Lyle and TJ are in bewilderment about Tuesday's game, and react to all the decisions that led to them blowing the game to the White Sox (2:30). They discuss some of the bigger picture problems coming out of the game (20:29) then the symbolic nature of Colt Emerson's first career home run on Monday (38:34).
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00:00 --> 00:12 [SPEAKER_01]: What's up guys, just a reminder before we get into what's going to be a banger of an episode to say the least is we have a banger of an event happening less than a week from now on Tuesday, May the 26th over at Emerald Queen Casino.
00:12 --> 00:16 [SPEAKER_01]: It's our trivia night, which we are so fired up for and can't wait to see that.
00:16 --> 00:23 [SPEAKER_01]: That's going to be at Emerald Queen Casino at the sportsbook at 6 p.m. on Tuesday, May the 26th.
00:23 --> 00:27 [SPEAKER_01]: We're going to be watching the Mariners game all throughout the night doing Mariners Trivia.
00:27 --> 00:30 [SPEAKER_01]: We're going to have prizes to give away and hang it out with all you guys.
00:30 --> 00:31 [SPEAKER_01]: It is going to be awesome.
00:31 --> 00:39 [SPEAKER_01]: So mark it on your calendars 6 p.m. May the 26th Emerald Queen Casino Mariners Trivia night and watch party.
00:39 --> 00:41 [SPEAKER_01]: We can't wait to see you there.
00:41 --> 00:44 [SPEAKER_00]: Welcome to episode number 405 of the Marine Lair, podcasts.
00:44 --> 00:49 [SPEAKER_00]: The Mariners might have played and managed their worst game I've literally ever seen.
00:49 --> 00:54 [SPEAKER_00]: We'll talk about it, we'll react to it, and we'll also talk a little bit about Cole Emerson's first couple of games.
00:55 --> 00:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, right.
00:57 --> 00:58 [SPEAKER_01]: I have more of an intro to do.
00:58 --> 00:59 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, before we start railing.
00:59 --> 01:00 [SPEAKER_01]: So let me do that.
01:00 --> 01:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Your guys is reminder if you guys are listening to this podcast Please make sure to go download these episodes and rate and review five stars.
01:06 --> 01:11 [SPEAKER_01]: It helps a ton if you're watching on YouTube and potentially want to see somebody's head explode on this episode
01:11 --> 01:40 [SPEAKER_01]: hit subscribe like can we can we get a subscription out of you if somebody's head legitimately explodes on this podcast that would be really awesome if we could get a subscription like if we promise somebody's head exploding you'll go subscribe on YouTube so go do that like comment follow us on our website marinelayerpod.com merch is there patreon's there episodes are all there that's marinelayerpod.com and then you can find us across social media where again you can probably find us railing every single day
01:41 --> 01:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Let's get a rolling.
01:55 --> 02:15 [SPEAKER_00]: And we welcome you to this episode of the Marine Lair podcast part of the just baseball podcast network recording here on Tuesday evening May 19 You'd have no idea it's 1043 pm at night because holy fuck, Lyle, that was the worst thing I've ever seen in my life tonight Dude, where do we even start?
02:16 --> 02:18 [SPEAKER_01]: We're like, I'm where shall we start?
02:18 --> 02:19 [SPEAKER_01]: Here's where we start.
02:20 --> 02:21 [SPEAKER_01]: We predicted this
02:22 --> 02:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so let's start there.
02:24 --> 02:26 [SPEAKER_01]: This is the fucking end of the piggyback.
02:26 --> 02:27 [SPEAKER_00]: That's it.
02:27 --> 02:28 [SPEAKER_00]: It's over after one time.
02:28 --> 02:29 [SPEAKER_00]: It's done.
02:29 --> 02:30 [SPEAKER_00]: You know what it should have been done?
02:30 --> 02:37 [SPEAKER_00]: You know when the red flag should have been raised, we were at the field on Monday listening to Dan's press conference.
02:37 --> 02:41 [SPEAKER_00]: And usually again, Dan says absolutely nothing in the press conference.
02:41 --> 02:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe it should have paid attention to this note more.
02:43 --> 02:49 [SPEAKER_00]: Where he literally said, in the press conference, they're not really sure what they were going to do on Tuesday.
02:50 --> 02:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Should I can't get right there?
02:52 --> 02:55 [SPEAKER_00]: They should have ripped the piggyback out and said, we're not doing it anymore.
02:56 --> 03:01 [SPEAKER_00]: It's over, because clearly, no one knew what they were doing with the piggyback tonight.
03:01 --> 03:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Like my god.
03:04 --> 03:09 [SPEAKER_01]: Again, we can start this episode by saying, that's the end of the piggyback.
03:09 --> 03:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, done, we're out, we don't wanna see it ever again.
03:11 --> 03:12 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's true.
03:13 --> 03:16 [SPEAKER_01]: But how do we even start dissecting this game?
03:16 --> 03:24 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm trying to manage all my mental headspace and figure out how I'm gonna calmly sit here on this podcast and actually talk about it without losing my mind.
03:24 --> 03:26 [SPEAKER_01]: And I don't know if I'm going to to be honest.
03:26 --> 03:27 [SPEAKER_00]: All right, let me, let me state this.
03:28 --> 03:30 [SPEAKER_00]: I think is clearly in my opinion that I can.
03:31 --> 03:41 [SPEAKER_00]: It seems like the Mariners, everyone in the Mariners organization in a baseball decision-making role went into Tuesday's game without a plan of what they were gonna do.
03:41 --> 04:04 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's terrible process, literally, from the decision to piggyback to how they're going to actually use the piggyback in the game to then when the game actually unfolds and predictable certain scenarios happen that can cause some shake up in the decision making and then it all just blows up in their face and now everyone looks like an idiot.
04:04 --> 04:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Here at the end of the night, and I have never seen the fanbase universally pissed off at the Mariners all at once.
04:12 --> 04:16 [SPEAKER_00]: We've had some bangers, Kerry Carpenter, Andre's Moonios game 7.
04:16 --> 04:25 [SPEAKER_00]: I think disregarding the context of the game and like what part of the season it is, while I literally, I don't think I've ever seen a collective outrage.
04:25 --> 04:31 [SPEAKER_00]: against the Mariners against the decisions that were made by literally every single person then I have tonight.
04:31 --> 04:32 [SPEAKER_00]: It's crazy.
04:32 --> 04:36 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it is about as universal as you'll ever find.
04:37 --> 04:41 [SPEAKER_01]: And for every good reason, I mean, you can go down the bucket list.
04:41 --> 04:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Let's just, let's just try to bullet point these very fast.
04:44 --> 04:54 [SPEAKER_01]: For anybody that might have been, I don't know, under a rock and didn't see what happened in this disastrous loss on Tuesday, let's just try to bullet point.
04:54 --> 04:55 [SPEAKER_01]: Bryce Miller gets the start.
04:55 --> 04:59 [SPEAKER_01]: He's at five and two thirds innings pitch and he's at less than 75 pitches.
05:00 --> 05:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, is it his second start back from the IL?
05:02 --> 05:03 [SPEAKER_01]: It is.
05:03 --> 05:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Is it his second start of the year?
05:05 --> 05:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
05:07 --> 05:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Number one, he certainly didn't look like he was out of bullets.
05:11 --> 05:14 [SPEAKER_01]: He certainly looked like he could have kept going.
05:14 --> 05:20 [SPEAKER_01]: And number two, he literally said his press conference, he didn't think he was coming out.
05:20 --> 05:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Like he wasn't, he didn't receive the, the word anger or receive the message that he was gonna get pulled out of this game.
05:29 --> 05:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Which is really weird, right?
05:31 --> 05:32 [SPEAKER_01]: They said they were piggybacking.
05:32 --> 05:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Did Bryce know he was piggybacking?
05:35 --> 05:58 [SPEAKER_01]: You would think, but Bryce was probably under the assumption that look if I'm dealing and I'm at five and two third shot outs with one hit I'm not getting pulled out of the game now Just to just for a second play the other side of the coin Could you argue that because it was the third time through the order and you were gonna get right on left with Murakami The third time through the order in a one-run game.
05:58 --> 06:04 [SPEAKER_01]: That's why they did it sure like you can argue that but
06:05 --> 06:30 [SPEAKER_01]: he was still absolutely dealing and then when you hear what he said post game it makes you just question everything else that much more because do price miller when he came out of that game and when he was up at that podium for the press conference he did not look like a happy camera and he looked pissed and by the way why do I say that with a little bit of surprise in my voice?
06:30 --> 06:32 [SPEAKER_01]: Bryce Miller is never pissed.
06:32 --> 06:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Bryce Miller has to be the most chill, laid back, even killed guy, you'll ever find him.
06:39 --> 06:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Bryce Miller is standing around and happily shoot the breeze with anybody in everybody.
06:45 --> 06:47 [SPEAKER_01]: He is for as hard a worker as he is.
06:47 --> 06:50 [SPEAKER_01]: His personality is as laid back as you can get.
06:50 --> 06:54 [SPEAKER_01]: And he looked pissed after I came.
06:54 --> 07:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and that's like the lowest on the totem pole of bad decisions tonight.
07:00 --> 07:04 [SPEAKER_00]: What you get by the way Like if the Mariners were doing a true piggyback.
07:04 --> 07:07 [SPEAKER_00]: How does Bryce Miller not think he would come out of the game?
07:07 --> 07:15 [SPEAKER_00]: I clearly it was not communicated to him effectively that He might he's gonna get pulled early Like sorry, we're gonna we're doing a true piggyback.
07:16 --> 07:21 [SPEAKER_00]: Which comes back to the problem with the idea In the first place
07:21 --> 07:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, if Bryce knew he was piggybacking, one would just assume Bryce, even if you're doing after five innings, I'm sorry, we're trying to get enough pitches in for all of our starters.
07:32 --> 07:35 [SPEAKER_00]: Bryce goes five dominant innings and then Castile comes in.
07:35 --> 07:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Great, but the Mariners couldn't even decide what they wanted to do with Bryce Miller, it wasn't a true piggyback, cause again, Lyle, true piggybacks.
07:45 --> 07:47 [SPEAKER_00]: Pretty much, it's an even split for the most part.
07:47 --> 07:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Right, it's five and four, it's four and four,
07:51 --> 08:12 [SPEAKER_00]: you split you don't I for the most part the way I understand it you don't really say oh yeah we'll let some guy go longer like no if your priority was getting both guys some length then it's communicated to both of them hey sorry you're not going to pitch as long tonight because we're going to split it up didn't seem like Bryce knew that
08:14 --> 08:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Doesn't that seem like a problem?
08:16 --> 08:18 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, isn't like a huge problem.
08:18 --> 08:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Isn't this what Dan is supposed to be great at?
08:22 --> 08:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Isn't this part of the reason he was brought into this role because he's supposed to be a great communicator with the players and great in the clubhouse?
08:29 --> 08:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Look, we're speculating here.
08:31 --> 08:38 [SPEAKER_01]: We don't know how this thing was communicated or not because we don't get every piece of information especially when you listen to Dan Wilson talk every day when he says absolutely nothing.
08:39 --> 08:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Every day, throughout the course of 162 games,
08:44 --> 08:54 [SPEAKER_01]: But when Bryce Miller looks like and sounds like he didn't know the plan, I mean, that's a huge problem in its own right.
08:54 --> 09:00 [SPEAKER_01]: And again, what's amazing is this is like third on the list of bad decisions in this game.
09:01 --> 09:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Let's keep going down the bullet, so let's go.
09:03 --> 09:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so bullet number two.
09:07 --> 09:11 [SPEAKER_01]: What did we talk about with this piggyback thing or what are other people talk about with this piggyback thing?
09:11 --> 09:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Another reason it causes so many headaches and teams don't do it is, how do you properly manage it?
09:18 --> 09:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Because once you get to the point where you are through six settings and then in his Luis Castillo's turn to come into the game, how do you go about this the right way?
09:26 --> 09:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Because clearly you want to get him his work and his pitches,
09:31 --> 09:36 [SPEAKER_01]: But what happens if, in a scenario like this, it's a one-run game, it's a two-run game.
09:37 --> 09:40 [SPEAKER_01]: He's at 20 or 30 or 40 pitches.
09:40 --> 09:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Way, way, way below where his usual pitch count would be as a starting pitcher.
09:45 --> 09:46 [SPEAKER_01]: What do you do?
09:46 --> 09:48 [SPEAKER_01]: If he gets into trouble, what do you do?
09:48 --> 09:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Do you just ride with him?
09:49 --> 09:51 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that seems like now practice.
09:51 --> 09:53 [SPEAKER_01]: The dude has a six and a half BRA.
09:53 --> 10:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Or do you actually go to your leverage arms once things start to get dicey because that is how Vulpin arms are used to their best strength when games get close late?
10:05 --> 10:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, our answer was given here on Tuesday night because along with them not seeming to have a concrete plan in place for this whole piggyback thing.
10:17 --> 10:37 [SPEAKER_01]: They seem like they cared more about getting Louise his workload than everything else not just using the leverage arms But part of me thinks the reason they pulled Bryce Miller is because they needed Louise quote-unquote to get his workload in and if you're pulling a guy who's dealing for a six and a half dr a picture to get his workload in
10:37 --> 10:40 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that is complete and utter malpractice in every way.
10:41 --> 10:48 [SPEAKER_01]: I know they pulled them with two outs in the sixth, so they could use for rare against Murakami and get that specific matchup.
10:49 --> 11:02 [SPEAKER_01]: But regardless of that, it feels like the reason they pulled him in general was so Luis Castillo could quote unquote get his work in during a one run game when you need to win a series and are still three games under 500 at the point of that time in the game.
11:02 --> 11:14 [SPEAKER_00]: which then, despite again, they let Bryce continue to pitch into the sixth inning, knowing Luis, they wanted to get Luis's work, but they weren't willing to commit to it earlier when Bryce Miller was throwing.
11:15 --> 11:18 [SPEAKER_00]: So again, what is the priority for the Seattle Mariners?
11:19 --> 11:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Was it getting a good start out of Bryce Miller, getting length out of Luis Castillo, or see, winning the game?
11:28 --> 11:39 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, dude, you would hope it's C, but the way that thing was managed tonight, look like a team that was worried about having to eat $24 million a year of Luis Castillo's contract.
11:39 --> 11:45 [SPEAKER_00]: That's what that looked like, or a team that was just unwilling to go to a six-man rotation for some reason.
11:45 --> 11:46 [SPEAKER_00]: But guess what?
11:46 --> 11:50 [SPEAKER_00]: I would prefer a six-man rotation right now over what I watched tonight.
11:51 --> 11:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, every day of the week.
11:52 --> 11:54 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't want a six-man rotation.
11:54 --> 11:57 [SPEAKER_00]: I remember what we just, I sit over what we just watched.
11:58 --> 12:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, I would, well, put Luis back in the rotation.
12:01 --> 12:03 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't want him coming out of the bullpen.
12:03 --> 12:08 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't want you pulling your starters early because you feel like you have to throw a long, long reliever.
12:10 --> 12:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, let me go back to what I've said for the last month plus.
12:15 --> 12:16 [SPEAKER_01]: Louis should be fan of I.L.D.
12:17 --> 12:21 [SPEAKER_01]: You need to kick the can down the road on this decision and figure it out later.
12:21 --> 12:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Because he's clearly not one of your best five starters, this piggyback thing was an utter disaster.
12:26 --> 12:35 [SPEAKER_01]: And the reason I don't want to see a six-man rotation is because that's taking more turns away from Brian Wu and Emerson Hancock.
12:35 --> 12:38 [SPEAKER_01]: and giving more to a guy with an ERA over six.
12:38 --> 12:44 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't like, the answer to this is Phantemi-Elling, Luis Castillo, it has and always has been.
12:44 --> 12:49 [SPEAKER_01]: That's the answer, and now you're here.
12:49 --> 12:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
12:50 --> 12:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Bullet point number three.
12:52 --> 12:58 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh boy, well, what's amazing is through the first 12 minutes or 13 minutes of this podcast.
12:58 --> 13:00 [SPEAKER_01]: for all the railing we've done so far.
13:01 --> 13:03 [SPEAKER_01]: We haven't even gotten to the worst part of this game yet.
13:03 --> 13:14 [SPEAKER_01]: The part they actually fucking blew and lost, because for as disastrous as all those things have been through the first day things that we're talking about, somehow miraculously, for as awful as the process was.
13:15 --> 13:17 [SPEAKER_01]: they were in a position to win the game.
13:17 --> 13:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Let me preface this too before I even get into the ninth inning.
13:21 --> 13:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Because I'm sure people are going to send us comments about it.
13:23 --> 13:24 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's there.
13:24 --> 13:26 [SPEAKER_01]: The Mariners had one run on one hit here on Tuesday night.
13:27 --> 13:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, they had a horrendous offensive night across the board.
13:29 --> 13:31 [SPEAKER_01]: There's no other way to draw it up horrendous.
13:31 --> 13:38 [SPEAKER_00]: And the lineup they put out while, by the way, was their right-handed hitting lineup, Sands Victor Robless.
13:38 --> 13:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that that is a whole another discussion that we can have after we talk about the night inning.
13:43 --> 13:46 [SPEAKER_00]: But the lineup, the right-hated hitting lineup was an absolute joke.
13:47 --> 13:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it was it was horrendous.
13:49 --> 13:51 [SPEAKER_01]: So let's make that clear.
13:51 --> 13:55 [SPEAKER_01]: They scored one run on one hit absolutely horrendous offensive night.
13:56 --> 14:03 [SPEAKER_01]: but sometimes you do play close, low scoring games, over the course of 162 games, and that doesn't give you an excuse to lose all of them.
14:03 --> 14:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Especially when good Lord, here we go.
14:05 --> 14:11 [SPEAKER_01]: We get to the ninth inning of this game, and somehow this thing has magically worked.
14:12 --> 14:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Somehow this thing has put the Mariners in a one-nothing lead with three outs to go, entering the ninth inning.
14:18 --> 14:26 [SPEAKER_01]: And all of a sudden, in the bottom of the eighth, when the Mariners are hitting, they paned to the bullpen, they paned the broadcast to the bullpen.
14:26 --> 14:28 [SPEAKER_01]: And what is Andre's moonios doing?
14:28 --> 14:40 [SPEAKER_01]: He has his hoodie on, he is not moving, he is not getting loose, he is not getting set to enter the game, and Luis Castillo, who has never been in a situation like this.
14:40 --> 14:46 [SPEAKER_01]: goes back out for the ninth inning of this game, and it goes exactly.
14:47 --> 14:50 [SPEAKER_01]: Egg, exactly how you thought it was going to go.
14:50 --> 14:54 [SPEAKER_01]: He let two runners on, then they decide to pull them.
14:54 --> 15:04 [SPEAKER_01]: They have to leave them in for an extra batter because somehow Dan Wilson doesn't understand the rules of double mound meetings, because the Empire told me, can't go back out and make the change.
15:05 --> 15:06 [SPEAKER_01]: You can't go back out there.
15:06 --> 15:22 [SPEAKER_01]: So Louise had to stay in for an extra batter after giving up a lead off base runner gives up another base runner then it's first in second with nobody out then they go to moonios who is totally totally out of sync and out of rhythm now because he's prepared to just get in there for the 9th.
15:22 --> 15:38 [SPEAKER_01]: start the inning and go now he is entering in the middle of the ninth inning with runners on base and nobody out and unfortunately I'm not knocking moonios at all for this to be totally honest unfortunately then the runs are surrendered and the mariners lose all because you know one
15:38 --> 15:56 [SPEAKER_01]: run game you did not go to your closer who is made and all start game been one of the best in major league baseball for the last like three to four years in spite of the struggles early on this season you don't go to him in a one run game and you lose to the Chicago white socks at home you lose
15:57 --> 16:02 [SPEAKER_00]: because the priority was Luis Castillo's pitch count over putting your best pitchers on the map.
16:03 --> 16:05 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, like, what are we watching?
16:05 --> 16:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Just a disaster process, a disaster process.
16:11 --> 16:14 [SPEAKER_00]: As bad as you could possibly get in this scenario.
16:15 --> 16:23 [SPEAKER_00]: And then you put Munoz into a situation that he, like, it has been tried into that Andre's Munoz does not come into the,
16:23 --> 16:25 [SPEAKER_00]: the middle of an inning, not in a regular season game.
16:25 --> 16:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Scott service tried doing that with him, earlier in his career, and there were some pushback from Andre Spunius about doing that.
16:33 --> 16:43 [SPEAKER_00]: So now he pretty much only gets clean innings, which is kind of fickle, but not the whole point of this discussion, because if the Mariners, the Mariners reliever to do that is MapRash.
16:43 --> 16:44 [SPEAKER_00]: That's what MapRash does.
16:44 --> 16:45 [SPEAKER_00]: He's the fireman.
16:45 --> 16:46 [SPEAKER_00]: He puts things out.
16:46 --> 16:47 [SPEAKER_00]: So,
16:49 --> 16:53 [SPEAKER_00]: of like a terrible, a terrible situation for Andre's Munoz.
16:54 --> 16:57 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't, I honestly can't pick what's the worst thing about the night paying.
16:58 --> 16:59 [SPEAKER_00]: I can't.
16:59 --> 17:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Is it Luis Castillo's starting?
17:02 --> 17:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Is it Dan admitting that he doesn't know the rules for mountain visits?
17:06 --> 17:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Which is like a quarter of his job, mountain visits?
17:11 --> 17:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Doesn't know the rules.
17:12 --> 17:14 [SPEAKER_00]: He admitted in the press conference.
17:14 --> 17:14 [SPEAKER_00]: He didn't know the rules.
17:15 --> 17:16 [SPEAKER_00]: How's that possible?
17:16 --> 17:17 [SPEAKER_00]: They don't.
17:18 --> 17:21 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, this is something they would have asked him if they interviewed him, right?
17:25 --> 17:26 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, do you expect him to answer?
17:28 --> 17:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,
17:56 --> 18:00 [SPEAKER_01]: the questions, but this man answers nothing ever.
18:01 --> 18:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah, you're talking about when he was interviewed for the job was he asked these questions if he knew the rules.
18:07 --> 18:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, dog, the answer is no because they did not do interviews for this job.
18:11 --> 18:14 [SPEAKER_00]: And that seems like a big problem.
18:15 --> 18:16 [SPEAKER_00]: We're talking about bad process.
18:18 --> 18:19 [SPEAKER_00]: That was the start of it.
18:20 --> 18:27 [SPEAKER_01]: when you hired a guy who'd never even managed high school baseball without conducting any interviews and making them the permanent manager.
18:27 --> 18:34 [SPEAKER_00]: But you know what dog this night thing is is a it's a lot a lot of it's on Dan Wilson but it's not just on Dan Wilson.
18:34 --> 18:41 [SPEAKER_00]: You know I Dan Wilson left Luis Castillo out there probably because the front office told him Dan we need Luis to throw more pitches.
18:42 --> 18:44 [SPEAKER_00]: And he had to make the decision.
18:45 --> 18:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
18:45 --> 18:51 [SPEAKER_00]: So to be clear, this is on everybody, this is an organizational failure of a game.
18:52 --> 18:55 [SPEAKER_01]: Dan is the one pushing these buttons in this situation.
18:56 --> 19:05 [SPEAKER_01]: And again, TJ and I are not believers of the mindset that some people out there have are, oh, Dan's just the puppet for the front office and he makes every move they tell them to make.
19:05 --> 19:08 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I don't think that's true at all.
19:08 --> 19:14 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think the front office loves the way a bunch of these games are managed in game by
19:15 --> 19:23 [SPEAKER_01]: And I don't have any concrete like information or or conversations on that matter, but it's just the sense I get from like watching it all.
19:24 --> 19:35 [SPEAKER_01]: However, with this and with the piggyback, blueprint that they've laid out with this, you're right, that they did probably want him to hit a certain threshold of pitches.
19:37 --> 19:39 [SPEAKER_00]: And that is the move again, then made.
19:39 --> 19:43 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, Jared was on the broadcast today talking about the piggyback.
19:43 --> 20:05 [SPEAKER_01]: And to say that's that's that's the evidence you need Yes, like the magic that magically Jerry pops on TV for his for a TV broadcast interview Which I don't think he's done all year Magic Lee he pops on while this controversial piggyback thing is is in full swing of course to yeah to Try to
20:06 --> 20:12 [SPEAKER_01]: look, I don't want to use the word gaslight, but to try and to try and explain, oh, why this is definitely going to work.
20:12 --> 20:12 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a great idea.
20:13 --> 20:16 [SPEAKER_01]: That's what that was.
20:16 --> 20:19 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, and everyone looks terrible now because of it.
20:19 --> 20:21 [SPEAKER_00]: Lown, I have a lot more thoughts on this.
20:22 --> 20:24 [SPEAKER_00]: There are some deeper things we need to get into with this as well.
20:25 --> 20:26 [SPEAKER_00]: We just went through all the bullet points of that.
20:26 --> 20:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's dive in deeper, but first, let's pause here for an ad.
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21:33 --> 21:36 [SPEAKER_00]: You don't want to my main takeaways from this game.
21:36 --> 21:39 [SPEAKER_00]: The Mariners treated this game.
21:40 --> 21:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, they're a team that's not a winner, like they're a team that's not trying to win a world series.
21:46 --> 21:49 [SPEAKER_00]: Like they're a team full of really young players that just need to play.
21:49 --> 21:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Kind of like the white socks.
21:51 --> 21:57 [SPEAKER_00]: They didn't really treat it like a team that's trying to do the everything they can to win baseball games.
21:57 --> 21:58 [SPEAKER_00]: That's what they did.
22:00 --> 22:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.
22:02 --> 22:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Contending teams don't do this.
22:05 --> 22:11 [SPEAKER_01]: No, they don't they don't hold on to a guy with a six and a half the array in their rotation just because
22:12 --> 22:15 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh well you can't yank him like he's he's the veteran.
22:15 --> 22:16 [SPEAKER_01]: He's been there.
22:16 --> 22:35 [SPEAKER_01]: He's done that No, if you want to win the world series, you're putting your best arms out on the mound If you were putting your best arms out on the mound tonight Bryce Miller keeps going or even if he doesn't and he's pulled where they pulled them to go get Murakami Then you start going to your bullpen arms with a like even with a bullpen arm or with a bullpen that's taxed and injured
22:36 --> 22:39 [SPEAKER_01]: if you were gonna pull Bryce after five and two thirds.
22:39 --> 22:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's where you start to go to for rare and then you go to Bizarredo and then you go to Moon Yo that you have to use somebody else like Chris Wall.
22:45 --> 22:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
22:46 --> 22:59 [SPEAKER_01]: But no, it is not to have Luis Castillo start throwing the sixth and seventh and eighth and ninth innings when he has a sixth and a happy array and then not go to your closer in a one-run game.
23:00 --> 23:07 [SPEAKER_00]: And you know what, if they want to use Luis Castillo as a two-in-ing bullpen arm, thought he looked totally fine in the two-innings.
23:07 --> 23:09 [SPEAKER_00]: That was, that was not the problem.
23:09 --> 23:12 [SPEAKER_00]: when he kept going and the decision to keep him in for the night.
23:12 --> 23:14 [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, that, that one was really bad.
23:14 --> 23:16 [SPEAKER_00]: What else, what else am I thinking here?
23:18 --> 23:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Have we really hit everything?
23:23 --> 23:25 [SPEAKER_00]: Do we just like, we blitz through it?
23:25 --> 23:26 [SPEAKER_00]: Do we blitz through it too fast?
23:27 --> 23:34 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know about too fast, but listen, there are episodes throughout the year where we're going to start railing about stuff and we certainly did.
23:35 --> 23:35 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean,
23:38 --> 23:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Look, I think the biggest problem about tonight, ultimately is that the Mariners refused to commit to a plan of what they were going to do.
23:45 --> 23:48 [SPEAKER_00]: They might have said they had a plan.
23:48 --> 23:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Everything they did within this game showed they didn't have a plan.
23:52 --> 24:00 [SPEAKER_00]: They weren't going to treat this like a true piggyback scenario where they were going to split innings regardless of the situation.
24:00 --> 24:08 [SPEAKER_00]: They treated it like they were kind of feeling their way through it, which is the wrong way to do when you're trying to get multiple innings at a multiple guys.
24:09 --> 24:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Bad, bad, bad process, bad.
24:12 --> 24:15 [SPEAKER_00]: So, that was, you know, that was really bad.
24:15 --> 24:18 [SPEAKER_00]: I thought that was really poorly executed.
24:18 --> 24:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Really, I know you hate the six-man rotation.
24:20 --> 24:26 [SPEAKER_00]: If they really want Luis Castillo to start big league games, then go to a six-man rotation.
24:26 --> 24:32 [SPEAKER_00]: If that is your priority, which tonight told us that is their priority, then you go to a six-man rotation.
24:33 --> 24:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, but that right there is an issue in its own right of the mindset you have when you're trying to contend for a world series.
24:41 --> 24:45 [SPEAKER_01]: You're saying if you want Luis Castillo to stay in your rotation and that's your priority.
24:45 --> 24:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Both stop, both stop.
24:49 --> 24:52 [SPEAKER_01]: He's not pitching like a guy that can be in a world series contending rotation.
24:52 --> 24:53 [SPEAKER_01]: He's just not.
24:53 --> 24:54 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm sorry.
24:55 --> 24:56 [SPEAKER_01]: So you got to find another solution.
24:57 --> 25:06 [SPEAKER_01]: If you were like, yes, you can have him as an option if somebody goes on the IL and you need to insert somebody back into the rotation, which is why I keep talking about this fan of IL thing.
25:07 --> 25:12 [SPEAKER_01]: So he can stay stretched out and he can work on some things, but he doesn't have to shorten his workload and go into the bullpen.
25:14 --> 25:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Again, is this year about winning the World Series or not?
25:17 --> 25:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Because the way up they have handled the Louise Castillo situation for a guy who has trended the wrong way for multiple years now, and now it's really all blowing up has really been bad.
25:27 --> 25:32 [SPEAKER_01]: It really has, and now again, you're forced feeding him innings.
25:32 --> 25:33 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
25:33 --> 25:36 [SPEAKER_01]: Instead of winning, or do you want to win the World Series or not?
25:36 --> 25:39 [SPEAKER_01]: And then you don't get explanations on these things ever.
25:39 --> 25:40 [SPEAKER_00]: And you know what?
25:40 --> 25:48 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, we're at the point now where if you put Luis Castillo in the bullpen, you do have starter depth in the minor leagues.
25:48 --> 25:54 [SPEAKER_00]: I think we're far enough along at this point, Lyle, even with his last start, if you need Kate Anderson to start a big league game, he'll be ready.
25:55 --> 26:02 [SPEAKER_00]: He might not be the best pitcher in your rotation,
26:02 --> 26:08 [SPEAKER_00]: So, you don't lose your starter depth by putting Luis Castillo in the bullpen.
26:08 --> 26:09 [SPEAKER_00]: Not at all.
26:10 --> 26:14 [SPEAKER_00]: And I know someone in the Mariners organization has to feel that as well.
26:14 --> 26:20 [SPEAKER_00]: But they're trying to hang on to Luis Castillo and I don't know if that's what you want to hang your hat on.
26:20 --> 26:24 [SPEAKER_01]: And he's not going to survive all these crunches, all these roster crunches eventually.
26:24 --> 26:27 [SPEAKER_01]: What are you going to do with them when K-D Anderson gets here?
26:27 --> 26:30 [SPEAKER_01]: You're going to go through this whole charade again with all the other guys in the rotation?
26:31 --> 26:34 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, by the way, come next year.
26:35 --> 26:40 [SPEAKER_01]: you're gonna have additional starter depth because Logan Evans will be back from Tommy John.
26:40 --> 26:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Kate Anderson should be ready.
26:42 --> 26:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Ryan Sloan should be right on the doorstep and you'll still have the other five in the rotation.
26:46 --> 26:47 [SPEAKER_01]: You're gonna have starter depth.
26:49 --> 26:51 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't understand what they're holding on to.
26:51 --> 26:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Do you want to win the world series this year or not?
26:55 --> 27:01 [SPEAKER_01]: Force feeding him into these games doesn't make any sense and then again when you get out when when when when when damn Well, so gets asked about these things.
27:02 --> 27:02 [SPEAKER_01]: No answer.
27:02 --> 27:20 [SPEAKER_01]: None like nothing like it's it's gonna be a lot of words and a lot of and a lot of trying to like Um, and you know his way through things and then he doesn't give an answer by the way Like speaking of non-answers and speaking of mismanaged baseball games especially late
27:20 --> 27:39 [SPEAKER_01]: To this day, I don't know how, and honestly, we probably haven't spent, like, for as much time as we've spent on this in the last eight months, we probably still haven't spent enough time on it, which is, we still don't have an explanation for why Andre's Moon News was not in the game against the Blue Jays in game seven in the seven inning.
27:40 --> 27:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, to this day, nobody has offered an actual explanation to it.
27:44 --> 27:45 [SPEAKER_01]: Nobody.
27:45 --> 27:48 [SPEAKER_01]: Like answers are not ever given to this stuff.
27:49 --> 27:55 [SPEAKER_01]: Processes occur, they don't go well, they blow up in the face, and then there's no answers given.
27:56 --> 28:00 [SPEAKER_01]: For as much time as everybody's spent on that Muno's thing, it's honestly not enough.
28:02 --> 28:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and the thing with all of this, there are some people, a lot of people in our comments who want changes made, because they feel like,
28:14 --> 28:16 [SPEAKER_00]: The leadership of this team is not good enough.
28:16 --> 28:22 [SPEAKER_00]: The Dan Wilson is not good enough to bring this team back to the postseason that it's one season and done.
28:23 --> 28:24 [SPEAKER_00]: They doesn't have it to keep going.
28:25 --> 28:27 [SPEAKER_00]: The AL West might prevent that from happening.
28:28 --> 28:32 [SPEAKER_00]: This team might truly not be out of it, even if they're bad.
28:33 --> 28:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Again, still today, while what are they, a game and a half of the two games back, they were game back entering the game today.
28:38 --> 28:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so they are, they are.
28:44 --> 28:48 [SPEAKER_01]: You can't take yourself seriously about the playoffs until you're over 500.
28:49 --> 28:50 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't care what the ALS says.
28:50 --> 28:52 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't care what the division's standing currently say.
28:52 --> 28:56 [SPEAKER_01]: You can't talk about the playoffs if you're under 500.
28:56 --> 29:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Like if you like one way or another, the way the season's gonna shake out when you end the year, like you're gonna have to be over 500 to make the playoffs.
29:05 --> 29:09 [SPEAKER_01]: And they have been over 500, zero times this season.
29:09 --> 29:14 [SPEAKER_01]: You want to start taking a playoff series that you got to be over 500, their four games under.
29:14 --> 29:37 [SPEAKER_01]: As we sit now, and this episode comes out on May the 20th, we are near a third of the way through this season, and a team that had the third best odds to win the world series is four games under 500, and has a chance to lose multiple series in the course of two weeks to the Chicago White Sox.
29:37 --> 29:38 [SPEAKER_00]: disaster.
29:38 --> 29:47 [SPEAKER_00]: You know, it's also kind of troubling while outside of Victor Robless, who by the way, the Mariners had to extend his rehab stint because he's not hitting at all.
29:48 --> 29:50 [SPEAKER_00]: This is the Mariners right-handed lineup.
29:52 --> 29:52 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
29:53 --> 29:54 [SPEAKER_00]: Does that seem like a problem?
29:54 --> 29:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, it does.
29:56 --> 30:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you don't have Cal, but all the other role players that you're looking to contribute against a left-handed
30:06 --> 30:07 [SPEAKER_00]: It's it's not working.
30:08 --> 30:10 [SPEAKER_00]: It's it's still not working.
30:10 --> 30:17 [SPEAKER_00]: They faced a really mediocre left handed pitcher tonight in can't Anthony K. Yeah, truly mediocre.
30:18 --> 30:23 [SPEAKER_00]: It's got a fifth of nearly five and a half one hit.
30:23 --> 30:32 [SPEAKER_01]: Wow, they had Patrick wisdom batting fifth tonight and because of that and some other news circling around the league
30:32 --> 30:37 [SPEAKER_01]: I would like to propose somebody to submit this mailback question to us for Friday.
30:38 --> 30:50 [SPEAKER_01]: I think we have too many things otherwise in this episode to talk about, but because of what we're watching out of the right-handed lineup right now, and some of the guys that are currently on the roster, I would like to talk about this on Friday.
30:50 --> 30:52 [SPEAKER_01]: So I hope somebody sends this as a mailback question.
30:53 --> 30:55 [SPEAKER_01]: I would be checking in on Royce Lewis.
30:55 --> 31:00 [SPEAKER_01]: I know it's been a bad stretch in Minnesota, but he's wanted to be out of there for a while.
31:01 --> 31:03 [SPEAKER_01]: I think that whole situation's run, it's course.
31:04 --> 31:21 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not saying he's gonna be the Royce Lewis that was one straffed to number one overall, but when you've got some of the right-handed bats that are currently on your roster and occupying your bench, yeah, I look into that because he seems like somebody that has the chance to be a spark plug.
31:22 --> 31:26 [SPEAKER_00]: I really hate to keep racking on Rob Reff's lighter because he was super nice to us when we talk to him.
31:27 --> 31:34 [SPEAKER_00]: But the man had three at bats against K today and got one week ground ball and two strike out.
31:34 --> 31:42 [SPEAKER_00]: It's really unfair to look at individual games from players and say that is not good enough.
31:42 --> 31:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Because baseball is a game of failure and sometimes guys just stink.
31:46 --> 31:51 [SPEAKER_00]: But Rob Raff Snyder's OPS for the season is now under 400 on the season.
31:51 --> 31:56 [SPEAKER_00]: He is almost exclusively hitting against left handed pitchers, what he's supposed to crush.
31:56 --> 32:03 [SPEAKER_00]: And he gets a mediocre left handed pitcher tonight and makes contact one of the three at bats.
32:06 --> 32:09 [SPEAKER_00]: At some point, like at some point, it
32:10 --> 32:11 [SPEAKER_00]: It's it's just time.
32:12 --> 32:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, it's just it's just not it's just not good enough.
32:15 --> 32:26 [SPEAKER_00]: And he's batting lead off tonight and honestly like again I can't I can't blame the mayor's for trying to get something out of the situation because frankly the rest of the mayor's lineup was bad tonight
32:26 --> 32:30 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, up and down the lineup was the talent was not there.
32:30 --> 32:33 [SPEAKER_00]: The talent and experience was not there in the lineup tonight.
32:33 --> 32:43 [SPEAKER_00]: If there was any situation where you were going to put Rob Ruff's center back at the top of the lineup, it was going to be in a situation where you're giving guys days off and it's a mediocre left handed picture on the mount.
32:44 --> 32:47 [SPEAKER_00]: And he still just can't take the opportunity.
32:48 --> 32:53 [SPEAKER_00]: to do anything, and it's like, it's becoming a really, really, really big, oh, becoming.
32:54 --> 32:56 [SPEAKER_00]: It is a huge problem for the Mariners.
32:57 --> 33:00 [SPEAKER_00]: There is, there is supposed to be production, and it's the exact opposite.
33:02 --> 33:06 [SPEAKER_01]: Please, somebody send us a mail that I question about Royce Lewis, because I would like to talk about him.
33:07 --> 33:13 [SPEAKER_00]: One other huge alarm bell, a huge alarm bell that is continuing to snowball, and maybe this is on Dan.
33:14 --> 33:17 [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe this is on the players, maybe this is on the talent and structure of the roster.
33:18 --> 33:20 [SPEAKER_00]: The Mariners are now the worst team in baseball on one run games.
33:23 --> 33:23 [SPEAKER_00]: 6 and 12.
33:25 --> 33:27 [SPEAKER_01]: I think there's a lot of blame to go around with that.
33:27 --> 33:30 [SPEAKER_01]: I will say when you are that bad in one run games,
33:31 --> 33:35 [SPEAKER_01]: There's blame pi to go around but a lot of that falls on decision-making man.
33:36 --> 33:36 [SPEAKER_01]: It just does.
33:36 --> 33:43 [SPEAKER_01]: When things get that close it does and the high test of everything you've watched would check out with that and defense.
33:44 --> 33:50 [SPEAKER_00]: That too Please tell me you saw that throw Connor Joe made today.
33:51 --> 33:53 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh That was tough.
33:54 --> 33:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, you saw it.
33:55 --> 34:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, it was it was bad Connor Joe I think made the worst throw it ever seen from a big leaker today
34:03 --> 34:04 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm I'm serious.
34:04 --> 34:05 [SPEAKER_00]: I think it was the worst one ever.
34:07 --> 34:13 [SPEAKER_00]: He, he threw ball aiming for third base and ended up throwing it to Randy Rosarade.
34:16 --> 34:16 [SPEAKER_00]: No words.
34:17 --> 34:17 [SPEAKER_00]: No words.
34:18 --> 34:19 [SPEAKER_00]: How is this team's defense going to get better?
34:21 --> 34:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Well,
34:22 --> 34:38 [SPEAKER_01]: I have one suggestion, but yet, again, with a process that just continues to boggle my mind, there is at the very least one thing you could sure fire do to improve the defense.
34:38 --> 34:46 [SPEAKER_01]: And that would be to play Cold Emerson, I hell of a lot more at shortstop, but they seem hellbent on not doing that.
34:46 --> 34:52 [SPEAKER_01]: JP Crawford is in the first percentile of major lead baseball and outsob of average.
34:52 --> 35:03 [SPEAKER_01]: And by the way, if you don't like numbers and you don't like advanced stats and you are a pure eye test person, I think the eye test is telling you the same thing these days, man, more so than ever with JP.
35:03 --> 35:06 [SPEAKER_01]: But yes, that's only one position.
35:06 --> 35:09 [SPEAKER_01]: You've got a problem at third base with Donovan's out there.
35:09 --> 35:10 [SPEAKER_01]: You've got a problem in left field.
35:10 --> 35:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Julio is not played stellar, I mean, the numbers say as in played stellar defense in center field, I hope by the end of the year, corrects itself, it probably will.
35:18 --> 35:23 [SPEAKER_01]: You have a problem, right field defensively, you have a problem at, where else?
35:23 --> 35:27 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that's like everywhere, except for catcher second base and I guess center field.
35:27 --> 35:28 [SPEAKER_01]: You've got a problem.
35:28 --> 35:30 [SPEAKER_01]: I may be not first base because nail is in line.
35:30 --> 35:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Wherever Colt Emerson plays on the head field.
35:33 --> 35:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Like you got a problem at way too many spots defensively, you have a problem at too many spots defensively, you can't hit left handed pitching to save your life.
35:40 --> 35:44 [SPEAKER_01]: Decision making the decision making is all over the place and it's cost to you games.
35:46 --> 35:47 [SPEAKER_01]: There are things that are really blowing up.
35:48 --> 35:48 [SPEAKER_00]: They are.
35:48 --> 35:52 [SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, when you're bad on the margins, you're not going to win one run games.
35:53 --> 35:54 [SPEAKER_00]: And the Americans are terrible on the margins.
35:55 --> 35:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Terrible.
35:57 --> 35:58 [SPEAKER_01]: And I will say.
35:59 --> 36:16 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, just going back to this price miller presser where he looked pretty frustrated, I will say Matt, like, usually players are not as tuned in on decisions as fans and media will be, because players are too focused on just winning the game.
36:16 --> 36:22 [SPEAKER_01]: They don't have time to sit around and think about every little nitpicky decision that's going on.
36:22 --> 36:26 [SPEAKER_01]: They're most like 99% of players
36:26 --> 36:39 [SPEAKER_01]: are probably not thinking about the idea of why is Luke Rayleigh getting yanked in the sixth inning when there's going to be another better right-handed reliever coming into the game later and playing the chess of leaving him for one at bat against the lefzi so you get him against the righty.
36:40 --> 36:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Most players are probably not thinking about that.
36:43 --> 36:50 [SPEAKER_01]: But when you see the things that unfolded tonight as a player, it's impossible to miss.
36:51 --> 36:54 [SPEAKER_01]: And you do have to wonder,
36:55 --> 37:01 [SPEAKER_01]: if it's some point, there is going to be a bit of a turn in that clubhouse at some point.
37:02 --> 37:10 [SPEAKER_01]: If there hasn't been already with all the monos discourse that went on after Game 7 of the ALCS, because there's no way all those players didn't see in here about all that.
37:10 --> 37:11 [SPEAKER_01]: It was everywhere.
37:12 --> 37:15 [SPEAKER_01]: You have to wonder if things like this,
37:16 --> 37:20 [SPEAKER_01]: are gonna get some sort of lack of response from the players.
37:20 --> 37:30 [SPEAKER_01]: You don't know, but I think it's fair to ask the question when these things keep happening and you have losses that result like that, where they are as can't miss in terms of decisions as you can draw up.
37:31 --> 37:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Do the players think they're being put in the best position possible to win games?
37:35 --> 37:36 [SPEAKER_00]: So all these guys want to win.
37:36 --> 37:37 [SPEAKER_00]: At least I think they want to win.
37:37 --> 37:39 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm pretty sure they want to win.
37:39 --> 37:40 [SPEAKER_00]: If that's the case,
37:41 --> 37:48 [SPEAKER_00]: If they ever start thinking they're not getting put in the best position to win, then that wouldn't be good.
37:48 --> 37:55 [SPEAKER_00]: That would be really, because once the trust erodes within the clubhouse, then it's over, then it's 24 or all over again.
37:56 --> 37:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Like the players in trust Scott, they didn't respect Scott by the end.
38:00 --> 38:01 [SPEAKER_00]: They're ready for him to be gone.
38:03 --> 38:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
38:03 --> 38:05 [SPEAKER_00]: And we know how that 2024 team went.
38:06 --> 38:08 [SPEAKER_00]: When a team is not happy, they don't play well.
38:08 --> 38:10 [SPEAKER_00]: They don't play well in the margins like that 2024 team would.
38:11 --> 38:13 [SPEAKER_00]: And they would be as excruciating as possible to watch.
38:15 --> 38:19 [SPEAKER_00]: This team is feeling a whole lot like 2024 right now, the way they're playing.
38:22 --> 38:23 [SPEAKER_01]: What else we got?
38:23 --> 38:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Have we, have we, have we squeezed all the juice out of the topic
38:30 --> 38:36 [SPEAKER_00]: We didn't get to talk about pinch-hitting decisions though to be honest, like they were whatever.
38:36 --> 38:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Like the ones in the night they'd think like you had Luke Rayleigh and Dom Kanson pinch-hitting in a one-run game like all right.
38:42 --> 38:47 [SPEAKER_00]: Like we said we want them taking important abats late in the games and and they did, so that was fine.
38:49 --> 38:49 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that's it.
38:50 --> 38:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, what about what about the tarps off crew dog?
38:54 --> 38:54 [SPEAKER_00]: Great.
38:55 --> 38:57 [SPEAKER_00]: I will say that they did show out.
38:57 --> 38:59 [SPEAKER_00]: There was like five sections of them.
39:00 --> 39:02 [SPEAKER_00]: They did Listen credit to them.
39:02 --> 39:09 [SPEAKER_00]: They they made the rounds, but I didn't actually think we would get that I honestly maybe I would been a I've been in a bubble.
39:09 --> 39:19 [SPEAKER_01]: I thought that was only gonna be St. Louis I guess not I mean All right, like
39:20 --> 39:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Do we want to talk about cult at all, oh, you dropped your hat now?
39:24 --> 39:25 [SPEAKER_01]: I did, I didn't, I didn't, yes.
39:26 --> 39:29 [SPEAKER_01]: All right, as TJ bends down to go get his hat back.
39:31 --> 39:34 [SPEAKER_01]: do we want to talk about Colt here for a minute?
39:34 --> 39:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Like I'm trying to figure out if it even fits the podcast.
39:39 --> 39:52 [SPEAKER_00]: Well, we can talk about Colt because it does relate to a storyline that we were talking about heading into this series with the white socks, but before that while, let's tell everyone that blackberry smoke is headed to Emerald Queen Casino Friday, June 12th at 730 p.m.
39:52 --> 39:54 [SPEAKER_00]: The southern rock standouts.
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39:56 --> 39:59 [SPEAKER_00]: You can get your tickets at emeraldqueen.com.
39:59 --> 40:06 [SPEAKER_00]: While you're down there, you can check out the bet MGM sportsbook at Emerald Queen Casino where we will be holding our trivia night.
40:06 --> 40:11 [SPEAKER_00]: One week here from recording on Tuesday, May 26th at 6 p.m.
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40:31 --> 40:34 [SPEAKER_00]: We got to talk about the scenes from Monday night.
40:34 --> 40:41 [SPEAKER_00]: We can squeeze a tiny bit of positivity into this episode that maybe some people were waiting to hear us talk about.
40:42 --> 40:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Cole Emerson has his first hit, his first home run on Monday night.
40:46 --> 40:54 [SPEAKER_00]: But not only does he do that, he hits it over the head of one Jared Kelnick in right field.
40:55 --> 40:57 [SPEAKER_00]: Symbolic.
40:58 --> 41:00 [SPEAKER_01]: It was pretty symbolic, you can't lie.
41:01 --> 41:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Before we even get to that, we should just talk about how cool it was for Colt.
41:05 --> 41:13 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, watching that on Monday night, when I was watching the game, yeah, I got up and started pumping my fist and yelled, let's go.
41:13 --> 41:16 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I was fired up for Colt to see that go down the way I did.
41:17 --> 41:18 [SPEAKER_01]: You can't draw it up better than that.
41:19 --> 41:22 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, he essentially ends the game in the eighth inning.
41:22 --> 41:46 [SPEAKER_01]: with a with a home run that puts the game out of reach and you see him cross home plate and he screams let's fucking go I mean he's fired up and his whole family's there and you see Brian lose dad hugging Colt Emerson's dad I mean it was it was so cool that was so cool and to see Colt have that happen as his family's all in the stands to watch it I mean awesome so so cool mm-hmm
41:47 --> 41:49 [SPEAKER_00]: glad they actually got to see us first takes.
41:49 --> 41:52 [SPEAKER_00]: They weren't able to see it on Sunday because it was so abrupt.
41:52 --> 41:54 [SPEAKER_00]: That swing he had was crazy too.
41:54 --> 41:55 [SPEAKER_00]: He was totally fooled.
41:56 --> 42:06 [SPEAKER_00]: He was waiting for a fastball, got an off speed pitch instead was so off balance, but you know, being the great hitter he is was able to get his barrel on the ball and poke it over the fence.
42:06 --> 42:08 [SPEAKER_00]: Awesome, awesome, awesome for Cole.
42:08 --> 42:10 [SPEAKER_00]: on a fun Monday night.
42:10 --> 42:11 [SPEAKER_00]: It was a really fun Monday night.
42:11 --> 42:17 [SPEAKER_00]: You'd never know after this Tuesday game that Monday was actually really fun and really pleasant and everyone played well.
42:17 --> 42:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's funny.
42:18 --> 42:26 [SPEAKER_01]: You know how sometimes when divisible tweet out hashtag rewrite, when a game goes off script and off course later.
42:26 --> 42:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Like tonight.
42:27 --> 42:47 [SPEAKER_01]: Like tonight, when the storyline changes late and you have to rewrite a story because a little bit of a peak behind the curtain, as two people who did some beatwriting in college, writers will start to write their stories as the game progresses on, so they're on it and ahead of it, as much as they can be beforehand, because a lot of these writers have to write on deadline.
42:48 --> 42:54 [SPEAKER_01]: If they don't get the story in by a certain deadline, it doesn't get published as soon as it can possibly get published.
42:55 --> 43:01 [SPEAKER_01]: When a game goes south, when a game goes off script late in the game, and the narrative changes you have to change up the story.
43:02 --> 43:06 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's why Divish sometimes writes hashtag rewrite, because he has to rewrite some of this story.
43:07 --> 43:16 [SPEAKER_01]: I would say we had to do a hashtag rewrite on this podcast today because we were going to spend a lot more time talking about Colt deservingly so because he has been awesome.
43:16 --> 43:27 [SPEAKER_01]: We were going to spend some time talking about Logan Gilbert which we now didn't get to get to in this episode and just trying to highlight what's been part of the struggles for him this year.
43:27 --> 43:29 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh no, that all went out the window.
43:29 --> 43:36 [SPEAKER_01]: The minute Andre's moonios left in the ball bend to start the ninth inning, and especially when it all went south and they lost the game.
43:36 --> 43:38 [SPEAKER_01]: We did a hash category right for this podcast.
43:38 --> 43:40 [SPEAKER_01]: So now we don't get to talk about Colton as much.
43:40 --> 43:49 [SPEAKER_01]: I wish we had, I wish the highlight of this episode and the thumbnail of this episode on YouTube and the title of this episode was gonna all be about Colton Morrison's first big league hit in home run.
43:50 --> 43:52 [SPEAKER_01]: That is now not the case.
43:52 --> 43:54 [SPEAKER_00]: I can go on the Marine Lair podcast archives.
43:55 --> 43:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Yep.
43:56 --> 43:57 [SPEAKER_00]: Yep.
43:57 --> 43:57 [SPEAKER_00]: It can.
43:58 --> 44:01 [SPEAKER_00]: But we need to talk about the symbolism of this dog.
44:02 --> 44:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Because...
44:03 --> 44:05 [SPEAKER_00]: It, of course, it involves one jargonic.
44:05 --> 44:13 [SPEAKER_00]: If Jared's not going to give us a home around this week, then he's going to give us a storyline, regardless, and man did Monday provide a storyline.
44:13 --> 44:16 [SPEAKER_00]: I laid it out on our social media posts here on Tuesday morning.
44:17 --> 44:18 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's try and do a spark notes version of this.
44:18 --> 44:21 [SPEAKER_00]: Allow you love spark notes, but you're a big fan of spark notes.
44:21 --> 44:28 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, considering I didn't read a single book in junior high high school whenever, yeah, spark notes was a savior.
44:29 --> 44:29 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
44:29 --> 44:33 [SPEAKER_00]: So let's spark note this
44:33 --> 44:37 [SPEAKER_00]: Jared Kelnik is out there in right field.
44:37 --> 44:40 [SPEAKER_00]: Cole Emerson hits the home run over his head.
44:40 --> 44:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Now Colt is the shiny new toy prospect of the 2026 Seattle Mariners, just like Jared Kelnick was back in 2021, both represent the same era of Mariners baseball, but they are at poor opposite ends of the story.
44:59 --> 45:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Jared Kelnick was supposed to be the start, V-start.
45:03 --> 45:09 [SPEAKER_00]: Not Logan Gilbert, Jared Colnick was supposed to be the start of this era of Mariners Baseball.
45:09 --> 45:27 [SPEAKER_00]: He's the one who was supposed to be playing right field for the Seattle Mariners this week or not or left field, yeah or left wherever they were going to play him, not Randy Rosarena, Domkinson, Luke Rayleigh, Connor Joe, not those guys, supposed to be Jared Colnick, but it's not him.
45:28 --> 45:31 [SPEAKER_00]: Cole Emerson is now supposed to be in the future.
45:32 --> 45:37 [SPEAKER_00]: The Mariners shortstop going forward, and he has been rewarded handsomely with his contract.
45:39 --> 45:46 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, I owe it almost view Cole Emerson as the cherry on top of this current crop of Seattle Mariners.
45:47 --> 45:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, he is sort of the
45:51 --> 46:18 [SPEAKER_00]: fun like add-on piece to an already successful core of Mariners players that Jared Kelnick was supposed to be leading and the fact that Colt hits the Homer over Jared's head maybe being to bring back some memories for Jared Kelnick in that moment remembering what by the way his first big lead hit was in the second game of his big lead career also to right field
46:19 --> 46:23 [SPEAKER_01]: in that in that very ballpark and pull shot to right field.
46:24 --> 46:24 [SPEAKER_00]: Same thing.
46:25 --> 46:30 [SPEAKER_01]: Both high school prep prospects hitting prospects from the Midwest too.
46:31 --> 46:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, cold Jared.
46:33 --> 46:35 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, there's there's similarities there, man.
46:35 --> 46:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Not in the personalities, that's for sure.
46:37 --> 46:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Colts.
46:38 --> 46:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Colts a pretty level headed mature 20 year old about as bad as mature as you'll find.
46:42 --> 46:48 [SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, there's a symbolism there
46:48 --> 46:51 [SPEAKER_01]: Did you notice who gave Colt the Trident when he hit the homer?
46:52 --> 47:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Because I don't know if people picked up on this as much as the Celtic part or not, but when Colt got that Trident, the man who handed it to him was JP Crawford.
47:04 --> 47:07 [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm sure JP's not thinking about it in that moment in time.
47:08 --> 47:11 [SPEAKER_01]: But to me, that only signaled more symbolism.
47:11 --> 47:14 [SPEAKER_01]: Because when JP handed Colt that Trident,
47:14 --> 47:17 [SPEAKER_01]: That almost felt like a passing of the torch.
47:17 --> 47:19 [SPEAKER_01]: JP's not going anywhere this year.
47:19 --> 47:30 [SPEAKER_01]: He's still going to be on the team, but you are seeing the passing of the torch occur in real time because the man who hit the home run last night in Cold Emerson is going to be your shortstop for the next decade.
47:30 --> 47:31 [SPEAKER_01]: It's not going to be JP Crawford.
47:32 --> 47:35 [SPEAKER_01]: That passing of the tried and almost felt like a passing of the torch.
47:37 --> 47:38 [SPEAKER_00]: This is why we love baseball.
47:38 --> 47:44 [SPEAKER_00]: There's always, it's always something and one of all these things tie in at the same time, it makes it that much cooler.
47:44 --> 47:45 [SPEAKER_00]: I do wonder what Jared was thinking.
47:46 --> 47:52 [SPEAKER_00]: I honestly wonder if he had time to sit there and like think about what just happened in that moment.
47:53 --> 47:57 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, honestly, do you think Jared knows who Colt Emerson is?
47:57 --> 47:58 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
48:00 --> 48:09 [SPEAKER_01]: Um, like do you think he knows he's this ridiculously highly regarded prospect for the Mariners that's 20 question 2021 20 21 years old.
48:09 --> 48:09 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
48:10 --> 48:12 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, Jared's got a lot of other interests.
48:12 --> 48:17 [SPEAKER_01]: He does a lot of Hunning and and out door stuff in the off season.
48:17 --> 48:22 [SPEAKER_01]: Like I think he started a YouTube channel around like his families like, you know, Hunning hobby now.
48:23 --> 48:26 [SPEAKER_01]: Like I think I saw them doing some stuff like that.
48:26 --> 48:30 [SPEAKER_01]: So I don't know, like, he might not be that locked in on prospects.
48:31 --> 48:33 [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe he heard some more point of it at the ballpark this week.
48:34 --> 48:37 [SPEAKER_00]: So maybe this is only a fan thing that we noticed.
48:37 --> 48:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Could be, or Jared could know exactly who Colt-Emerson is.
48:40 --> 48:41 [SPEAKER_01]: He could know what ice-gully went to.
48:41 --> 48:43 [SPEAKER_01]: He could know what town he grew up in.
48:43 --> 48:44 [SPEAKER_01]: He could know what picky was drafted in 2023.
48:45 --> 48:46 [SPEAKER_01]: He could know all of it.
48:47 --> 48:47 [SPEAKER_01]: It's tough to say.
48:48 --> 48:50 [SPEAKER_01]: You don't really know for sure.
48:51 --> 49:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Now I will say if you want to talk about Jared here for a minute, the only way this series could get more hilarious is after the absolute
49:01 --> 49:11 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, disaster class that we watched here on Tuesday night is if it's then followed up on Wednesday in the matinee by a two-home run game for Jared Kalnik as the Mariners lose the series.
49:11 --> 49:14 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you wanna talk about a one-seek.
49:14 --> 49:28 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, you wanna talk about a one-two punch combo, a Dan Wilson master class and I say that sarcastically here on Tuesday night and then a Jared Kalnik anchored white socks went on Wednesday, oh my God.
49:28 --> 49:29 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean,
49:30 --> 49:32 [SPEAKER_01]: I will not be exiting Twitter for the next week.
49:34 --> 49:39 [SPEAKER_00]: Or maybe you would because you'd be in a fit of, well actually no, because it's Jared.
49:39 --> 49:40 [SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, you'd be fine.
49:40 --> 49:41 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, I'd be fired up for Jared.
49:42 --> 49:49 [SPEAKER_00]: It would be like the ballot, like because loud would be pissed, but with Jared hitting two home runs, it literally goes like balances out.
49:49 --> 49:49 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
49:49 --> 49:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah.
49:50 --> 49:51 [SPEAKER_00]: There's no doubt.
49:52 --> 49:52 [SPEAKER_01]: No.
49:52 --> 49:53 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh my god.
49:54 --> 49:58 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that's the first ever podcast we've done like that over a regular season game.
49:58 --> 49:59 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm totally honest.
50:00 --> 50:01 [SPEAKER_00]: I think so.
50:01 --> 50:02 [SPEAKER_01]: In terms of the emotions.
50:03 --> 50:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
50:03 --> 50:05 [SPEAKER_01]: There's in some emotional podcast.
50:05 --> 50:06 [SPEAKER_01]: There's no doubt.
50:06 --> 50:12 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, like during that raise series last year or, I mean, I would say some of our offseason episodes in years past.
50:12 --> 50:14 [SPEAKER_00]: You mean the raise series we boycotted?
50:15 --> 50:17 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that one where we didn't watch any of the games.
50:17 --> 50:18 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
50:18 --> 50:19 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, because we were still furious.
50:19 --> 50:23 [SPEAKER_01]: They were losing and we're look like they were costing themselves a playoff spot.
50:23 --> 50:27 [SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, I mean, that series.
50:28 --> 50:39 [SPEAKER_01]: But you're right, I mean, dude, the emotions of that episode felt not not quite like game one carry carpenter against tigers, because I don't think it can quite get to that.
50:39 --> 50:43 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I didn't even rank where all these decisions would be on the carpenter meter.
50:43 --> 50:46 [SPEAKER_01]: I tweeted it out, and God, I am the worst.
50:46 --> 50:51 [SPEAKER_01]: Like we have got to get this graphic main because God, for that, for tonight,
50:51 --> 50:56 [SPEAKER_01]: having the carpenter meter graphic would have been just so perfect because it was so worn at tonight.
50:56 --> 50:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, that's a nine.
50:58 --> 50:58 [SPEAKER_01]: That's a nine.
50:59 --> 51:01 [SPEAKER_01]: That's about as high as it can get in the regular season.
51:02 --> 51:03 [SPEAKER_01]: Tens are carry carpenter.
51:03 --> 51:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Tens are Edward Bazardo against George springer in game seven.
51:08 --> 51:15 [SPEAKER_01]: That is about as close as you can get to the tail end of the carpenter meter in the regular season.
51:16 --> 51:17 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
51:18 --> 51:22 [SPEAKER_00]: Wow, what an episode, and what a disaster of baseball game.
51:22 --> 51:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that has been zone, it can't possibly be this bad when we record on Thursday night.
51:30 --> 51:34 [SPEAKER_01]: You're right, because if KELNIC hits two homers, then it's a positive episode for me.
51:34 --> 51:37 [SPEAKER_01]: Then we're going to laugh and do a mailback.
51:38 --> 51:38 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we will.
51:39 --> 51:40 [SPEAKER_01]: My God.
51:40 --> 51:49 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, emotionally, that's probably about as emotional as we've been during a regular season podcast, certainly during a middle of May regular season podcast.
51:49 --> 51:50 [SPEAKER_01]: I can promise you that.
51:51 --> 51:53 [SPEAKER_00]: Let's, let's finish the episode on this note.
51:54 --> 51:56 [SPEAKER_00]: The Mariners better not do another piggyback.
51:57 --> 51:58 [SPEAKER_00]: No, no more.
51:58 --> 51:59 [SPEAKER_00]: That's over.
52:00 --> 52:01 [SPEAKER_01]: That's like we're done.
52:02 --> 52:02 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
52:02 --> 52:07 [SPEAKER_01]: You cannot, you cannot run that out again, not after what we just watched.
52:07 --> 52:09 [SPEAKER_00]: not if you tell us you're trying to win a world series.
52:09 --> 52:11 [SPEAKER_00]: Nope, absolutely not.
52:12 --> 52:15 [SPEAKER_01]: All right, that's just about wraps up this edition of the Marine Lair pod cast.
52:15 --> 52:16 [SPEAKER_01]: You guys know the drill.
52:17 --> 52:21 [SPEAKER_01]: You want to listen to the full form pod cast you can do so wherever you get your audio pods.
52:21 --> 52:23 [SPEAKER_01]: Make sure to download these episodes if you're listening.
52:23 --> 52:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Go rate and review five stars.
52:24 --> 52:26 [SPEAKER_01]: That's all on the audio side.
52:26 --> 52:30 [SPEAKER_01]: And then on YouTube, go like, comment, and please hit that subscribe button on YouTube.
52:30 --> 52:32 [SPEAKER_01]: Hey, our head's got close to exploding.
52:32 --> 52:34 [SPEAKER_01]: I would hope that warms us subscribe.
52:34 --> 52:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Push from all you guys and a subscription from all you guys on YouTube because I'd like to think we brought the juice and brought the energy tonight So it all serious.
52:42 --> 52:52 [SPEAKER_01]: That's it really does help if you hit subscribe on YouTube So go do so you can go find us on our website marinelier pod.com episodes are all there patreon's there podcast merch is there Go get yourself some pod merch.
52:52 --> 52:55 [SPEAKER_01]: We love wearing it You can also find us across social media.
52:55 --> 53:00 [SPEAKER_01]: We're posting content every single day at marinelier pod That's TJ I'm Lyle as always.
53:00 --> 53:02 [SPEAKER_01]: We thank you guys for tuning in.
53:02 --> 53:03 [SPEAKER_01]: We'll talk to you soon