Lyle and TJ open the episode expanding on the conversation about Alex Rodriguez that was sparked earlier in the afternoon (2:30). They then dive into the free agent profile of Japanese slugger Munetaka Murakami and whether or not he would be a fit in Seattle (19:56).
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00:00 --> 00:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Open episode number 323 of the Marine Layer podcast.
00:03 --> 00:06 [SPEAKER_00]: It's our first free agent profile of the off season.
00:06 --> 00:12 [SPEAKER_00]: And we are looking at Japanese slugger, Monotaka, Murakami, does he fit the Mariners?
00:12 --> 00:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Doesn't make sense for the Mariners to sign him.
00:15 --> 00:17 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll dive in and take a look at it.
00:17 --> 00:38 [SPEAKER_02]: Reminder you guys, just make sure you stay on on top of all of our stuff because we'll be busy all off season and if you want to make sure you're doing that, everything's over on our website that's marinelayerpod.com you can find all of our episodes there if you're listening, please go download and rate and review five stars, same thing if you're on YouTube although that version of it would be hitting subscribe and leaving a like and dropping a comment.
00:38 --> 00:40 [SPEAKER_02]: All that stuff really does help big time it supports the channel.
00:40 --> 00:43 [SPEAKER_02]: You can also find our merch and our Patreon over on our website.
00:43 --> 00:45 [SPEAKER_02]: We love seeing people rock the merch.
00:45 --> 00:49 [SPEAKER_02]: then you can find us all across social media as well at Marine Lair pod.
00:50 --> 00:50 [SPEAKER_02]: Let's get it rolling.
01:04 --> 01:22 [SPEAKER_00]: And I welcome you to this episode of the Marine Lair podcast part of the just baseball podcast network recording here on Sunday evening November 9th, and we're at the part of the offseason where yeah things are slow and down a little bit and the most interesting things.
01:22 --> 01:24 [SPEAKER_00]: kick up the mayor's fan base on a given day.
01:25 --> 01:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's use today, Sunday, while, as an example, I'm coming back from vacation today.
01:31 --> 01:35 [SPEAKER_00]: I've, for the most part, been unplugged from the mayor's world for about two days.
01:36 --> 01:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Not paying attention at all.
01:38 --> 01:43 [SPEAKER_00]: We had a wonderful mailback episode on Friday where we answered a range of questions.
01:44 --> 01:55 [SPEAKER_00]: We answered one about Alex Rodriguez, or I guess we answered the question and made it about Alex Rodriguez, and while I'll decide it for this afternoon on Sunday, post about it.
01:56 --> 02:02 [SPEAKER_00]: But the clip out there, man, did I not realize how much people had to say about A-Rod?
02:03 --> 02:06 [SPEAKER_00]: How did you not realize you've never seen this discourse before?
02:06 --> 02:08 [SPEAKER_00]: I have seen it.
02:08 --> 02:22 [SPEAKER_00]: I told you I was unplugged So when I opened my phone, I get back here home and we're getting ready for the episode I'm like out of all the things that we're gonna get charged up about here on November 9th.
02:23 --> 02:24 [SPEAKER_00]: This is it
02:25 --> 02:27 [SPEAKER_02]: Again, I just, I don't know how you're shocked.
02:28 --> 02:30 [SPEAKER_02]: I've seen this topic come up so many times over the years.
02:30 --> 02:31 [SPEAKER_02]: We've talked about it.
02:32 --> 02:37 [SPEAKER_02]: And every time we do, we get people commenting about how much they despise A-Rod, which is ridiculous in my opinion.
02:38 --> 02:38 [SPEAKER_02]: It's absurd.
02:39 --> 02:44 [SPEAKER_02]: I understand, let me preface it with this, because I know we have a listener base of a wide range of ages.
02:45 --> 02:53 [SPEAKER_02]: I understand the TJ and I are in our mid-20s, and we didn't get the full experience of having to endure A-Rod leaving after 2000.
02:54 --> 02:58 [SPEAKER_02]: but it still feels like a little much after 25 years.
02:58 --> 03:04 [SPEAKER_02]: People are still this mad and don't want anything to do with a guy that, again, I set it in the clip and I set it on Friday's pod.
03:05 --> 03:10 [SPEAKER_02]: At his peak, you can very much argue the best player this franchise has ever had.
03:12 --> 03:14 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, people like being petty.
03:15 --> 03:16 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know, man, it's just crazy.
03:16 --> 03:21 [SPEAKER_02]: It's crazy to me that it's not just the fan base, too, but it's the mariners themselves.
03:21 --> 03:30 [SPEAKER_02]: If you look up on the wall at the mariners spring training complex in Pioria, out on the backfields, they have all these memorable mariners that they have up on the wall.
03:30 --> 03:31 [SPEAKER_02]: And it's all the guys you'd expect.
03:31 --> 03:35 [SPEAKER_02]: There's Junior, there's Edgar, there's... Who else?
03:35 --> 03:38 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, all of everybody, I think Raul Abhanya's is up there.
03:38 --> 03:39 [SPEAKER_02]: Jamie Moyers obviously, up there.
03:39 --> 03:41 [SPEAKER_02]: J.B. Eunar's obviously up there.
03:42 --> 03:42 [SPEAKER_02]: No air rod.
03:43 --> 03:43 [SPEAKER_02]: You know what?
03:43 --> 03:47 [SPEAKER_02]: Air rod did that none of those guys all did or any mariners ever done.
03:48 --> 03:54 [SPEAKER_02]: The man had three eight war seasons before he turned 25 years old.
03:54 --> 03:56 [SPEAKER_02]: The absurdity of that is really not talked about enough.
03:57 --> 04:09 [SPEAKER_02]: And whether you like him or not, it just feels like there's a piece of the mariner's story that is a massive, massive chapter that essentially gets boxed away by everybody.
04:09 --> 04:14 [SPEAKER_02]: The franchise itself, the fans, and it doesn't make any sense because I understand people didn't like that he left.
04:15 --> 04:16 [SPEAKER_02]: But,
04:16 --> 04:17 [SPEAKER_02]: He was amazing.
04:17 --> 04:19 [SPEAKER_02]: He's, again, maybe the best player they've ever had.
04:21 --> 04:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Let me ask you something.
04:23 --> 04:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Now that I've had a little bit more time to think about it, do we think it's more because he left or more because he cheated?
04:30 --> 04:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Because he is the most famous and successful baseball player to get caught cheating and juicing.
04:38 --> 04:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Is he the old to get caught?
04:39 --> 04:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Well caught.
04:40 --> 04:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Barry Bond's never got caught.
04:41 --> 04:42 [SPEAKER_00]: He retired.
04:43 --> 04:45 [SPEAKER_02]: Roger Clemins never got caught.
04:45 --> 04:46 [SPEAKER_02]: I got Sammy Sosa tech.
04:46 --> 04:47 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, Sammy Sosa corked his bat.
04:48 --> 04:50 [SPEAKER_02]: So he's up there juicing.
04:50 --> 04:59 [SPEAKER_00]: I will say juicing because the downfall of a rod's Legacy in Major League Baseball is the fact he juiced and he cheated.
04:59 --> 05:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Who knows if he was cheating while he was a mariner?
05:03 --> 05:05 [SPEAKER_00]: He was definitely cheating while he was a Yankee
05:06 --> 05:34 [SPEAKER_00]: but that part honestly doesn't matter the the question is so clear so here's here's the scenario clearly there's people high up in the mariner's organization who don't like a rod and still don't like a rod and there's a lot of people who have been around the mariner's org or been in charge of the mariner's org since a rod was a mariner like first avenue entertainment who owns the mariner's many of the heads of that John Stan Chris Larson a lot of these guys have been around
05:34 --> 05:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Since those A-Rod days, someone or multiple people clearly hold a grudge against A-Rod for something, what is it?
05:43 --> 05:44 [SPEAKER_00]: Is it the question?
05:44 --> 05:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Is it because you don't want to put someone who essentially artificially inflated his stats because he juiced or because he left?
05:53 --> 05:57 [SPEAKER_00]: One of those, I will say one of those is a little bit more acceptable than the other.
05:58 --> 06:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Which ones more acceptable?
06:02 --> 06:05 [SPEAKER_00]: It's more acceptable to keep him off there if he was juicing.
06:05 --> 06:12 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, because because we're because it's like, here we go, uh, here we go, young players.
06:13 --> 06:14 [SPEAKER_00]: We have a player who juiced.
06:14 --> 06:16 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's put him up there and set him as the example.
06:17 --> 06:20 [SPEAKER_00]: As opposed to, oh, we don't like him because we're petty because he left.
06:21 --> 06:22 [SPEAKER_00]: That's a little childish.
06:25 --> 06:28 [SPEAKER_00]: See, I almost... Works it.
06:28 --> 06:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Let me add one more thing.
06:31 --> 06:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Does Barry Bones have his number retired in San Francisco?
06:34 --> 06:40 [SPEAKER_02]: So I'm glad we just got to this, because for a while there, we were on the lines of got caught cheating versus we assume he cheated.
06:41 --> 06:45 [SPEAKER_02]: So now that we're on the topic of Barry Bones, David Ortiz getting his number retired in Boston?
06:45 --> 06:46 [SPEAKER_02]: Yes.
06:48 --> 06:52 [SPEAKER_00]: So Ortiz never got suspended, though.
06:52 --> 06:55 [SPEAKER_00]: No, but remember that was he, neither are Bones.
06:56 --> 07:01 [SPEAKER_02]: But Aura did very famously, but now you're talking about, hey, bonds is numbers, not retired.
07:01 --> 07:04 [SPEAKER_02]: David Ortiz's number is going to be retired.
07:04 --> 07:10 [SPEAKER_00]: But we're talking about the most famous person ever who got caught and was suspended for cheating.
07:11 --> 07:14 [SPEAKER_02]: It, there's no end, like, he, that happened.
07:14 --> 07:16 [SPEAKER_02]: No, it happened, but I just don't care.
07:16 --> 07:20 [SPEAKER_02]: You cannot tell the story of the Mariners without arguably the best short stop and reply the game.
07:20 --> 07:22 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's, and that's 100% right.
07:22 --> 07:28 [SPEAKER_00]: But if they're keeping him off there because he cheated, I, I think it's a little more understood.
07:29 --> 07:30 [SPEAKER_00]: You, I think both things could be true.
07:31 --> 07:41 [SPEAKER_02]: I just, see, I don't even wanna do this and I don't wanna get into this that much because I wanna do nothing but shower praise on all these Mariners that everybody grew up loving.
07:41 --> 07:48 [SPEAKER_02]: But like, if we're going down this route, man, Nelson Cruz is beloved in this city.
07:48 --> 07:49 [SPEAKER_02]: Who is he?
07:49 --> 07:51 [SPEAKER_00]: No, Cruz up on that poster.
07:52 --> 08:04 [SPEAKER_02]: No, but again, it's not like the org has he come back to throw a first pitch has had a showered him with praises You can have a point as fair, right, but we're talking about Oarning your number retirement.
08:05 --> 08:07 [SPEAKER_02]: Same example is not even talking about that.
08:07 --> 08:11 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm talking about just giving him as flowers You don't have to retire number three.
08:11 --> 08:18 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm saying Robinson could up Robinson cano was better baseball player than Nelson Cruz has he come back Not yet
08:20 --> 08:21 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.
08:21 --> 08:21 [SPEAKER_02]: Will he come back?
08:21 --> 08:27 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, Kenos should be appreciated and like, look, he was on five teams that didn't make the playoffs.
08:27 --> 08:34 [SPEAKER_02]: I get it, like somewhat more than I would, A-Rod, but Kenos wasn't that type of player.
08:34 --> 08:39 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I would still shower Kenos with a lot of deserve praise because he changed a lot of the culture in Seattle.
08:40 --> 08:44 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm just saying the Mariners haven't been inconsistent with this.
08:45 --> 08:50 [SPEAKER_02]: Again, Nelson Cruz has come back to throw first pitches and been around the team and he's not, he's never not retired, but he's been honored.
08:50 --> 08:51 [SPEAKER_02]: Erad's never gotten anything.
08:52 --> 08:55 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm not saying retire three, I'm saying he should be, like, showered with his flowers.
08:56 --> 09:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Different caliber of player, different legacy, different, in the right.
09:00 --> 09:03 [SPEAKER_02]: Nelson Cruz never had a 10-war season with the Mariners.
09:04 --> 09:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Exactly my point.
09:06 --> 09:10 [SPEAKER_00]: But like we're just talking about different tiers of players here when it comes to what you're accepting.
09:11 --> 09:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Like Nelson Cruz has a very small chapter in Mariners history that the Mariners are able to accept and let him come back But a rod like on top of the fact that people are petty he left also is the most famous cheater
09:30 --> 09:32 [SPEAKER_02]: Again, I don't, that doesn't do it for me.
09:33 --> 09:41 [SPEAKER_02]: There's too many guys across the game that have juice and taken steroids and still been absolutely beloved and honored and showered with praise by their respective franchises.
09:42 --> 09:43 [SPEAKER_02]: Regardless of all that.
09:44 --> 09:46 [SPEAKER_02]: And Aira just kinda passed over.
09:46 --> 09:51 [SPEAKER_02]: Again, the Mariners essentially act like he never existed and fans act like he never existed here.
09:51 --> 09:54 [SPEAKER_02]: The only thing they'll acknowledge that he existed for are the negative things.
09:55 --> 09:56 [SPEAKER_02]: What should the Mariners do?
09:58 --> 10:00 [SPEAKER_02]: You can do what you've done for other guys.
10:00 --> 10:04 [SPEAKER_02]: Even if you're not going to retire as number, why can't you have an A-Rod Knight?
10:04 --> 10:05 [SPEAKER_02]: Why can't he throw out a first pitch?
10:06 --> 10:08 [SPEAKER_02]: Why can't you do an A-Rod promotional giveaway?
10:09 --> 10:12 [SPEAKER_02]: Something for a weekend that's about him, even if you're not going to retire as number.
10:12 --> 10:16 [SPEAKER_02]: This all sparked because the question was, who would you put in the Mariners Ring of Honor?
10:16 --> 10:21 [SPEAKER_02]: While the Mariners might not have a ring of honor, he's somebody who should be in their ring of honor.
10:21 --> 10:24 [SPEAKER_02]: If you're not going to retire as number OK,
10:24 --> 10:26 [SPEAKER_02]: but he should be honored.
10:26 --> 10:27 [SPEAKER_02]: That's what I mean.
10:27 --> 10:28 [SPEAKER_02]: He should be in the Mariners Hall of Fame.
10:28 --> 10:30 [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, yeah, there you go.
10:30 --> 10:30 [SPEAKER_02]: 100%.
10:31 --> 10:31 [SPEAKER_02]: Percent.
10:32 --> 10:32 [SPEAKER_02]: Yes.
10:32 --> 10:37 [SPEAKER_02]: The current manager of the Mariners had an 80 career WRC plus and it's in the team Hall of Fame.
10:37 --> 10:45 [SPEAKER_02]: A 10-win player over a season and like a 35-win player over six years before he turned 25, should be in the Hall of Fame from the team.
10:46 --> 10:48 [SPEAKER_02]: Like there, that's a perfect example.
10:48 --> 10:49 [SPEAKER_02]: You should be in the marathon game.
10:50 --> 10:51 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's fine.
10:51 --> 10:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Again, I'm just saying the Mariners have been consistent because Nelson Cruz is not the Mariners' whole of fame.
10:55 --> 10:57 [SPEAKER_00]: Robbie Canoe is not the Mariners' whole of fame.
10:57 --> 10:59 [SPEAKER_00]: And both those players are better than Dan Wilson was.
11:00 --> 11:02 [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, not yet is the key.
11:02 --> 11:04 [SPEAKER_02]: I wouldn't be shocked if Nelly one day is in there.
11:04 --> 11:07 [SPEAKER_02]: But again, they've still honored Nelly.
11:07 --> 11:10 [SPEAKER_02]: They've still give it like they've still done promotional stuff for Nellie.
11:10 --> 11:11 [SPEAKER_02]: They're like the post about him on social media.
11:12 --> 11:13 [SPEAKER_02]: Like that's the other thing too.
11:14 --> 11:17 [SPEAKER_02]: That's what I mean by it seems like he never existed, a rod.
11:17 --> 11:20 [SPEAKER_02]: There's not a mention about him anywhere.
11:20 --> 11:21 [SPEAKER_02]: At least that I've ever noticed.
11:22 --> 11:24 [SPEAKER_02]: It's it's like they want it.
11:24 --> 11:34 [SPEAKER_02]: fans and the team want to act like he never existed and that's what bothers me because you had arguably the best shortstop in the history of baseball at his peak on your team and it's like he was never there.
11:35 --> 11:39 [SPEAKER_02]: That's what doesn't sit right for a franchise that doesn't have a lot to celebrate.
11:40 --> 11:53 [SPEAKER_02]: You should celebrate what was somebody performing at the top of their game and at the top of what baseball's ever seen in a position when he was with your
11:55 --> 11:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
11:55 --> 11:56 [SPEAKER_00]: I like that answer.
11:56 --> 11:57 [SPEAKER_00]: I do.
11:57 --> 11:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
11:58 --> 12:01 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm just, I'm not necessarily arguing against you.
12:01 --> 12:06 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm, I'm merely just trying to provide another right point for more of this.
12:06 --> 12:08 [SPEAKER_00]: Because they have had some cheaters in their history.
12:08 --> 12:13 [SPEAKER_00]: And again, like so Nelson Cruz, like, he's very easy to root for.
12:13 --> 12:15 [SPEAKER_00]: He's universally liked in baseball.
12:15 --> 12:17 [SPEAKER_00]: He's want to be nicest people ever.
12:17 --> 12:20 [SPEAKER_00]: If you want to take the stats away, you want to take the cheating away.
12:20 --> 12:22 [SPEAKER_00]: You want to take the fact that A-Rod left away.
12:22 --> 12:28 [SPEAKER_00]: his personality while he was playing was also not the most embracing for people.
12:29 --> 12:31 [SPEAKER_00]: And like that is also a factor here.
12:31 --> 12:33 [SPEAKER_00]: It's been 25 years, man.
12:33 --> 12:36 [SPEAKER_00]: I know, but I'm just, I mean, I'm just telling you how it is.
12:36 --> 12:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Look, if you act that way, some people never forgive it.
12:40 --> 12:43 [SPEAKER_00]: It's the same thing with Barry Bonds.
12:43 --> 12:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Barry Bonds was an asshole when he played.
12:46 --> 12:55 [SPEAKER_00]: And he's still to this day does not get a fair shake because all the people who are in charge of putting him in the Hall of Fame, he treated like crap.
12:56 --> 13:03 [SPEAKER_02]: All I'm going to say is this, Aerood was forced to make a very tough decision in his mid-20s, where your prefrontal cortex is not even fully developed.
13:04 --> 13:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, be bored for a while.
13:06 --> 13:09 [SPEAKER_02]: And be bored for a while.
13:10 --> 13:12 [SPEAKER_00]: Some people say I went to Harvard with words like that.
13:14 --> 13:27 [SPEAKER_00]: There's some people who don't who maybe some people or some of our listeners will appreciate that I just mentioned that and some will some will think that while But I really I understand I understand just how enormous this moment is anyway.
13:27 --> 13:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Go ahead.
13:28 --> 13:28 [SPEAKER_02]: It's good.
13:28 --> 13:29 [SPEAKER_02]: I hope you do.
13:29 --> 13:30 [SPEAKER_02]: I didn't go to Arizona.
13:30 --> 13:31 [SPEAKER_02]: Please your favorite subject in school.
13:32 --> 13:33 [SPEAKER_02]: and go to Arizona State for nothing.
13:33 --> 13:35 [SPEAKER_02]: It was recess to answer your question.
13:35 --> 13:39 [SPEAKER_02]: Now, as we move on here, prefrontal cortex was not fully developed.
13:39 --> 13:41 [SPEAKER_02]: You had to make an incredibly tough decision.
13:41 --> 13:51 [SPEAKER_02]: There's a lot of people in your ear and by the way, the difference in contract offers, as you mentioned on Friday's podcast, was $162 million.
13:51 --> 13:57 [SPEAKER_02]: I would encourage everybody who's got any vitriol tours aeroid to stop and think about two things.
13:57 --> 14:07 [SPEAKER_02]: Number one, if that contract was placed in front of you at either 25 years old or even right now, but especially when you were 25, the difference in those two contracts.
14:08 --> 14:10 [SPEAKER_02]: Number one, is there a single one of you that's not taking it?
14:11 --> 14:19 [SPEAKER_02]: I can personally tell you, I'm taking this contract that A-Rod took a million out of a million times, of course I am, and I'm guessing most of you are too.
14:19 --> 14:23 [SPEAKER_02]: And number two, and I really wanna hit this one home.
14:24 --> 14:27 [SPEAKER_02]: What would the narrative be if that happened now?
14:27 --> 14:31 [SPEAKER_02]: Not if it happened in 2000, like it did, post 2000.
14:32 --> 14:41 [SPEAKER_02]: If it happened now, because I'll tell you what, enough narratives have changed, probably for the right reasons, in baseball now, where if A-Rod were to do that today,
14:41 --> 14:46 [SPEAKER_02]: The narrative is not A-Rod is selfish and hashtag payroll and all these things.
14:47 --> 14:49 [SPEAKER_02]: You know what the narrative is going to be.
14:49 --> 14:59 [SPEAKER_02]: If A-Rod was presented a contract by the Mariners and a contract that was $162 million more by another franchise and took the latter, you know what the narrative would be in today's day and age.
15:00 --> 15:01 [SPEAKER_02]: Had that happened now.
15:01 --> 15:03 [SPEAKER_02]: That just didn't happen today.
15:03 --> 15:04 [SPEAKER_02]: It happened 25 years ago.
15:05 --> 15:10 [SPEAKER_00]: What do we think is the best comparison for A-Rot that we can compare going forward, like how the franchise handles this?
15:10 --> 15:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Because given the like the PR perspective of Nelson Cruz, I don't know if that's fair.
15:16 --> 15:26 [SPEAKER_00]: Why don't we measure how the Mariners in the future handle Robinson Kino versus handle A-Rot?
15:26 --> 15:34 [SPEAKER_00]: To mind you, to infielders, to infielders that played for the Yankees and were most famous when they played on the Yankees.
15:35 --> 15:39 [SPEAKER_00]: And two players who were really, really, really good, and also two players who were suspended for PEDEs.
15:41 --> 15:43 [SPEAKER_02]: Again, Robbie spent a little bit less time here.
15:43 --> 15:46 [SPEAKER_02]: He wasn't, he didn't grow up in the org.
15:47 --> 15:49 [SPEAKER_02]: He didn't come through the farm system, and he also never made the playoffs.
15:50 --> 15:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, like fine, but like, it runs legacy is not playoffs anyways.
15:56 --> 16:01 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm just saying he was, I part of three different teams that made the playoffs.
16:03 --> 16:07 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I guess, but I still think that's the best comparison.
16:07 --> 16:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Like if the Mariners in the future, or giving out a Robinson Cano Bobblehead, yes.
16:14 --> 16:17 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, again, Robinson Cano should not be ignored either.
16:17 --> 16:30 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, when all the competitive season started, when they signed Robinson Cano, 2004 to 2013 was some of the most dog shit fucking baseball I've ever seen in my entire life from any franchise.
16:30 --> 16:32 [SPEAKER_02]: Those 10 years were in a bombination on every level.
16:33 --> 16:34 [SPEAKER_02]: That change when Robbie came to town.
16:35 --> 16:36 [SPEAKER_02]: They won 87 games.
16:36 --> 16:38 [SPEAKER_02]: And then there was high expectations, very high in 15.
16:38 --> 16:40 [SPEAKER_02]: And yes, they missed the playoffs out there.
16:40 --> 16:41 [SPEAKER_02]: Expectations were sky high.
16:41 --> 16:43 [SPEAKER_02]: 16, almost made the playoffs.
16:44 --> 16:47 [SPEAKER_02]: 17 were in the playoffs race for a while.
16:47 --> 16:49 [SPEAKER_02]: 18, one almost 90 games.
16:49 --> 16:52 [SPEAKER_02]: Like everything shifted when Robbie got here.
16:53 --> 16:56 [SPEAKER_02]: So yes, I would not ignore what Robbie did here either, because he was a great player.
16:56 --> 16:58 [SPEAKER_02]: He was still worth every bit of that contract.
17:00 --> 17:11 [SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, again, everything you said can be right, but I do like I understand from a meritor's perspective, you're not going to honor someone who got busted for PEDs while playing for you.
17:11 --> 17:15 [SPEAKER_00]: While you paid him, mind you, $240 million dollars.
17:15 --> 17:18 [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, but also, it's not like he's been shunned out of a game of baseball.
17:18 --> 17:20 [SPEAKER_02]: He's all over the postseason.
17:20 --> 17:21 [SPEAKER_02]: He's all over broadcast.
17:21 --> 17:23 [SPEAKER_02]: He's all over social media.
17:24 --> 17:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Like we're shifting back to A-Rot, we're talking Robby Known.
17:28 --> 17:31 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I'm talking about A-Rot because that's the main focal point of this subject.
17:31 --> 17:32 [SPEAKER_02]: A-Rot is all over the game of baseball.
17:33 --> 17:34 [SPEAKER_02]: It's not like he's been shunned out of the game.
17:35 --> 17:44 [SPEAKER_02]: It's the mariners who choose not to really give him any honor and the fan base who chooses they still want to shun them 25 years later for a contract that again.
17:44 --> 17:50 [SPEAKER_02]: I think every single person presented with that situation is taking the Ranger's contract like A-Rot did.
17:52 --> 17:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, do you think the Texas Rangers should do the same thing?
17:56 --> 17:57 [SPEAKER_00]: It's got a lot less time there.
17:57 --> 17:58 [SPEAKER_00]: But sure you could honor him.
17:58 --> 17:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Not that much.
18:00 --> 18:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Not that much.
18:03 --> 18:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Hmm, there's a little less.
18:05 --> 18:07 [SPEAKER_00]: A-Rod's primary season's 96.97.
18:07 --> 18:08 [SPEAKER_00]: 98.99.
18:08 --> 18:09 [SPEAKER_00]: 2000.
18:10 --> 18:13 [SPEAKER_02]: Say A-Rod's been, yeah, that's what I thought.
18:13 --> 18:18 [SPEAKER_02]: He spent three years in Texas, not like the six in Seattle and coming up through the five in Seattle.
18:18 --> 18:20 [SPEAKER_02]: He barely played 95.
18:20 --> 18:21 [SPEAKER_02]: I guess.
18:21 --> 18:25 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm just saying, like, yes, I would still, I would honor A-Rot again.
18:25 --> 18:29 [SPEAKER_02]: You a people in the Hall of F- I don't want to, I don't want to like shun any name.
18:29 --> 18:39 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't want to like tarnish any names, but there's people in the Mariners Hall of Fame that don't even hold a candle to not just the career A-Rot had, but what he didn't see at all.
18:40 --> 18:43 [SPEAKER_00]: One season of what A-Rot didn't see at all.
18:43 --> 18:44 [SPEAKER_00]: No, more than one season.
18:45 --> 18:47 [SPEAKER_00]: I know.
18:48 --> 18:53 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm saying A-Rot is as good as good enough for one season's worth of play to put him in the Mariners whole thing.
18:53 --> 18:55 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, essentially what I'm saying correct.
18:55 --> 18:56 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
18:56 --> 18:59 [SPEAKER_02]: A-Rot with the Mariners again put up, oh, I'm sorry.
18:59 --> 19:01 [SPEAKER_02]: I sold him way short earlier.
19:01 --> 19:03 [SPEAKER_02]: 38.1 wins above replacement.
19:04 --> 19:10 [SPEAKER_02]: And that includes a 94 and 95 season where he combined to play 65 games total.
19:11 --> 19:14 [SPEAKER_02]: Like nobody's done what he did.
19:17 --> 19:21 [SPEAKER_00]: I guess we'll see in the future whether or not he gets forgiven.
19:21 --> 19:26 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I'll tell you what, I have a new goal of this podcast and I already told you what it is before we start.
19:26 --> 19:31 [SPEAKER_02]: I'll just tell everybody listening, I want to get it, air out on, is it an attainable goal?
19:31 --> 19:31 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know.
19:32 --> 19:38 [SPEAKER_02]: Does it mean we can't try, no, we'll try, because I think it would be a fascinating interview.
19:39 --> 19:44 [SPEAKER_02]: I would, I would be all for just getting to pick his brain about a lot of different things.
19:46 --> 20:13 [SPEAKER_00]: I like I am all for aero getting as flowers in Seattle you don't have to have your number retired you should be honored you should be promoted you should be in the Mariners Hall fame okay I think that's a good note to end this conversation on we do have speaking of controversial middle and fielders or middle and fielders just in fielders we have another one we needed we need to talk about our first free agent profile of this off season is none other than
20:14 --> 20:21 [SPEAKER_00]: talk about a very polarizing prospect to come over to Major League Baseball and potentially play.
20:21 --> 20:23 [SPEAKER_00]: He was posted earlier this weekend.
20:23 --> 20:27 [SPEAKER_00]: So he's officially a free agent for Major League Baseball teams to go sign.
20:28 --> 20:34 [SPEAKER_00]: When I say that named to you for the first time, how do you feel about the idea of him in a Seattle Mariners uniform?
20:36 --> 20:42 [SPEAKER_02]: She should have asked me this two
20:43 --> 20:47 [SPEAKER_02]: Now if you ask me, I'll just be point blank here.
20:48 --> 20:48 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm out.
20:49 --> 20:53 [SPEAKER_02]: I would not get near Moot of Takamura economy if I'm the Seattle Mariners.
20:55 --> 21:15 [SPEAKER_00]: The story with Murkami is that in 2022 was his breakout at 22 years old get 56 home runs He walked and struck out essentially at equal rates about 20% of the time of peace and He was as phenom as phenom gets if he
21:15 --> 21:20 [SPEAKER_00]: was a free agent that year and decided to come over to Major League Baseball.
21:20 --> 21:26 [SPEAKER_00]: He would have had to make the league minimum, but you would have had 20, you would have had all 30 teams of Major League Baseball clamoring for his services.
21:27 --> 21:29 [SPEAKER_00]: But now that he's made it to age 25,
21:30 --> 21:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Uh, he is an, essentially unrestricted, right?
21:33 --> 21:36 [SPEAKER_00]: So he can sign for whatever amount he wants.
21:36 --> 21:38 [SPEAKER_00]: It could be $200 million.
21:38 --> 21:39 [SPEAKER_00]: It could be $80 million.
21:39 --> 21:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Depends on what the market is.
21:41 --> 21:49 [SPEAKER_00]: What the problem is in the two, the, the three seasons he said since then, his numbers have been good.
21:49 --> 21:53 [SPEAKER_00]: They haven't been that good.
21:53 --> 22:04 [SPEAKER_00]: As the enters history agency, the strikeout rate has gone up, the walk rate has gone down, there are some major concerns with how much he swings and misses, and he also doesn't play defense.
22:05 --> 22:06 [SPEAKER_00]: It's a tough combo to sell.
22:06 --> 22:10 [SPEAKER_00]: There's a big risk attached to Moon Ataka Murakami when he comes over.
22:11 --> 22:19 [SPEAKER_00]: And I guess I'll say at this point for a little bit, because we need to dive into some of the details of this first, but for the Seattle Mariners specifically,
22:20 --> 22:24 [SPEAKER_00]: They just can't afford as much risk with a player.
22:25 --> 22:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Just based on how much they spend, they can't.
22:29 --> 22:31 [SPEAKER_02]: And the projections for them are all over the place.
22:31 --> 22:35 [SPEAKER_02]: You've got CBS projecting that he could get up north of $120 million.
22:35 --> 22:41 [SPEAKER_02]: You have Kylie McDaniel of ESPN who thinks it'll be on the lighter side more like five years for $80 million.
22:42 --> 22:45 [SPEAKER_02]: But no matter what, Monataka Murakami's going to get paid.
22:45 --> 22:59 [SPEAKER_02]: And it feels like the only teams that are really going to take a risk on that type of contract are the teams that do not have some limited budget, teams that are not afraid to take a big swing and teams that can swallow a bad contract if it goes south.
22:59 --> 23:00 [SPEAKER_02]: Who does that limit?
23:01 --> 23:02 [SPEAKER_02]: Who does that limit Mercom?
23:02 --> 23:03 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my god.
23:03 --> 23:04 [SPEAKER_02]: Who does that limit as services to?
23:05 --> 23:13 [SPEAKER_02]: The teams you'd expect, Dodgers, Yankees, Red Sox,
23:13 --> 23:14 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, teams like that.
23:15 --> 23:16 [SPEAKER_02]: You know what would be hilarious?
23:16 --> 23:17 [SPEAKER_02]: You know what would be hilarious?
23:18 --> 23:21 [SPEAKER_02]: You know what would be the perfect team to sign this guy?
23:22 --> 23:25 [SPEAKER_02]: V-A's, uh, close, but I was gonna say the angels.
23:29 --> 23:30 [SPEAKER_02]: that would be perfect.
23:30 --> 23:33 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it would be so on brand, wouldn't it?
23:33 --> 23:36 [SPEAKER_00]: He will hear me out, a low pressure and fire.
23:36 --> 23:38 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it doesn't get more low pressure than that.
23:38 --> 23:49 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, you're playing in front of a bunch of retired people in Orange County with a team with zero expectations to win anything, knowing you might get paid the most money to go to the angels.
23:49 --> 23:52 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I feel like low key that could be a spot.
23:52 --> 23:53 [SPEAKER_00]: He lands.
23:54 --> 24:03 [SPEAKER_00]: And they could play him in the field for him to be terrible out there because they clearly don't care about putting the players in the best position at all.
24:03 --> 24:08 [SPEAKER_00]: So, and I feel like Showhake could say, yeah, I enjoyed my time with the angels.
24:09 --> 24:09 [SPEAKER_00]: Did he though?
24:11 --> 24:11 [SPEAKER_02]: I think he did.
24:11 --> 24:16 [SPEAKER_02]: Did you see some of the camera shots they get a showhake in that last year?
24:16 --> 24:17 [SPEAKER_02]: How miserable he looked?
24:18 --> 24:24 [SPEAKER_00]: Show hey though is like a forgiving person and I also, I just don't think he'd be the one to like publicly trash on something.
24:25 --> 24:25 [SPEAKER_02]: Not publicly.
24:26 --> 24:28 [SPEAKER_02]: What about when Moon of Takamura County asked him behind closed doors?
24:30 --> 24:32 [SPEAKER_00]: What if the angels offer him like $180 million?
24:33 --> 24:37 [SPEAKER_02]: Well then that may be where he winds up and that's why I'm suggesting that could be a landing spot.
24:38 --> 24:41 [SPEAKER_02]: In that case, the Americans will get to see him a hell of a lot over the next five to seven years.
24:42 --> 24:47 [SPEAKER_02]: It'll feature a shit ton of strikeouts and every now and then he's going to run into a few homers.
24:47 --> 25:09 [SPEAKER_00]: Here's some interesting tidbits about monotochomer economy, so the the career season if you want to go dial up baseball reference or fan graphs and take a look at it for yourself 2022 is the year you want to look at that is the peak of monotochomer economy, but it's not really a good thing for international prospects especially Asian players who need to get posted and come over here
25:09 --> 25:17 [SPEAKER_00]: to peak three years before you become a free agent, because then we have a whole lot more to scrutinize as he's heading to free agency.
25:17 --> 25:24 [SPEAKER_00]: So this pasties and he had to deal with some injuries, 56 games, he still had, while we're talking about regression.
25:24 --> 25:27 [SPEAKER_00]: This pasties, and he still had a 210WRC plus.
25:27 --> 25:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
25:28 --> 25:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's not fool people into thinking he sucks because he does not suck.
25:33 --> 25:40 [SPEAKER_00]: No, the ceiling of this guy might be higher than any prospect that is coming from Japan from an offensive perspective.
25:40 --> 25:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Now, keyword is might.
25:42 --> 25:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Keyword is might.
25:43 --> 25:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Can I emphasize this again?
25:45 --> 25:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Keyword is might.
25:46 --> 25:54 [SPEAKER_00]: Show Hayo Tani is proven that you can be a good hitter in NPB and come over to majorly
25:54 --> 25:56 [SPEAKER_00]: always possible.
25:57 --> 26:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Murakami has better numbers, had better numbers in Japan than Otani did.
26:03 --> 26:04 [SPEAKER_00]: You can you can start there.
26:06 --> 26:23 [SPEAKER_00]: But the strikeout rate after being 21% in his 222 season where he hit 56 homeruns, it is now creeped up closer to 30% in NPB, not immediately baseball in NPB, which is a level down from MLB.
26:24 --> 26:30 [SPEAKER_00]: If he's going to strike out that much in Japan, how much is he going to strike out in MLB?
26:30 --> 26:35 [SPEAKER_02]: So I'm glad you asked that, because there's a couple players that you can look at to try to draw a comparison, too.
26:36 --> 26:43 [SPEAKER_02]: I would say over the last five years, and you can really argue even more stretched out time than that.
26:43 --> 26:51 [SPEAKER_02]: The two biggest name baths that come over to the US from Japan are Saisuzuki, and now Moona Takamerakami.
26:52 --> 26:54 [SPEAKER_02]: Saisuzuki was a star in Japan.
26:54 --> 26:59 [SPEAKER_02]: 30 plus home runs seasons, WRC plus was through the roof.
27:01 --> 27:06 [SPEAKER_02]: Sias Suzuki when he was in Japan, for the most part, his strikeout rate stayed between 12 and 15 percent.
27:06 --> 27:07 [SPEAKER_02]: He did not punch out.
27:08 --> 27:09 [SPEAKER_02]: His approach was very good.
27:09 --> 27:10 [SPEAKER_02]: He would get on base a lot.
27:10 --> 27:11 [SPEAKER_02]: He obviously did damage.
27:12 --> 27:15 [SPEAKER_02]: Sias Suzuki in Major League Baseball is a very good player.
27:15 --> 27:17 [SPEAKER_02]: He was a borderline all star this year.
27:18 --> 27:25 [SPEAKER_02]: But his strikeout rate in the U.S., in Major League Baseball has crept up from where it was 12 to 15 percent in Japan.
27:25 --> 27:30 [SPEAKER_02]: To now he strikes out anywhere between
27:31 --> 27:39 [SPEAKER_02]: That's a 10 to 12 percent uptick in strikeout rate that a guy who kept his K-rate really low in Japan is now seen in the states.
27:40 --> 27:42 [SPEAKER_02]: It's a pretty big uptick.
27:42 --> 27:46 [SPEAKER_02]: And that's happened with a handful of guys that have come over internationally, especially from Japan.
27:46 --> 27:48 [SPEAKER_02]: It's not just say a Suzuki that's happened to.
27:49 --> 27:58 [SPEAKER_02]: If Monataka Murakami is punching out 30% of the time, in Japan, in NPB, which is essentially triple A level competition about.
28:00 --> 28:02 [SPEAKER_02]: what happens when he comes state side?
28:02 --> 28:09 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, is his strikeout rate going to jump up to 40% do I dare even say it could get even higher?
28:09 --> 28:16 [SPEAKER_02]: Could it get to 45% in major league baseball if the increase is somewhat similar to what's say a Suzuki saw?
28:16 --> 28:25 [SPEAKER_02]: Because if you get up toward that level, I mean, you get up above 35% that's almost borderline, unplayable right there.
28:25 --> 28:32 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, you get to 40% it is literally unplayable and it is unplayable, yeah, you'd be on the bench, yeah, I mean then maybe in the minors
28:33 --> 28:45 [SPEAKER_00]: If I mean if his contract allows, remember he's not on that six year like international like amateur contract, he would be getting a full contract.
28:45 --> 28:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Some full contracts, you can't send someone down unless you do a fan.
28:49 --> 28:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so that he'd be on the bench.
28:51 --> 28:57 [SPEAKER_00]: Right, he would have the team would have to essentially eat his money and put him on the bench, I think, depending on the contract.
28:59 --> 29:06 [SPEAKER_00]: The other concerning thing here is not just a strikeout rate, because the swing and miss is a problem, but there are ways to mitigate having a high strikeout rate.
29:06 --> 29:09 [SPEAKER_00]: His walk rate is also gone down too, which is not a good thing.
29:09 --> 29:19 [SPEAKER_00]: So if you're chasing out of the zone, probably a little bit more, so your less discipline and swinging and missing more, it's a bad combination of have.
29:19 --> 29:21 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's talk about a positive here.
29:22 --> 29:33 [SPEAKER_00]: If he makes even a semblance of contact and majorly of consistent contact and majorly baseball, it's going to hit 30 homers in a season, like you could you could chalk it up as a first basement or a DH.
29:33 --> 29:34 [SPEAKER_00]: He's going to hit 30 bombs.
29:34 --> 29:37 [SPEAKER_00]: And so for some teams that might just be enough, really.
29:37 --> 29:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Look at what the fillies have rolled out and they're in line up the last half decade.
29:43 --> 29:44 [SPEAKER_00]: He's literally their prototype.
29:45 --> 29:49 [SPEAKER_00]: Can't play defense, but hits the shit out of the baseball.
29:49 --> 29:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Hmm.
29:50 --> 29:52 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, in the affiliates, don't bring back Kyle Schwabler.
29:52 --> 29:54 [SPEAKER_02]: That's probably a potential destination spot for him.
29:55 --> 29:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Hmm.
29:57 --> 30:01 [SPEAKER_00]: What is a number you would be comfortable signing Moona Takamura County, too?
30:03 --> 30:05 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm too scared of the strikeout rate.
30:05 --> 30:06 [SPEAKER_02]: I really am.
30:06 --> 30:08 [SPEAKER_02]: I think it just scares me off too much.
30:09 --> 30:14 [SPEAKER_02]: I would give him... Man.
30:15 --> 30:17 [SPEAKER_00]: I could just remember that you would say yes, that.
30:20 --> 30:20 [SPEAKER_00]: four for 40.
30:20 --> 30:23 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, yeah.
30:23 --> 30:25 [SPEAKER_00]: So he's not sliding in Seattle.
30:25 --> 30:37 [SPEAKER_02]: No, again, when you're punching out 30% of the time in Japan, unless he makes a sizable adjustment quickly, there is gonna be a learning curve, and it could be a very difficult transition for him.
30:37 --> 30:40 [SPEAKER_02]: That is just a strikeout rate that is gonna scare teams off.
30:40 --> 30:49 [SPEAKER_02]: If you want to even dig further than that, and wonder about, is there anything that went into that strikeout rate that could have been a little bit fluky?
30:49 --> 30:50 [SPEAKER_02]: Again, could it have been injuries?
30:50 --> 30:53 [SPEAKER_02]: Could it have been the fact that his team over in NPV was not very good?
30:53 --> 31:00 [SPEAKER_02]: And, which was an awesome, and as a result, again, maybe he wasn't all that motivated that.
31:00 --> 31:07 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know, but point being, I'm asking the question, could there be reasons behind his strikeout rate climbing up?
31:08 --> 31:11 [SPEAKER_02]: Could you see it down tick when he gets to the major leagues?
31:12 --> 31:17 [SPEAKER_02]: It's not just the strikeout rate, it is the way in which he is struck out and his lack of contact with the baseball.
31:17 --> 31:23 [SPEAKER_02]: So our friend James Chihano, who does the Met's Up podcast with Drathneck Mark, who we've had on the podcast multiple times.
31:25 --> 31:26 [SPEAKER_02]: He tweeted this out this weekend.
31:27 --> 31:34 [SPEAKER_02]: Moona Takamurakami has an O95 batting average against pitches that are 93 miles an hour and above.
31:36 --> 31:39 [SPEAKER_02]: Sorry, let me do that one more time.
31:39 --> 31:45 [SPEAKER_02]: Murakami had an O-95 batting average against pitches 93 miles an hour or above in MPB in 2025.
31:47 --> 31:49 [SPEAKER_02]: That is a really tough pill to swallow.
31:49 --> 31:54 [SPEAKER_02]: If you remember a couple episodes ago on a previous male bag, maybe a week and a half ago.
31:54 --> 32:00 [SPEAKER_02]: We got to ask the question about Kozuma Okamoto, who's also a corner in field bat with some power that's going to come over from Japan this year.
32:01 --> 32:05 [SPEAKER_02]: And we talked about where his numbers fall off a cliff and that's when the Velo goes up.
32:07 --> 32:15 [SPEAKER_02]: I think Okamoto is a safer play than Murakamiya's because the strikeout rates a little less severe he walks a little bit more and he's not going to cost as much money.
32:15 --> 32:19 [SPEAKER_02]: He is not the name brand player that Murakamiya's.
32:19 --> 32:24 [SPEAKER_02]: but an oh 95 batting average against pitches 93 and above.
32:24 --> 32:26 [SPEAKER_00]: I get the concern.
32:26 --> 32:31 [SPEAKER_00]: There is probably still some development to go on there.
32:31 --> 32:35 [SPEAKER_00]: As we said with Ocomodo, these guys just don't face that kind of velocity.
32:35 --> 32:37 [SPEAKER_00]: How are you expected to be good against something you never see?
32:38 --> 32:47 [SPEAKER_00]: Like it could it could end up being that in the future he's still bad against it and did not develop when he got high exposure against high velocity.
32:48 --> 32:56 [SPEAKER_00]: But when he's when he's playing an NPB, I would say that's not the number you're going to circle and say no, that's why we don't want to sign a hitter.
32:58 --> 33:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe your concern should be
33:01 --> 33:06 [SPEAKER_00]: I would rather, I don't want somebody, like, regressing at age 25.
33:07 --> 33:08 [SPEAKER_00]: That's what I don't want.
33:08 --> 33:09 [SPEAKER_02]: Can I make one more point?
33:10 --> 33:10 [SPEAKER_02]: Sure.
33:11 --> 33:15 [SPEAKER_02]: So it was actual contact rate against pitches 93 and above was about 63%.
33:15 --> 33:17 [SPEAKER_02]: That is not high.
33:17 --> 33:19 [SPEAKER_02]: That's not a great contact rate.
33:19 --> 33:27 [SPEAKER_02]: And if you look at his, what's essentially savant page because somebody does have that on Twitter, they posted it, you know, Sarah's quote tweeted it earlier today.
33:27 --> 33:30 [SPEAKER_02]: And it's from the, I want to make sure I get it right.
33:30 --> 33:44 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, the Yaku Cosmopolitan, who covers a bunch of baseball over in MPB, Monotaka Murakami, this past season, his overall inzone contact, first percentile, first percentile.
33:44 --> 33:45 [SPEAKER_00]: It's, yeah, it's bad.
33:45 --> 33:46 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's not just 93.
33:46 --> 33:47 [SPEAKER_02]: That's overall.
33:47 --> 33:47 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
33:48 --> 33:51 [SPEAKER_02]: And, and, you know, a part of that has to do with, which gets me to my second point.
33:51 --> 33:54 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, his contact rate against good heaters was not good.
33:55 --> 33:57 [SPEAKER_02]: Then you look what he did against secondaries.
33:57 --> 33:58 [SPEAKER_02]: And, oh boy.
33:59 --> 34:04 [SPEAKER_02]: He had a 50% contact rate against secondary pitches this year.
34:05 --> 34:07 [SPEAKER_02]: That was written up by Eric Long and Hagan on fan graphs.
34:07 --> 34:09 [SPEAKER_02]: Now, how do you swallow that?
34:10 --> 34:13 [SPEAKER_02]: You're swinging in missing half the time against non-fastballs.
34:16 --> 34:22 [SPEAKER_00]: You offset that by him when he makes contact, the ball is either a double or a homerun.
34:24 --> 34:32 [SPEAKER_02]: There is, here's how I basically put it on Brock and saw because maybe I haven't done it because a good job selling it so far through this episode.
34:33 --> 34:38 [SPEAKER_02]: But the truth is, I was this massive Murakami fan for, I don't know, four years now.
34:38 --> 34:42 [SPEAKER_02]: A couple of my friends and I started talking about them all the way back in 2021.
34:42 --> 34:45 [SPEAKER_02]: That in 2021, that was when he really broke out.
34:45 --> 34:48 [SPEAKER_02]: Now that wasn't 56 homers.
34:49 --> 34:56 [SPEAKER_02]: 21, he OPS nearly 1, he hit 40 homers and you're like, man, you don't usually get sluggers like this from Japan.
34:57 --> 35:03 [SPEAKER_02]: Then he hit 56 the next year and then he hit the mass of Homer in the championship game of the World Baseball Classic against the US.
35:03 --> 35:07 [SPEAKER_02]: And you're like, I mean, could this guy come over and win an MVP in Major League Baseball?
35:08 --> 35:09 [SPEAKER_02]: Could he be that good?
35:09 --> 35:10 [SPEAKER_02]: Could he change an offense?
35:11 --> 35:13 [SPEAKER_02]: That's what I was dreaming on back then.
35:14 --> 35:44 [SPEAKER_02]: I basically say now that I think I'm in love with Muna Takamura coming as a baseball player and fascinated by him the same way I am with Anthony Richardson and the NFL and maybe not everybody's heard this but I basically will not ever give up on Anthony Richardson and it may be dumb but I will never give up on that guy because you just look at him and say if everything ever if everything clicks for him one day at some point he's Josh Allen he can throw the football basically out of a stadium he runs like no other he's six
35:44 --> 35:46 [SPEAKER_02]: It's like I will not give up on this guy.
35:46 --> 35:49 [SPEAKER_02]: He has a chance to be a superstar if it ever clicks.
35:49 --> 35:53 [SPEAKER_02]: And you all of these people tell you, well, Lyle, he doesn't process well.
35:53 --> 35:54 [SPEAKER_02]: His accuracy is awful.
35:54 --> 35:56 [SPEAKER_02]: He's been like, he's unplayable at times in the NFL.
35:56 --> 35:58 [SPEAKER_02]: It's like, I get it, but I'll never give up on him.
35:59 --> 36:00 [SPEAKER_02]: That's kind of what I'm like with Murakami.
36:00 --> 36:03 [SPEAKER_02]: It's like, I understand this guy could win an MVP.
36:03 --> 36:05 [SPEAKER_02]: I understand he could come state side and hit 50 homers.
36:06 --> 36:08 [SPEAKER_02]: I understand it's tantalizing power.
36:09 --> 36:20 [SPEAKER_02]: But I'm trying to use more of a logical brain here and say there are too many red flags to sign up for a potential $100 million contract on somebody who's totally unproven.
36:21 --> 36:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Can I reach you two sets of numbers?
36:22 --> 36:34 [SPEAKER_00]: 65 games, 165WRC plus, 31% chase rate, 74% in zone contact.
36:34 --> 36:35 [SPEAKER_00]: That's set number one.
36:35 --> 36:57 [SPEAKER_00]: set number two fifty six games to eight WRC plus twenty nine percent chase seventy two point six percent zone contact percentage those some similar enough yeah enough i think i know where the number two you might recognize was murkami set number one was show haze last year before he came demo week
37:00 --> 37:04 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and the Yakuka Cosmopolitan tweeted this out today too, which was fascinating to see.
37:04 --> 37:12 [SPEAKER_02]: Remember all those showhate quotes that came out early on when he came state side, especially early in spring training, which looks so ridiculous now.
37:12 --> 37:14 [SPEAKER_02]: People saying, oh, this guy's a high school hitter.
37:14 --> 37:15 [SPEAKER_02]: Remember that?
37:16 --> 37:17 [SPEAKER_02]: That was a real thing.
37:17 --> 37:18 [SPEAKER_02]: And showhate made adjustments.
37:19 --> 37:21 [SPEAKER_02]: Obviously, he stopped the big leg kick.
37:21 --> 37:24 [SPEAKER_02]: He developed the toe tap and things clicked for him.
37:25 --> 37:31 [SPEAKER_00]: And it took him four, again, four years to be the offense of player he is now in MLB.
37:31 --> 37:34 [SPEAKER_02]: To be fair in 18 and 19, he was still good.
37:34 --> 37:37 [SPEAKER_02]: He just wasn't, oh, show, hey, O'Tani.
37:37 --> 37:39 [SPEAKER_02]: He was, oh, he's a DH who's hitting pretty well.
37:39 --> 37:47 [SPEAKER_00]: And Murkami could still be good, but good for him could be a 34% strikeout rate and 30 bombs or 25 bombs, right?
37:47 --> 37:55 [SPEAKER_00]: That could be his version of good until he makes it to your foreign and finally, like really clicks.
37:55 --> 38:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Comparing anyone to show Hayo Tani's a little bit unfair because Otani also can provide value with his base running.
38:02 --> 38:03 [SPEAKER_00]: He could provide value.
38:03 --> 38:06 [SPEAKER_00]: If he wasn't pitching, he could be a really good builder.
38:07 --> 38:12 [SPEAKER_00]: But he helped, he happens to pitch as well and he's a top 15 pitcher in baseball when he's healthy.
38:12 --> 38:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Those are some pretty good things to offset.
38:14 --> 38:18 [SPEAKER_00]: Murkami doesn't have a single one of those things.
38:18 --> 38:30 [SPEAKER_02]: And when show hey came over, after that season that you just read off, he got that League minimum contract, all 30 teams were interested, he, it was, it was totally risk free.
38:31 --> 38:39 [SPEAKER_02]: Show Heyotani made the League minimum for the first three years until he started to hit arbitration, you didn't have to pay him guaranteed, you know, crazy guaranteed money.
38:40 --> 38:41 [SPEAKER_02]: Murakami is going to get paid.
38:41 --> 38:45 [SPEAKER_02]: He's not going to come over here and get three years for $5 million, for example.
38:46 --> 38:47 [SPEAKER_02]: Somebody's going to give him real money.
38:48 --> 38:57 [SPEAKER_02]: And I just don't know if the Mariners have enough resources to allocate a big chunk of that to move to talk to Murakami for what is going to be a very, very sizable risk.
39:00 --> 39:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Ask yourself this.
39:02 --> 39:10 [SPEAKER_00]: Josh Nailer, Josh Nailer at $90 million or Monataka Murkami at $90 million, it's like the easiest answer of all time.
39:11 --> 39:11 [SPEAKER_00]: It's not close.
39:12 --> 39:12 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
39:12 --> 39:14 [SPEAKER_00]: And the Mariners would tell you the same thing.
39:14 --> 39:15 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's Josh Nailer.
39:16 --> 39:25 [SPEAKER_00]: So, the Yaku Yaku, I believe it is, cosmopolitan had one more good thing I wanted to bring to people's eyes when thinking about this.
39:25 --> 39:33 [SPEAKER_00]: They did a, like, worst case scenario, middle case scenario, best case scenario and more economy.
39:34 --> 39:34 [SPEAKER_00]: So, consider this.
39:35 --> 39:41 [SPEAKER_00]: There's not like a percentage on which one is more likely to hit, but this is sort of a rough draft of this.
39:42 --> 39:51 [SPEAKER_00]: a couple of the worst case scenarios is Christopher Morrell and Jack Soanski and what is their biggest problem while they strike out like no other.
39:53 --> 39:59 [SPEAKER_00]: And as we guessed, I mean, Murkami strike a rate could be higher given how much you strike out in Japan.
39:59 --> 40:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Like those guys, it's 32 to 35, maybe 36, 37% like it's high.
40:06 --> 40:07 [SPEAKER_00]: It's about as high as it gets in baseball.
40:09 --> 40:16 [SPEAKER_00]: the middle percentile, which is the most likely outcome 50th percent, 50th percentile.
40:16 --> 40:23 [SPEAKER_00]: Joey Gallo, who we've talked about a lot, Pedro Alvarez and Chris Davis, and you said you really liked the Pedro Alvarez comp.
40:24 --> 40:39 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that one feels like it's a decent comparison, and maybe Chris Davis is too, but Alvarez, because he was so all or nothing, a corner in field or who couldn't play defense, and would strike out a ton, that one actually feels like it's pretty good.
40:39 --> 40:40 [SPEAKER_02]: It's pretty spot on.
40:41 --> 40:45 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know if Moona Takamer, a communal hit 53 homers like Chris Davis did in Major League Baseball, he could.
40:46 --> 40:50 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, let's be clear, his left-handed power is considered 70 to 80 grade.
40:50 --> 40:54 [SPEAKER_02]: That's the type of raw power he has.
40:55 --> 40:55 [SPEAKER_02]: Bye.
40:56 --> 41:07 [SPEAKER_02]: Pedro Alvarez feels like a more realistic comparison for who his outcome could be at the 50th percentile, especially because Joey Gallo was too good of an athlete to compare Merakami to him.
41:08 --> 41:14 [SPEAKER_02]: Like Merakami's not going to be the athlete, the Joey Gallo was, where Alvarez and Merakami have a lot of similarities.
41:14 --> 41:19 [SPEAKER_02]: Left handed power, a lot of strikeout, not really a lot of defense, yeah, that checks out.
41:20 --> 41:26 [SPEAKER_00]: And the best case scenario was Max Muncie, Raphael Devers, and Matt Wilson, which are very good players.
41:26 --> 41:39 [SPEAKER_00]: There's not to say that more coming can't hit his 100th percentile outcome always possible, but there needs to be development here, right?
41:39 --> 41:42 [SPEAKER_00]: There needs to be development and you did mention before, right?
41:42 --> 41:46 [SPEAKER_00]: the three seasons after he had his breakout 2022 season.
41:46 --> 41:49 [SPEAKER_00]: Steam wasn't very good and let me hypothetically.
41:49 --> 41:52 [SPEAKER_00]: What if he wasn't motivated to play well in those teams?
41:52 --> 41:57 [SPEAKER_00]: And he's just looking forward to coming to MLB and making a lot more money.
41:58 --> 42:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Understandable, but would you want someone who treats a season like that?
42:04 --> 42:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Again, I'm not saying this is how he acts.
42:06 --> 42:08 [SPEAKER_00]: I have no idea, Lyle and I have zero information on this.
42:08 --> 42:11 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm just purely throwing a hypothetical out there.
42:11 --> 42:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, no, right?
42:13 --> 42:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, what did the Colorado Rockies who loved away some money throw him the Chris Bryant contract?
42:20 --> 42:21 [SPEAKER_00]: And they're not very good.
42:21 --> 42:22 [SPEAKER_00]: They don't have any hope.
42:23 --> 42:24 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's why I think you the perfect angel.
42:26 --> 42:27 [SPEAKER_00]: I hope he's not an angel.
42:27 --> 42:30 [SPEAKER_00]: I hope he goes somewhere that actually wants to develop.
42:30 --> 42:34 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, because again, if it all works out for him, it could be a really fun player.
42:35 --> 42:40 [SPEAKER_02]: I just don't think the Mariners have the resources to take the risk here, unfortunately.
42:41 --> 42:44 [SPEAKER_02]: And let's say decided they were just going to open up their budget like crazy.
42:44 --> 42:48 [SPEAKER_02]: And even if they did that, I feel like they would use it on guys, probably not name Mototaka Murakami.
42:49 --> 42:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Josh Taylor.
42:50 --> 43:01 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so Chris Davis, for example, I don't know if people remember that crazy over 50 something stretch that he had to start the year in 2018, that was one of the worst seasons ever played by a player.
43:01 --> 43:08 [SPEAKER_02]: That year Chris Davis by baseball reference put up negative 3.3 war, I don't even know how that's possible, but that's a real number.
43:08 --> 43:12 [SPEAKER_02]: Like he actually lost the team nearly three and a half games on his own.
43:13 --> 43:18 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, most players get cut, but first of all, the Orioles weren't good, so they weren't trying to win games.
43:18 --> 43:20 [SPEAKER_00]: but he's also making a shit ton of money.
43:20 --> 43:21 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
43:21 --> 43:30 [SPEAKER_02]: So that year, Chris Davis, and that season, was striking out 36.8% of the time, which is crazy high.
43:30 --> 43:33 [SPEAKER_02]: Again, that's where it gets to the level where you're unplayable in baseball.
43:34 --> 43:38 [SPEAKER_02]: If Murkami's striking out 30% of the time in Japan right now,
43:40 --> 43:55 [SPEAKER_02]: Is it crazy to say he could see a five to seven percent increase in K rate coming from NPB to MLB no I don't think it's crazy at all it could be more than that and if that's what happened to Chris Davis who was already an established power threat and major league baseball.
43:57 --> 44:00 [SPEAKER_02]: It is, this is a lottery ticket of all lottery tickets.
44:01 --> 44:07 [SPEAKER_02]: If it somehow works to the 100th percentile, there's going to be a team that makes it out like a bandit and looks like the smartest people on Earth.
44:08 --> 44:11 [SPEAKER_02]: But if it crashes and burns, it's going to crash and burn hard.
44:12 --> 44:16 [SPEAKER_00]: But the other side of Chris Davis is that he hit 53 homers in a season, right?
44:18 --> 44:23 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, in Chris Davis, again, perfect example of like, when it works, you will love that guy.
44:23 --> 44:27 [SPEAKER_02]: And when it doesn't, you don't want to watch a single at that ever.
44:28 --> 44:34 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll see, Lao and I just have come to the conclusion that we don't think it's going to be the Mariners that are in on this.
44:34 --> 44:41 [SPEAKER_00]: They probably have a number, right, where they would listen, I think there would have to be a couple of things that hadn't worked out for them.
44:42 --> 44:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Josh Nailer is like pre-mo example number one, they're not even going to pick up the phone and call about Murakami until they know the an answer from Josh Nailer.
44:51 --> 45:01 [SPEAKER_02]: And even if they have their answer, I think they would call about Okamoto before they call about Murakami because a little safer, like there's still risk there, we talked about it, maybe we'll dive into a more in the off season.
45:02 --> 45:03 [SPEAKER_02]: But he's going to cost less.
45:04 --> 45:10 [SPEAKER_00]: And he's older, and Ocomo to the last three seasons combined has been better at the plate than Murkami has.
45:11 --> 45:18 [SPEAKER_00]: The difference is, Murkami's entering his age 26 season, you think there is still room to grow there as a baseball player.
45:19 --> 45:26 [SPEAKER_00]: Or Ocomo to's over the age of 30, that's like, no, like there's not really much more room to grow there.
45:26 --> 45:28 [SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, that's what you have to wait with stuff like this.
45:29 --> 45:31 [SPEAKER_00]: The guys that come over internationally are not sure things.
45:31 --> 45:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Show Hayo Tani was not a sure thing.
45:33 --> 45:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Fragly, no one pitched and hit successfully since Bay Bruth, combined.
45:38 --> 45:39 [SPEAKER_00]: So, but I never know.
45:40 --> 45:42 [SPEAKER_02]: He was risk-free because you didn't have to pay him the crazy money.
45:42 --> 45:46 [SPEAKER_00]: 100% right, but you didn't know if he was going to be good or not.
45:46 --> 45:47 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
45:47 --> 45:50 [SPEAKER_02]: What would you feel comfortable giving Murakami for a contract?
45:50 --> 45:52 [SPEAKER_02]: Because you asked me earlier, and I was trying to think about it.
45:52 --> 45:54 [SPEAKER_02]: And my best answer was something like 4 for 40, but what's yours?
45:54 --> 45:57 [SPEAKER_02]: 5 for 70.
45:59 --> 46:02 [SPEAKER_02]: That's not that different than what Kylie McDaniel said he'd get, which is 5 for 80.
46:04 --> 46:09 [SPEAKER_02]: math-wise at $14 million, is that $14 million?
46:10 --> 46:14 [SPEAKER_02]: About now are you still bringing back nailer and signing Merakami?
46:16 --> 46:17 [SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, it's $14 million.
46:17 --> 46:21 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, so nailer's number one, that doesn't change.
46:21 --> 46:29 [SPEAKER_00]: So like Josh Nailer's a better baseball player in 2026 than Moona Talkumerakami is, it's a no doubt.
46:30 --> 46:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Mariners could use a DH.
46:32 --> 46:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Like if they're not signing Jorge Polanco, yeah?
46:34 --> 46:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Would you take Monataka Mercomi at $14 million or Jorge Polanco at $14 million?
46:38 --> 46:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Hmm.
46:43 --> 46:47 [SPEAKER_02]: I'd probably still say Polanco because it's gonna be less years and you know more of who he is.
46:48 --> 46:49 [SPEAKER_02]: Just for next year, 100%.
46:50 --> 46:52 [SPEAKER_00]: What about five years?
46:52 --> 46:54 [SPEAKER_00]: That's different, plug is not good enough to do so.
46:54 --> 46:57 [SPEAKER_00]: And you're not signing monotocommer coming just for what you can do next year.
46:58 --> 47:01 [SPEAKER_00]: You are, but you're thinking about the future as well.
47:02 --> 47:04 [SPEAKER_02]: You are, but the mayor is also need to win in 2026.
47:04 --> 47:08 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think they can afford, I don't think they can afford a development project next year.
47:09 --> 47:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Can monotocommer come and put up a 110 WRC plus is a DH next year?
47:15 --> 47:18 [SPEAKER_02]: Might be quite the roundabout way of doing it, but I guess he can.
47:21 --> 47:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Based off of the playoff performance, the fans might, all of us might get a little frustrated.
47:27 --> 47:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Based on the strikeouts, I think people wanted to see the strikeouts go down.
47:31 --> 47:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Make a little bit more contact.
47:33 --> 47:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Moona Takamerakami is not going to do that.
47:36 --> 47:36 [SPEAKER_00]: No.
47:36 --> 47:39 [SPEAKER_00]: I wouldn't say he's earning Clement.
47:41 --> 47:42 [SPEAKER_02]: No, I don't think he's earning Clement.
47:44 --> 47:44 [SPEAKER_02]: No.
47:44 --> 47:45 [SPEAKER_02]: Again.
47:46 --> 48:01 [SPEAKER_02]: When, like, the number that really is jumped out to me the most about all of this, even more so than hitting 0.95 against 93 miles an hour and above last year from our economy, is the swinging and missing 50% of the time against secondaries.
48:02 --> 48:05 [SPEAKER_02]: Contact rate of 50% against secondary offerings in Japan.
48:07 --> 48:09 [SPEAKER_02]: What happens when teams stop throwing in fastballs?
48:09 --> 48:13 [SPEAKER_02]: What happens when teams just straight up attack him with nothing but spin?
48:14 --> 48:16 [SPEAKER_00]: And it might be brutal and he's going to have to get better at it.
48:17 --> 48:18 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, show hey, did.
48:18 --> 48:18 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
48:20 --> 48:22 [SPEAKER_02]: It's, I want to see him be really great.
48:23 --> 48:25 [SPEAKER_02]: I just think it's going to have to be somewhere else.
48:25 --> 48:29 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think the Mariners can afford to take on this project.
48:29 --> 48:30 [SPEAKER_02]: I just don't.
48:31 --> 48:32 [SPEAKER_00]: And I'm with you.
48:33 --> 48:34 [SPEAKER_00]: It all gets solved.
48:35 --> 48:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Funny, keeps coming back to this point.
48:37 --> 48:38 [SPEAKER_00]: If they sign Josh Nailer.
48:39 --> 48:50 [SPEAKER_00]: most of the mariners offseason questions evaporate if they sign Josh Naylor yeah well they should probably do that Hmm, well at least again Justin Hollander came out publicly said on day one of free agency.
48:50 --> 48:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, he's our number one priority.
48:52 --> 48:53 [SPEAKER_00]: So
48:53 --> 48:59 [SPEAKER_02]: At least we have that to go off those yeah, which is nice to hear and again, I would say that's Hollander's very relatable.
48:59 --> 49:01 [SPEAKER_02]: I think a lot of Mariners fans probably appreciated hearing that.
49:01 --> 49:05 [SPEAKER_02]: It's like yeah, whereas locked in on this is all the fans want us to be.
49:05 --> 49:07 [SPEAKER_02]: They like they know how important he is.
49:07 --> 49:15 [SPEAKER_02]: You can't guarantee anything because ultimately Josh gets to pick where he wants to go, but I think the Mariners are making a pretty clear how much the value them.
49:15 --> 49:18 [SPEAKER_02]: So I, you know, they're putting in the effort.
49:19 --> 49:23 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, fun first profile, we've got many more of these to do as the off-season goes along.
49:23 --> 49:29 [SPEAKER_00]: And soon enough, hopefully we have something to talk about that the Mariners have actually acquired instead of hypothetically acquired.
49:30 --> 49:30 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I'd be great.
49:31 --> 49:34 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know when the ball is gonna get rolling with this stuff because there hasn't really been anything yet.
49:34 --> 49:37 [SPEAKER_02]: There hasn't been the first big move yet and free agency just started.
49:37 --> 49:42 [SPEAKER_02]: It was, it's only a couple days old, but I never know when it's gonna kick into high gear.
49:42 --> 49:44 [SPEAKER_02]: I feel like it's time's gone on.
49:45 --> 49:47 [SPEAKER_02]: Stuff starts happening later and later in baseball.
49:47 --> 49:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Murakami's got a sign by the 22nd of December 5 p.m. Eastern, I believe.
49:54 --> 49:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Everyone now, I mean, the winner meetings is usually a good start, especially to free agency.
49:59 --> 50:00 [SPEAKER_00]: We can see trades this month, though.
50:00 --> 50:05 [SPEAKER_00]: Remember when I mean, the Mitch Hanager trade happened on Thanksgiving Eve, right?
50:05 --> 50:06 [SPEAKER_02]: back in 16.
50:06 --> 50:06 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
50:07 --> 50:09 [SPEAKER_02]: And oftentimes, it could be different this year.
50:09 --> 50:09 [SPEAKER_02]: We'll see.
50:10 --> 50:12 [SPEAKER_02]: Oftentimes, the Mariners do like to get things done early.
50:12 --> 50:15 [SPEAKER_02]: So they usually like to jump out ahead of it.
50:15 --> 50:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Do we think the Mariners are going to give us a happy Thanksgiving present?
50:19 --> 50:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Because just transparency to everyone listening, while now I will both be on vacation the entire week of Thanksgiving.
50:26 --> 50:34 [SPEAKER_00]: And we're trying to plan out whether or not we're going to bring any
50:34 --> 50:36 [SPEAKER_00]: you get the pass in tweaking.
50:36 --> 50:40 [SPEAKER_02]: It's like, and it's something ridiculous, too.
50:40 --> 50:42 [SPEAKER_02]: It's not like the Mariners traded for a bullpen arm.
50:42 --> 50:45 [SPEAKER_02]: It's gonna be, it's not even a recent Josh Nailer.
50:46 --> 50:49 [SPEAKER_02]: That would be the weekend where they make some crazy move.
50:49 --> 50:52 [SPEAKER_02]: They pull off a trailer Ronald Alcuni at that weekend.
50:55 --> 50:56 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, man.
50:57 --> 51:00 [SPEAKER_02]: I like I think we're going to do we're going to do episodes that week.
51:00 --> 51:02 [SPEAKER_02]: I think we're going to still do one at least Monday and Wednesday.
51:02 --> 51:15 [SPEAKER_02]: We may just, especially because that's Thanksgiving weekend and a lot of people are out anyway,
51:15 --> 51:17 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, maybe just don't trade during Thanksgiving.
51:17 --> 51:19 [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe just like have your turkey, everybody.
51:20 --> 51:22 [SPEAKER_02]: Fones off at the table.
51:22 --> 51:23 [SPEAKER_02]: Exactly.
51:23 --> 51:24 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, and cranberry sauce.
51:24 --> 51:25 [SPEAKER_02]: I forgot about that.
51:25 --> 51:25 [SPEAKER_02]: That too.
51:27 --> 51:27 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, no.
51:27 --> 51:28 [SPEAKER_02]: No, it's amazing.
51:29 --> 51:29 [SPEAKER_02]: Anyway.
51:30 --> 51:36 [SPEAKER_02]: Anyway, I think the winter meetings you're right is when things will really kick into height here.
51:36 --> 51:44 [SPEAKER_02]: Honestly, because of the window now of Murakami's posting and when he has to sign by, which is December 22nd, I wouldn't be totally shocked if he signed at the winter meetings.
51:46 --> 51:47 [SPEAKER_00]: see what the market is.
51:47 --> 51:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, because there is a gap in projection.
51:50 --> 51:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Some people think he's going to get 120 to 150 million, and then some people like Kylie McKinney will think he's going to get below Josh Nailer's contract.
52:00 --> 52:04 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, Kylie also had Nailer making less than Murakami.
52:04 --> 52:09 [SPEAKER_02]: So he projected Nailer to get three for 57 and a half, I want to say.
52:10 --> 52:12 [SPEAKER_02]: Kylie's really low on all these guys.
52:13 --> 52:17 [SPEAKER_02]: It's not being low on the players, I just think he doesn't think the contracts are going to be absurd.
52:20 --> 52:23 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, we need to see some signings to make a good judgment on that.
52:24 --> 52:25 [SPEAKER_02]: Do I have that right on Naylor?
52:25 --> 52:26 [SPEAKER_02]: Is it 57 in a half?
52:26 --> 52:27 [SPEAKER_00]: It was something.
52:27 --> 52:28 [SPEAKER_02]: I think that sounds right.
52:29 --> 52:36 [SPEAKER_02]: Like he was pretty, sorry, it's 17 and a half million a year, 53 or 52 in a half million dollars.
52:37 --> 52:39 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, that would be the easiest, yes, of all time.
52:39 --> 52:42 [SPEAKER_00]: But I don't think Josh Taylor was going to get contract that low.
52:43 --> 52:44 [SPEAKER_00]: I guess we'll see.
52:44 --> 52:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Unless, look, everyone could be saving up money for what could be an impending lockout next years.
52:51 --> 52:57 [SPEAKER_00]: That might make sense, but, I mean, Josh Taylor's really good player, so he should get paid.
52:58 --> 52:59 [SPEAKER_02]: He'll probably get a little more than that.
52:59 --> 53:01 [SPEAKER_02]: I certainly wouldn't be surprised if he gets a fourth year.
53:01 --> 53:08 [SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, Kylie's basically projecting he'd get, if another year's at it on, for for 70, also the easiest yes ever.
53:09 --> 53:37 [SPEAKER_02]: be interesting though it gets less money per year than Christian Walker he's a better baseball player right and if you're his camp you're probably gonna argue that and Christian Walker was really old when he signed Josh Taylor's not even thirty again if you're Josh Taylor's agent you're probably using those exact talking points so i wouldn't be shocked which by the way speaking of impending lockouts what a better day for the game of baseball i got to tell you before we wrap this up i mean
53:37 --> 54:00 [SPEAKER_02]: you've got the two guardians arms who seem like they're never going to pitch again which is truly unbelievable that sixty five years in prison well that's the maximum but it it it's incredible really that a manual class i decided to throw away what was legitimately on track to be a hall of fame career for what was basically ten thousand dollars which he's making on the regular anyway paired with
54:02 --> 54:22 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, this report that comes out about basically one of Rob Manford's puppets going up to Bryce Harper, after he told Rob Manford to get the fuck out of his clubhouse for talking about salary cap, one of his puppets and one of his, yes men, essentially going up to Harper and saying, comments like that to the commissioner or how people end up in ditches, that's a real thing.
54:22 --> 54:31 [SPEAKER_02]: That got reported this weekend, apparently one of Rob Manford's people went up to Harper after that whole altercation over the summer and said, this is how people end up in ditches.
54:31 --> 54:32 [SPEAKER_02]: It's like, dude, are you serious?
54:34 --> 54:39 [SPEAKER_02]: I really cannot stand everybody associated with the commissioners office.
54:39 --> 54:40 [SPEAKER_02]: It's absurd.
54:40 --> 54:49 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, oh, boo, hoo, these players don't wanna bow down to you, shocker, and you have somebody that's very, very firm in his beliefs and Bryce Harper that's gonna stand up to it.
54:49 --> 54:50 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that he's not just gonna give in.
54:52 --> 55:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Honestly, I felt the funniest story of the entire weekend was maybe it's not the absurdity of the last thing you just mentioned, or the overall case of the Luis Ortiz, a manual classic case, which is crazy in of itself again, just the amount of money these guys were throwing away to make not that much.
55:13 --> 55:20 [SPEAKER_00]: But it was the fact to that one, I forget, I think it was class A, was the one who's supposed to throw an intentional bot on someone still swung at it.
55:21 --> 55:23 [SPEAKER_00]: So be more trying to go find who it was.
55:23 --> 55:29 [SPEAKER_00]: And I think it was Cutter as King was like, oh my god, Anthony Volpeko.
55:29 --> 55:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Anthony Volpeko is the ring leader to lose five grand because he's swung at a shitty bench.
55:43 --> 55:58 [SPEAKER_02]: listen to the audio of it was Andy Pah has who swung in a bad pitch in the class a through and it got caught on the mic of class a dropping in F bomb and now everybody's like oh that makes a little more sense now while you're mad that somebody's swung.
56:00 --> 56:09 [SPEAKER_00]: It's just crazy, like you can't get inside of the mind of a player or the situation or if there's like blackmail or anything involved to but Cheese, man.
56:09 --> 56:11 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, like I said through 65 years.
56:11 --> 56:17 [SPEAKER_00]: They could face up to 65 years in prison for this Like hardcore prison.
56:17 --> 56:18 [SPEAKER_02]: That's crazy.
56:18 --> 56:21 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah Cheese.
56:21 --> 56:29 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, again Honestly that the While that one has plenty of headlines today
56:30 --> 56:32 [SPEAKER_02]: I think people need to pay more attention.
56:32 --> 56:41 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I don't know about more, but people need to give some rightful attention to one of Rob Manford's puppets telling Bryce Harper that this is how somebody ends up in a ditch.
56:42 --> 56:48 [SPEAKER_02]: Dude, like, grow up, like you actually think these players are gonna bow down.
56:49 --> 56:54 [SPEAKER_00]: But also it's just probably not the smart thing to say because it's just gonna get reported.
56:55 --> 56:56 [SPEAKER_00]: And now it did.
56:57 --> 56:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, everyone's always got something up there sleeve.
56:59 --> 57:01 [SPEAKER_00]: It's like, yeah, Bryce hears that.
57:01 --> 57:04 [SPEAKER_00]: He can just sit on it until he's like, yeah, no, it's time to throw everyone under the bus.
57:06 --> 57:06 [UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
57:06 --> 57:10 [SPEAKER_02]: I think we're gonna hear a lot from Bryce Harper as the saw goes on.
57:10 --> 57:10 [SPEAKER_02]: I gotta be real.
57:11 --> 57:11 [SPEAKER_02]: I hope we do.
57:13 --> 57:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Cause... Well, they get, they get a whole season to play first.
57:15 --> 57:20 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think they're gonna try and worry about it too much this year, but yeah, once the season ends in 2026, 100%.
57:20 --> 57:23 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, no doubt.
57:23 --> 57:28 [SPEAKER_02]: All right, anyway, that just about wraps up this edition of the Marine Lair podcast.
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57:58 --> 57:59 [SPEAKER_02]: That's TJ.
57:59 --> 58:00 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm Lyle.
58:00 --> 58:00 [SPEAKER_02]: It's always weird.
58:00 --> 58:01 [SPEAKER_02]: Thank you guys for tuning in.
58:02 --> 58:03 [SPEAKER_02]: We'll talk to you soon.