possibility when you're schlepping around the city as a lead chauffeur with your kids. I mean that that changes just unfortunately, your life dynamic. But you know, a lot of those guys have handled differently, and I've told all these stories on the air. I mean, Richard never said a word and blocked me on Twitter. Oh that's the other reason. I wasn't that surprised he blocked me on Twitter, and so when he came up, it was like, Okay, that's how he wants to operate. Bobby Wagner, who's a class act in every conceivable way, got in touch with me with a DM at some point and ended up texting and just said, dude, what's the deal. I hear you're saying stuff about me that it's not positive. And he and I talked it out and I stood by what I had said, but gave him more context to it. And Bobby and I, I wouldn't say we're close. We're not close. We're not friends. I don't mean that, but we have a good relationship and you know, we're certainly able to communicate and we understand where each other are coming from. You know, Doug Baldwin and I didn't get along for a really really long time. Gee spilled the beans unfortunately that I did talk to him recently and sort of clear the air there. And there have been plenty of others. I mean, the Kyle Seeker comments caused some consternation a year or so ago, but Mitch Haniger and I talked about them and explained, you know, where we were each coming from when it came to that. So you know, the reality is athletes tend, I won't say always, but tend to be shown or hear the negative comments that people made about them. They also tend to live in a bubble where almost everyone around them says positive things to them, and so that's just a natural friction point. I think for an honest sports radio host, an honest critic, and an athlete and a they don't hear the positive things that go with it. Be sometimes they don't even really hear what was said. They only hear just a snippet or not even the right information. And see that's jarring to them because most everywhere they go, everybody kisses their tail and tells them how awesome they are. So, you know, I get it. Athletes don't want to be criticized. They don't want to be held accountable. Who does the heck wants to be held accountable. I don't want to be I don't like when people tell me that I've done something dumb on the show. I totally understand why they don't want to be told that they did something wrong in a game or in their life. But unfortunately, our cottage industry has been set up to kind of judge a lot of those things and offer commentary on them. So it's a little it's a weird balance, there's no doubt about it. But I appreciate you saying that I handled the Shehrm thing. Okay, Ultimately, I think Brock and I have learned to laugh at some of those things. And that's why our opens have Jimora yelling and Brock or Sark getting mad at us or Shrm or whatever the case may be, because generally self deprecation and laughing at yourself tends. 01:23:17 Speaker 1: To be the best mass because of the similarities of the situations. Does this leave the window open for debate television? What's Sherman about ten years? Oh? 01:23:26 Speaker 4: Yes, absolutely, I mean, of course, yes, I think I would enjoy talking to Doug more than I would enjoy talking to Sherm just stylistically, but of course, man, I mean, you know, if Richard can I mean money talks obviously, so if Sharam can make it work with with Skip now, yeah, let's look at two thousand and thirty three for the Salt and Sharm shows. 01:23:47 Speaker 2: See if we were going to wrap this up on one more lighthearted note. Mike, you guys got a call this week from just the Pride of Maple Valley so off that I thought i'd ask you if off, just off the top of your head right here, you could rank your three best callers. 01:24:05 Speaker 3: Ever, do you think you can do it? 01:24:07 Speaker 4: Well? You know, it's in some ways a cheat because Brock and I spent a while doing a top five collar ranking a few years ago in iteration number two of Rock and Saft. We did sort of a rotation top five collar thing, so you know, I kind of remember who they were at that time. I mean, Roger Tacoma has always been a great caller for everybody, not just our show. I mean he's a legend. And we've met Roger, great dude, you know. And he came in and I don't know if you remember this story, but Roger we invited him in. Brock probably invited him in. That's a Brock thing to do. And so he invited him in and Roger sits down next to me and we get him all ready, and he's a great caller. I mean, Roger always comes with it. And we turned to him like hey Roger, and we asked him a question. He goes, I mean like the noise he made is so sad. I mean, we haven't a cut on tape. One second noise, it's terrible. And so Roger panicked in the moment, that's for sure. I mean, he's probably the guy that I always would think about when when you when you ask me who the best is. But there have been a lot of others over the years, and it's interesting how some will kind of come in and then they'll drop out for a while, and you know, I get it. You know, people's lives change and maybe they're you know, given to music for a while and then come back to sports radio or whatever the case may be. But I do like talking to callers. I mean, I wish it was still something we did more. When I first got into this business was right as programmers were starting to go away from the phone call as being a primary part of sports radio, and the thinking at the time was, why would you ever give up control of your show to somebody or to people that you don't know what they're gonna say. Right. It's one thing when I give up control of my show to Jeff Passen or Jerry Depoto, because I know, I know who they are, I know roughly, you know the type of thoughts they're going to have. But when you go to you know, Joe and wherever, you don't know what that person's gonna say, and they might call up and talk about something that you don't want to talk about, or isn't the right conversation for the day, and I think programmers start to really freak out about that, and so the the the I think they started saying, hey, don't take phone calls unless you've asked a question, unless there's a specific topic that everyone is talking about. Well that got sort of game of telephoned out, and all of a sudden people heard don't ever take phone calls. Phone calls are bad, and I don't think they are. I think the one of the great unique things about live sports radio in a world that is increasingly more you know, things like this that we're doing and less things that I do every day, is that there's immediate live reaction and connection with fans. Right It's instant, and you can do some of that I know on Instagram, and I'm not saying that can't be recreated in other ways, but radio still has as this cool instant reaction sports bar element where you can take local reaction and in a world that is increasingly national right where where ESPN and the big you know, it's great's what Skip and Shuram does. Great. But if you only want to hear Seahawks and you want to talk to somebody about the Seahawks, good luck, right, And so I do think that sports radio will always have that role. It may not be on AM one day, it may not be on FM one day, it may exist only through YouTube or whatever, you know, whatever format it will change into. But I guess I just certainly I hope so, because otherwise I'm not going to make it to retirement. But I really do have a lot of hope and belief that that will always be kind of the thing that allows this business to continue. The desire for us all to talk to each other about sports, and it's an awesome common ground thing about people, right. I mean, alltics are divisive, I don't know, you've heard over the last couple of years a little bit divisive, but sports tend to be very you know, they bring people together, and social capital and community I think can really be enhanced through talking about sports. So I'm not telling myself or in any way I'm not a hero, trust me, but I do support what our industry does because while it can be combative and it can be negative if you let it be that way, and I'm guilty of doing that, I like it. I like that we get to talk to each other, and I think sports are pretty horrible in our life. 01:28:39 Speaker 1: Last thing from me, Mike. I'm a little surprised we didn't get any honorable mentions in that ranking. Just a little bit. 01:28:47 Speaker 4: What do you think? Are you a rank fan or are you with more. 01:28:50 Speaker 1: It's a little disorganized? 01:28:51 Speaker 4: Oh my god, No, Oh isn't the point? 01:28:55 Speaker 1: Isn't the point of a ranking to have people debate what you left out of the ranking, because if you include it in the honorable mention, I feel like it's less likely people are to complain and drive the conversation. 01:29:08 Speaker 4: It's an interesting point of view. You know. If Moro would say something like that, then we'd have like an actual debate. 01:29:15 Speaker 3: Yeah. 01:29:15 Speaker 4: Yes, that's the point of sum ring. It's not the point of this. 01:29:19 Speaker 1: Ranking, that's true. Yeah, that's fair. That's fair. 01:29:22 Speaker 4: I don't know. We just have fun with it, Justin and I love the bit. I think it's fun to I think it's fun to try to think of as many things as you can do. And I think it's something that a lot of people I know do naturally. And you know, you're right, there is something to leaving out a lot of it, some of that blank space. But I also think the like I didn't think of that one is sort of part of the fun of it. So I like it. I like I love music. It's a big part of my life, and I like it. In an opportunity to have just a few minutes to kind of explore that I would have been just as happy becoming a music DJ as I would have becoming a sports radio host. Love music. It's always been into it, probably more into it, honestly than sports radio over the course of my life. So it's a it's maybe it's a passion project. But I enjoyed doing it the last few men. 01:30:12 Speaker 2: Well, Mike, this has been awesome. We appreciate all the time you've taken to talk with us today. We enjoyed talking Mariners. We certainly enjoyed hearing about your career, and we hope to do it again soon because this has been awesome. 01:30:22 Speaker 4: Some of the some of the crazy Mariner questions that you know that Dylan and Logan and those guys. Again, I was prepared for wild and whacky. 01:30:31 Speaker 2: Well, we're not exactly the payroll Twitter people. We think more on along the lines of you, So we weren't planning to come with any questions like that. 01:30:39 Speaker 4: You're the best, No, I love that you guys do stuff like this. I think it's awesome. You guys do a great job, and I just appreciate it. Thanks for having me on and asking me to tell bad stories about myself. I appreciate it. 01:30:52 Speaker 2: Really really enjoyed that conversation with Mike Sock. He is such a great guy to talk to, not just about baseball, but about his career and the business, the industry as a whole. One of the smartest people out there in terms of sports media and certainly in the Seattle market. I hope you guys have checked out Brock and Salt by now. If you haven't, you should probably start turning on your radio dials and listening to them in the mornings because they're awesome. As you can tell from this interview with Mike. That'll just about wrap it up for this edition of the Marine Layer podcast. You guys know the drill. If you want to listen to the full form podcast, you can do so on Apple, Spotify, Google, and Amazon. That's on our audio side. If you do that, make sure to follow us download our episodes. Leave us a five star review. I know we always stress it, but truly we do mean it. The reviews on the downloads help us out a ton, so be sure to do that and watch us on YouTube too. Make sure to watch us on YouTube. We've got a video side to the podcast head over there, like comment, subscribe, turn our notification bells on, and also follow us on social media. Do you want player interviews and show clips and hypotheticals and the whole nine yards thrown out there to you in the off season. Follow our social channels. We're on Instagram, TikTok, Twitter and YouTube shorts at Marine Layer Pot. 01:32:01 Speaker 3: That's t J. I'm Lyle. 01:32:03 Speaker 2: As always, we thank you guys for tuning in. Talk to you soon. 01:32:37 Speaker 4: Sh