Episode 482: How Hard Will The Mariners Go After Seiya Suzuki? + Mailbag

00:00:00 Speaker 1: Welcome to episode number 482 of the Marine Lara podcast. It's a mailbag episode, so we'll open it up and answer your best listener questions. We'll also react to the latest news and information coming out of the MLB GM meetings. Just a quick reminder before we get going, make sure you go rate and review this podcast and please leave it five stars if you're listening. Go hit the subscribe button on YouTube if you're watching. All of that really, really helps the channel a ton. You can also find us at our website, which is marinelayerpod.com. All of our merch is there. Patreon's there. Episodes are there too. And then find us all across social media at marinelayerpod. 00:00:34 Speaker 2: Let's get it rolling. 00:00:49 Speaker 1: And we welcome you to this episode of the Marine Layer Podcast, part of the Just Baseball Podcast Network, recording here on Tuesday evening, November 10th. Lyle, I don't think I realized just how much action we were going to get once the GM meeting started. And we want to talk about some rumors. We want to talk about some rumors. I mean, they're swirling. 00:01:11 Speaker 2: I'm going to be honest. This is what I expected. Did you think it was just going to go silent all week? Because to me, with the lockout looming in three weeks, this is almost a placeholder for the winter meetings. This is where a lot of the rumors are coming out. 00:01:25 Speaker 1: Not as much happens at the GM meetings usually. Conversations start at the GM meetings, but usually no one has any incentive to do anything. And we knew it was going to get packed into the next three weeks. You look at the calendar, this is it. 00:01:41 Speaker 2: Now it's go time. 00:01:42 Speaker 1: So we're getting a whole lot of information. 00:01:44 Speaker 2: Again, I think it's a winter meetings placeholder. Normally, you're right that since everybody's in person, people would talk and people would put some floaters out there and then maybe some trades start to formulate over the next couple of weeks, a free agent signing here or there on the smaller to mid-tier end of things. But the winter meetings are usually when you see a lot of moves start to really pick up and get going. This year, again, this is really the only time everybody's going to be in person for before the lockout starts so yeah i'm not shocked things are getting moving here. 00:02:16 Speaker 1: Let's dive into some of these rumors because we have a bunch of different mariners notes to talk about and we have a full mailbag oh by the way if we want more insight you want more insight on stuff going on at the gm meetings ryan divvish on friday so he will he will have plenty uh for us to talk about let's start off with the mariners deciding lyle part of the seattle times that they are not Going to bring back JP Crawford in 2027. That news and that decision made very early. No ifs, ands, or buts. No maybe we'll sign him closer to spring training if nothing works out. It's like a flat no. 00:02:54 Speaker 2: I'm not that surprised, to be honest. Let's put it like this. I guess you usually don't see hard core, like cold hard facts like that. dropped on everybody's head this early in the offseason about, oh, this guy won't be back. But again, everything's on an expedited timeline with the lockout. And I don't think we ever believe the Mariners were really going to bring JP Crawford back to begin with. So this is essentially the Mariners just putting it out there for people. Okay, we're giving you guys the notice. We are going to look elsewhere in 2027. And again, I think we believe that from the start. 00:03:32 Speaker 1: And it lines up with everything Jerry said. Just got to listen to the end of season press conference about what Jerry lays out their needs are when he says we need to acquire somebody else that is not in the org to play shortstop next year. That doesn't sound like JP Crawford, like the team bench JP Crawford off of shortstop in 2026 for Colt Emerson. And while Colt Emerson is going to have surgery this off season and won't swing a bat until whenever spring training is, uh, Yeah, the math maths that J.P. Crawford will not be an option for the Mariners in 2026. And it's hard for a lot of people. Like they see the news and it hits home because J.P. Crawford is the longest tenure Mariner. But the facts are the facts that J.P. Crawford has been unable to stay healthy and unable to play clean, consistent defense while unable to consistently hit at the plate as well. Like there are definitely bright, more bright spots at the plate than elsewhere. But as a pure baseball player, Talking about what the Mariners need to get better at in 2027, I don't know how you would line that up with bringing J.P. Crawford back in any sort of actual role on this team. 00:04:42 Speaker 2: It doesn't make any logical baseball sense. I understand this is a hard day for some people because there's a lot of people out there who would tell you J.P. Crawford is their favorite Mariner. There's a lot of people with J.P. Crawford jerseys. There's a lot of people J.P. Crawford, in terms of fans, has interacted with, and fans walk away saying to themselves, man, that was an awesome interaction. JP does a lot with the fans. So it's hard for people to move on from somebody that's been in the org for the last eight years, been in the big leagues for the last eight years, and has been right at the center of everybody's eye because he's the shortstop. He gets just about the most action of anybody in the field. Again, he's been around forever. But you just highlighted it. From a baseball standpoint, I just don't see the upside here. The Mariners are already too left-handed heavy to begin with. JP Crawford's another left-handed bat. He's not awful against lefties. He's not like he's Luke Raley against lefties, but he's not great against lefties. He also essentially had to be moved off a shortstop because he just couldn't do it anymore. He didn't look all that great playing third base. He doesn't move all that well. He doesn't run the bases all that well. Paired with the fact that he's going to be 32 years old this upcoming season, I just don't really see the fit here. I think I have that right, 32, right? Yeah, he's going to be entering his age 32 season. I think the Mariners just have to reshuffle some things in terms of their position players that doesn't involve JP Crawford. And that's okay. I think people can acknowledge both. The JP did a lot of great things for this franchise while also acknowledging it's just time to move on. 00:06:15 Speaker 1: Yeah, like maybe he will come back at some point and the Mariners will put him in their Hall of Fame as their longest tenured shortstop. 00:06:23 Speaker 2: It's possible. 00:06:25 Speaker 1: But in terms of baseball, it doesn't feel like JP Crawford will suit up as a Mariner again. Well, at least under this front office. Right. 00:06:33 Speaker 2: And again, I think it's okay to acknowledge that because the honest truth here, you guys, I know most of you know this, but for anybody that needs to hear it, nostalgia does not win you championships. No, it doesn't. Nostalgia does not win you championships. I would think people have learned that by now after the last manager that was in place the last two years. Nostalgia sure as hell does not win you championships. So I think it's okay to acknowledge all the great things JP did while he was here. but also understand the Mariners can upgrade from JP Crawford. 00:07:04 Speaker 1: And I've seen a lot of comments about the Mariners not being loyal enough to JP Crawford in our comments. 00:07:09 Speaker 2: And I would argue that the Mariners. 00:07:10 Speaker 1: Have been the most loyal to JP Crawford. They gave him an extension. He's been their longest tenured player. I don't know what else you could. 00:07:18 Speaker 2: Ask for, for loyalty. Yeah. Go ahead. Go ahead. Go ahead. 00:07:24 Speaker 1: I was going to say like, Did anyone actually, I'm honest question to the listeners. Did anyone honestly expect JP Crawford to be a Mariner for 20 years? Because I feel like that's what people are kind of, some people are kind of asking for in our comment section about like quote unquote loyalty. I'm dead serious. I want you, if you've thought that, I want you to reflect that. And the answer should probably be no. I feel like most teams don't want players to be on their team for 20 seasons. 00:07:55 Speaker 2: Responses like that and comments like that remind me of Richard Sherman. And what I mean by that, when I say it reminds me of Richard Sherman, is I love Sherman. All of Seattle loves Sherman for every good reason. But you remember he had that stretch of time on his podcast where he was just ripping the Seahawks every time they didn't bring back some 30-plus-year-old player from the 2013-14 team? and how it was a disgrace to the organization, essentially. And you and I would look at each other when we'd see these things, and we're like, what is he talking about? Like, for example, I'll just use one player as an example. He ripped the Seahawks really hard, obviously when they didn't bring him back after 2017. But if you want the example of somebody else, he ripped them when they didn't bring Bobby back, when he signed with the Rams for a year. And then he ripped them again when Bobby came back to Seattle, played one year, and then signed with the Commanders, which was his last year, because... Despite Bobby Wagner having the case to be the greatest Seahawk to ever play, just in terms of the accolades, he didn't really have it anymore. You saw it in that final year where he came back in Seattle. He was just slow. He couldn't really cover. He didn't move side to side like he used to. But Sherman's out here ripping the Seahawks for letting Bobby Wagner walk to the commanders. And it's like, well, do you want to win, or are you just trying to hold on to nostalgia? That is the case with J.P. Crawford. I think there's... I think Richard Sherman... saying all those things on his podcast about how the Seahawks are disrespecting franchise legends. That's what's popping into my head when I see Mariners fans saying that, oh, well, you can't just let JP Crawford walk. No, you can acknowledge all the great things he did while understanding that the team can get better without him. 00:09:38 Speaker 1: And also you have an organization that has, that has told the public through reporting again from the Seattle times that they don't, they're not willing to go above and beyond and spend this off season. And when you operate like that as an organization, you just have to get comfortable with the fact that you're going to churn because you can't just have contracts burning a hole on your bench and in your pocket to keep going forward. 00:10:01 Speaker 2: You have to be aggressive to utilize your roster. 00:10:04 Speaker 1: It's unfortunate that JP Crawford is gone now, but in terms of baseball playing on the field, the Mariners made the right decision going forward and hopefully it will improve their infield for 2027. 00:10:15 Speaker 2: So. Let's hope so. Do you remember all that Sherm stuff? I guess I didn't let you respond to that. He just wouldn't stop, remember? 00:10:23 Speaker 1: Yes, I mean, he still does. He will still throw shade at them for that. 00:10:28 Speaker 2: Even though, like, they let him, you know, he's around the building now. He's at training camp. You know, there was the video of him on the sidelines going crazy when the Seahawks beat the Rams in Thursday night football last year. It's almost like he kind of has his moment. What's up? Sherm's a bit of a frontrunner. He, again, I think he does have real love for the Seahawks still. And you see it come out at times. But then again, there's points where he wants to just tear the organization a new one. But he's kind of toxic. Yeah. I mean, at points he can be. Yeah. That's just like a bit of an eye roll, right? Right. And that's kind of what I'm getting at. So, for example, just to get the exact age right. Bobby Wagner signed with the Commanders and left the Seahawks at 34 years old. Again, Bobby is maybe the best Seahawk to ever put on the jersey. But I think it was clear by the end of that time he just didn't have the same burst in athleticism that he had in his prime. And it's okay to understand that Bobby's a legend in Seattle and always will be, but it was okay to move on. That's what those comments over the last few hours as we're sitting here dissecting the J.P. Crawford news is reminding me of. where I'm sitting there thinking to myself, again, acknowledge all the great things he did, because he was great here. He's one of the 10 best Mariners position players by war ever. But it's okay to say they can be better without him. 00:11:53 Speaker 1: I 100% agree. Let's get to our next rumor. And this might be the biggest one, is that the Mariners have noted they're interested in Seiya Suzuki. Lyle, what level of interest do you think the Mariners have in Seiya Suzuki? 00:12:12 Speaker 2: I'd say that's a two-part question, Teej. You got to break it down. What level of interest does the Mariners front office have in Seiya Suzuki? And what level of interest do John Stanton and Chris Larson have in Seiya Suzuki? 00:12:27 Speaker 1: I would say the Mariners front office has more interest in Seiya Suzuki, the baseball player, than the ownership group has in Seiya Suzuki's contract. Because we're not that many days removed from there also being reporting that the Mariners seemed pretty unwilling to go over $ 100 million for a contract this offseason. And that being used as a major reason they're not bringing Randy Rosarena back. But I think Seiya and Randy are going to get within $ 25 million of each other, you would think. 00:13:00 Speaker 2: Right? 00:13:00 Speaker 1: Sure. 00:13:01 Speaker 2: Sure. I think Seiya Suzuki probably gets $ 100 million in free agency. So what this all comes back to is this. I tweeted this earlier today, but let me reiterate it here. I think the Mariners' front office is legitimately interested in Seiya Suzuki. I think Jerry DiPoto and Justin Hollander know the value of having not just one of the best hitters in baseball over the last four years, because Seiya Suzuki has OPSed over 800 four straight seasons, for those who are interested in that statistic. That's a real stat. But also, Seiya Suzuki... replacing the production in left field, and also absolutely mashing left-handed pitching. Seah mashes left-handed pitchers. I think they understand what the value there is for him. But I also think that the... Or not I think, I know... The Mariners don't get in bidding wars. That's been reported. We've seen that put into action just with our own eyes. The Mariners do not go back and forth with free agents, and it's a total eye roll. It drives me nuts because you don't have to do it with every free agent, but there are free agents that it is absolutely worth getting in the bidding war for. The Mariners don't do it. They offer their number. If the player doesn't take it, they move on. And unfortunately, while I hope I'm proven wrong and I hope the Mariners just pay Seiya Suzuki and bring him here, I think the Mariners are going to offer a number. If Seiya Suzuki's camp wants more or his agent tries to leverage that deal with other teams, which is what all good agents do, the Mariners are going to say, yeah, we're out. And that's the end of it. 00:14:34 Speaker 1: That's 100% right. So we're going to see what the cap on the Mariners is. If Seiya Suzuki gets $ 115 million, I don't think Seiya Suzuki is going to be a Mariner. It sounds good right now. But this has the writing that he's going to end up with whoever pays him the most money because he's probably the most coveted bat on this free agent market. In some order, it's him one or Randy one and then the other one second. But say it played really good defense this last year. Whether teams believe he's going to continue to play good defense or they believe those defensive metrics, well, that's TBD and that's up to whatever team decides to sign him. But you know, it's going to be one of those two being the number one free agent. And those, those, uh, those guys are going to get targeted by the bigger market teams that might need them. 00:15:28 Speaker 2: Right. 00:15:28 Speaker 1: It's like, what are the Dodgers? What's it trade Tao and sign? Say a Suzuki to take his place because they think he's a better foot or the Phillies who had a very, very tough 2026 season sign him, him to inject life into their, into their team. Like those are two teams that the Mariners won't compete with budget-wise. 00:15:49 Speaker 2: You know where I think Seiya ends up? And it's another team that low-key the Mariners won't compete with budget-wise. If I were to take truth serum and I had to make my objective, bold prediction on Seiya Suzuki's landing spot, I think he's a Blue Jay. I do. No, they definitely don't compete with Toronto. 00:16:10 Speaker 1: No. 00:16:10 Speaker 2: Not at all. And it's almost kind of slept on, but the Blue Jays really spend, man. They do not shy away from shelling it out when they want certain players from outside the organization. One, Seiya Suzuki and Okamoto apparently are pretty good friends. The Blue Jays also need some additional offense. They could use another outfield bat. And they have missed out on a lot of free agents over the last few years that were going to cost them a lot more money than Seiya Suzuki. They were second in line for Shohei. They were right at the end of it for Kyle Tucker. They, I'm sure, are going to at least try to be in on Tarek Skubal. They probably won't sign him, but I think Seiya's going to end up being a Blue Jay. And if he's a Blue Jay, they're probably going to pay him real money. And if the Mariners are going to offer Seiya Suzuki four years for $ 90 million, but the 105 and then say as camp comes back to the mariners and says okay here's the highest offer right now will you do four for 110 and the mariners are gonna be the mariners are gonna be like well no and that's sadly the end of it and by the way if you're somebody listening to this hearing that and that pisses you off good like it should piss you off if the mariners deem a player is worth the addition to their team because he's a game changer then you pay him the money to be the game changer They've done this forever, and it really does drive me nuts. It drives most people nuts that if they deem a player is worth it, they still bow out at basically the earliest possible chance. As soon as things get slightly uncomfortable for them, money-wise. 00:17:40 Speaker 1: Because it's, do you want a balanced budget or do you want to win a World Series? That's always what it comes back to. You're going to have to take a step to win a World Series, and maybe it's an uncomfortable step. Trading a player away that you don't want to to acquire something you actually need, or spending more money than you would be comfortable with in free agency. The Mariners' current strategy at trying to win the World Series hasn't really worked. Maybe this is the scenario, Lyle, where Jerry DiPoto finally convinces ownership out of almost desperation for himself, knowing what he's up against this season, that he needs to go spend more money. And they do actually negotiate and are able to allocate more money to this one player. 00:18:26 Speaker 2: And what you mean by going up against it, in case anybody didn't pick up on that, is like we've talked about. Their jobs are likely on the line this year, this front office. They missed the playoffs. It's hard to imagine they're back in 2028. So yeah, maybe this is finally what gets ownership to say yes. Maybe they push a little harder. It's possible. It's possible. Yeah. I just want to say, as we start to wrap up the Say a Suzuki conversation, for anybody out there that might say, oh, he's not worth it. He's overrated. He's not going to live up to the contract. Look, you can't know if a free agent is going to live up to the contract. But if you're talking about overrated, I think you've got to look again. If anything, I think Seiya Suzuki is underrated. I think Seiya Suzuki is one of the most underrated hitters in Major League Baseball. I mentioned Seiya's OPS 800 four years in a row now. So since 2023, Seiya Suzuki has an 833 OPS. He is the 17th best hitter in Major League Baseball in that time. Like, he's a top 15 to 20 hitter in the whole sport. And there's a lot of guys that rank below Seiya that are superstars. I mean, Corbin has a lower OPS in that stretch than Seiya does. Corbin Carroll. Jose Ramirez has a lower OPS in that stretch than Seiya Suzuki. Vladdy has a lower OPS. Tatis has a lower OPS. Lindor has a lower OPS. Gunnar Henderson has a lower OPS. Seiya Suzuki. is really good, man. Just to put it in one final little piece of context, again, I'll say it again. Seiya Suzuki has OPSed 800 or above four straight seasons. Julio Rodriguez has gone three straight seasons in a row, OPSing under 800. Seiya is really, really good. 00:20:11 Speaker 1: Something I picked up on when I was reading this report by the Seattle Times, I did not see Ian Happ's name mentioned in there as well. 00:20:17 Speaker 2: Honestly, he's not the hitter. 00:20:20 Speaker 1: That Seiya Suzuki is, but he's still a very, very, very good player who plays the exact same position or would play the exact same position that you need and you're looking for and you'd want Seiya Suzuki to play. Maybe that changes if Seiya goes and signs somewhere else in the Mariners pivot. I did find that interesting. I'd keep an eye on that. Because we've highlighted these two as the options on the free agent market. We'll see if they agree that both of them are that guy or could be that guy this offseason. 00:20:52 Speaker 2: Maybe that's a Divish question for Friday too. Yeah, maybe. We'll ask him. I'm really excited to talk to Divish because there is a whole lot to flesh out. I think there's even some things we won't get to. I'm guessing we won't really talk about JP much with Divish because what is there really to talk about? I think there's going to be so much hot stove stuff that it's going to be a fun combo. Two more quick notes before we get to the mailbag. 00:21:14 Speaker 1: Number one, so Teruoki Sato, I hope I said his name right, is coming over from Japan this offseason, listed as a third baseman. It was reported, though, that the Mariners will be out on him. 00:21:31 Speaker 2: I shrug at that one a bit. I know there's been some clamoring for people that really like Sato and really want to see the Mariners go after Sato. But truthfully, if they're going to spend that kind of money, I'd just rather go spend it on Seiya Suzuki if I'm the Mariners. Sato could end up being really good. But again, he's another left-handed bat when the Mariners are already so left-handed heavy. So how he does against left-handed pitching in Major League Baseball is TBD. How he adjusts to big league pitching in general as TBD? Are the strikeouts going to be tenable? Is he going to, you know, is the plate approach going to be feasible in Major League Baseball? You'd hope, but you don't know. And most importantly, I just don't really think he can play third base. And for a Mariners team that has to be better defensively, I don't know if Sato makes them better defensively. 00:22:18 Speaker 1: No, it seems like the Mariners are not very high on his defense and the league is not very high on his defense at all. It seems like the league thinks that he can't play third base. And if he can't play third base, I don't know how it makes sense for the Mariners at all. The Mariners have a first baseman who they gave $ 100 million to last year who's also a left-handed hitter. 00:22:43 Speaker 2: I don't know how that works. 00:22:45 Speaker 1: Even if you want to sign a player in free agency, I don't know how this one works, in my opinion. So if you're, I wouldn't get too bent out of shape over them being out on Sato. 00:22:56 Speaker 2: No, I wouldn't either. And that's what Divish and Jude reported in their article, right? Is the league believes he can't really play third base. 00:23:03 Speaker 1: Right. Yeah. 00:23:03 Speaker 2: Yeah. Or, or I mean, he might be a first baseman. 00:23:06 Speaker 1: I don't know about outfield, but frankly, I watched enough bad outfield last year. 00:23:10 Speaker 2: I don't really want to see an experiment. Right. Again, and if you want to see the Mariners get better on defense, I'm not sure playing Sato in left field is the solution, because if Sato's playing left field constantly, that means Brendan Donovan's going to be playing a lot of third base, a position that at least in the 40 games he played, he did not prove to be a great defender at. So then for a team that relies so much on its pitching, could run into similar problems on pitching and defense that they just had a season ago. 00:23:38 Speaker 1: And then one last note that we will expand upon in a future podcast episode before the lockout starts. There is some idea floating out there about Gunnar Henderson. Just little nibbles, little crumbs about a potential idea of a big splash with the Orioles. I think there is some meat on that bone to talk about. 00:24:00 Speaker 2: Maybe next week. I'm guessing next week we'll have some time because we did the whole idea on Monday about trading two starters. But I think next week there could be some time to really talk through the idea of the Mariners making their biggest trade ever in the DePoto era because people know their jobs could be on the line. They know they have to win this year. They've never shelled out prospects for a trade like that. I mean, they did it for Castillo, but a trade for Gunnar Henderson would probably cost even more. So I think there's some names to talk about in an episode like that. There's Gunnar. There's James Wood. There's Ellie. There's a fascinating conversation there, but I think we'll have more time for that probably next week unless there's big moves that are made. 00:24:40 Speaker 1: Certainly. 00:24:41 Speaker 2: Okay, let's get to this mailbag. 00:24:42 Speaker 1: A reminder to you all, if you want to get in on these mailbag episodes, which we have every single week, the place to go is our Patreon. That's patreon.com slash marine layer pod, where you'll get access to add free episodes, mailbag priorities, so you get your questions answered every single week on these episodes, and the opportunity to get on a video call with Lau and I every single month. So if that sounds like something that's interesting to you, go to patreon.com slash marine layer pod. Let's start off with Jesse on Patreon. Jesse's question is, if the lockout lasts longer than we anticipate and the season doesn't start from mid until late May with a shortened season, does that give Jerry DiPoto a small sample size excuse to keep his job into the 2028 season if the Mariners miss the playoffs? 00:25:32 Speaker 2: I don't think so. Unless this is a COVID type of season where it's 60 games. I don't think that ends up playing a factor. If this is still a 120-game season and the Mariners don't make the playoffs, I think it's the same bucket as having a 162-game season. 00:25:51 Speaker 1: Yeah, let's lay out the scenario where Jerry does not make it through 2027 or gets let go after 2027. I would say, wow, it probably starts with an incomplete next three weeks, right? 00:26:05 Speaker 2: That's number one. 00:26:06 Speaker 1: I'd say number two would be the team misses the playoffs in, I'll say, like you said, 120 games. So he gets 120 games, a full spring training, and an offseason where they didn't get enough done. 00:26:18 Speaker 2: That I could see it. 00:26:20 Speaker 1: Yeah. If they only play 60 games, that would be like anything can happen in a 60-game season. Right. 00:26:29 Speaker 2: The Astros were still a good team that year. Everybody knew it. But in the regular season during the COVID year, they were under. 500 but got into the playoffs and then got to Game 7 of the ALCS. Because, again, the Astros just came off a World Series runner-up where they nearly won. I think everybody knew they were good. If 2020 had been 162 games, I'm sure the Astros with more time would have turned it around and won the AL West easily. But they didn't that year. So 60 games is a hard sample. you double that and you get 120 games or more. I don't think the shortened season plays a factor. And there's also a chance in a shortened season. 00:27:06 Speaker 1: They expand the playoff again because the networks want more games and they're like, all right, you guys got to try and make up some inventory to us that you left on the table when you were negotiating. 00:27:17 Speaker 2: Yeah. 00:27:18 Speaker 1: And then if Jerry DePoto makes the playoffs at 30 and 30 in. 00:27:22 Speaker 2: A 60 game season, like, what do you do? Yeah. I, but I also don't think we're going to have a lot of time to talk about this topic. I don't think they're playing 60 games. I think this gets solved earlier than people think. Maybe I can't promise no games are missed. I don't know, but I think there's still a world. There's no games missed. And I think there's a pretty realistic world where they don't miss that many games. 00:27:49 Speaker 1: Next question on Patreon comes from Thomas. Thomas's question is what's your favorite Jersey for the Mariners current and all time. Oh, all time, it's the powder blue spring training uniforms. 00:28:02 Speaker 2: I love them. I absolutely love them to death, and I'm still sad they don't have them anymore. They were my favorite jerseys. 00:28:09 Speaker 1: Just the most random selection of all time. 00:28:12 Speaker 2: It's an awesome color. Powder blue is an awesome color. It goes well with just about anything, I think. But right now, the Steelheads jerseys are pretty awesome. I'll say those. 00:28:24 Speaker 1: My current one is also the Steelheads. I think the teal uniforms are their best uniforms all time. 00:28:29 Speaker 2: Oh, there's some people in this region that feel very differently. I like the teal a lot, but there's a lot of people that, for whatever reason, don't. 00:28:39 Speaker 1: In the content space, you spend a lot of time looking at photos of Mariners, and I think players look best in the teal, where you have teal, you have the white, gray, and blue stitched lettering and numbers on the back, and then you have the red patch, which... I think the colors work together. The red patch does not work. It doesn't work with anything. I think red and green work. 00:29:07 Speaker 2: Not teal. Maybe standard green. I mean, it's greenish. I mean, don't you think in general those Nintendo patches look a little ridiculous? I mean, they're huge. But if you're going to put it on any, I think green. I guess, yeah. 00:29:24 Speaker 1: I think that works. I think people might like the older... Uh, jerseys like their original jerseys better, but I never watched them play in that. So I'm going to take one that I spent a lot of time watching them play in. 00:29:36 Speaker 2: Okay. All right. Yeah. I'll say steelheads and, and. powder blues for me how many people do you think choose gray i'm guessing not a lot gray's just not a gray's not an exciting color. 00:29:52 Speaker 1: But i see a lot of people complaining online about them not having gray jerseys anymore Yeah. 00:29:57 Speaker 2: But if they took away the teal, then people would complain that there's no teal anymore. And there's still people that complain that there's no Sunday cream uniforms anymore. And I get it. Those were great jerseys too. The Mariners, in general, just have a really good set of jerseys. But this is what happens online. People find things to complain about. If there was nothing to complain about, people would complain that there's nothing to complain about. 00:30:17 Speaker 1: I'd say those Sunday creams are up there for me too. 00:30:19 Speaker 2: Those ones are sweet. And they'll probably bring them back at some point. Yeah, probably. I hope so, at least. But Yeah, I'll go with those two jerseys for me. 00:30:31 Speaker 1: Ethan on Patreon asks, what about the Mariners going for a platoon bat? Likely someone who isn't always starting against lefties, but is a viable bench piece with speed, defense, and hits well against lefties. 00:30:44 Speaker 2: Ethan, I am so glad you asked this question. And we didn't even bring up his name while talking about JP Crawford, but he is perfect for this exact scenario. Right here, the perfect J.P. Crawford replacement of a bench bat who can move around and is a really good athlete and can run and can play good defense. You just described Edmundo Sosa, and I will keep banging the drum on him. Edmundo Sosa, the last three years, has hammered left-handed pitching. He is good defensively in multiple spots. He runs well, and he is a perfect bench player. Oh, and a right-handed hitter. 00:31:15 Speaker 1: So. 00:31:17 Speaker 2: For anybody out there that hears a question about platoon bats and says, well, I don't want any more platoon bats. I don't want any more refs. I don't want any more AJ Pollock's. I don't want any more Solano's. 00:31:26 Speaker 1: Yeah. 00:31:26 Speaker 2: TJ's raising his hand for those watching on YouTube. Cause that's one of his rules. And you know what? Absolutely agreed. They should not be signing any more players like that. But as we've talked about the difference with Edmundo Sosa is if for whatever reason, his ability to hit left-handed pitching just goes. And I don't think it will, but if it did, He has so many other tools that make him valuable off the bench that you're not only relying on that like you were with the other guys. 00:31:51 Speaker 1: If you're signing a part-time player this offseason, I cannot emphasize this enough. Hitting left-handed pitching as a platoon bat cannot and will not be one of your qualifications for getting a contract. I swear to God, it cannot. I can't hear that description anymore. Like what you described with Edmundo Sosa, he's going to be and play defense. 00:32:13 Speaker 2: Great. 00:32:14 Speaker 1: That's all I need to hear. I don't care how he hits against lefties. 00:32:18 Speaker 2: I don't. Well, I do because the Mariners are still... No, no, no, no, no, no. Breaks the rules? Breaks the rules? No, no, no, no. Breaks the rules? You cannot be only a platoon bat. You know Sosa is not in the same bucket as Ref Snyder and Solano and Pollock. He's different. Because the Mariners are still one of the worst teams in Major League Baseball against left-handed pitching. What are you going to do? Just ignore the fact you're awful against lefties? You have to address it, but you can't be addressing it with the Rob Ref Snyders of the world. 00:32:45 Speaker 1: If you're going to address it, you need to sign full-time players, like say a Suzuki Well, yeah. 00:32:50 Speaker 2: Yes. 00:32:51 Speaker 1: Agree. Or lefties who can hit lefties and it's not as much of a problem. That's how you tackle this issue. Tackling, like signing marginal players to try and solve your issues against left-handed pitching doesn't work, has not worked. So that's why, again, it cannot ever be used as a justification to sign one of these players. The reason you want to sign Edmundo Sosa is because he's a great bench player. Great bench player that the Mariners need after having an atrocious bench. Not because he hits lefties. Well, he also happens to be very, very good against lefties. But again, he has other skills. I want somebody that has the ability to hit lefties. I just don't want that to be their only skill. I think that's what we fleshed out when you made your rules a couple months ago. Again, you cannot ignore the fact this team is awful against lefties. But you have to have other skills. 00:33:44 Speaker 2: And Mundo Sosa, since the start of 2024, has an 862 OPS against left-handed pitching. He hammers lefties. but that is not his only redeeming quality, and that is the key here. He is fast. He plays good defense. He can play third, short, outfield, and you know late in games if he's not starting, you can either put him in late as a defensive replacement or as a pinch runner or maybe both. 00:34:09 Speaker 1: Correct. 00:34:09 Speaker 2: Let's put it like this. Edmundo Sosa can enhance their ability to hit lefties, not fix it. The Mariners had this idea in their head that I think Ref Snyder would fix, quote, like straight up fix a lot of their problems against lefties while also saying, well, Cal hit lefties again and Julio hit lefties again. And we'll find some other guys in the lineup that are adequate against lefties like JP or Naylor and that'll fix it. Well, no, Rob Ref Snyder was one of the worst players in the league. So I think that's a fair way to state it, right? Edmundo Sosa could enhance their ability to hit lefties, but he's not going to fix it. 00:35:10 Speaker 1: He's not going to hit leadoff. He's not going to hit second. He's not going to hit cleanup. Like his spot in the lineup should not change based on who's on the mound. 00:35:18 Speaker 2: Edmundo Sosa, if he's in the lineup, will be hitting anywhere from seventh to ninth on a regular basis. As he should. And it should stay that way. Yes. 00:35:26 Speaker 1: Yeah. 00:35:28 Speaker 2: To give people the perspective, I hate to even say the name because he's been awesome to us and we did some bullpen banner content with him this year and he's awesome. But just from a baseball perspective, let's just give people the example that we're talking about because I know it's in your head. The Mariners can't sign Randall Gritchick this offseason. 00:35:45 Speaker 1: No. 00:35:47 Speaker 2: That's how you break TJ's rule. Because Randall Gritchick is in that ref Snyder Solano Pollock bucket where he has hit lefties really well the last handful of years and he's been successful with it. But he is very, very much on the older side toward the end of his career. And if his ability to hit lefties goes, you are right back in the same spot that you were with all those other guys. That's what they have to avoid. Randall Gritchick, God forbid, Taylor Ward again. 00:36:16 Speaker 1: Yeah. 00:36:18 Speaker 2: No, no. Not allowed. 00:36:20 Speaker 1: No. 00:36:21 Speaker 2: Not allowed at all. Because, again, Taylor Ward is more of a regular player at this point in his career in terms of an everyday guy than somebody like Grichik. You would think? Again, historically. Not with the Mariners, but historically he's been more of an everyday guy. The man hit 36 homers in 2025. But it's the same idea. He might be an everyday player for most teams up until he got traded to Seattle. but he doesn't have other skills if he stops hitting. He doesn't field well. He doesn't run well. Like, what do you get? You get nothing. So, yeah. Like, Ward and Gritchick cannot, unfortunately, be Mariners. I hope Gritchick still gets a chance somewhere else and gets his money and has a good season. And it's not all, like, by a lot of ways, not a fault of Gritchick's. The Mariners can't sign him because they've had too many problems with guys like him who they've attempted with and miserably failed. Exactly, Lyle. Well said. 00:37:20 Speaker 1: Next question comes from Xander on Patreon. Xander's question is, let's talk about Richie Palacios from the Rays. Would the Rays move Palacios for a package headlined by Fellmean, Celestin, and maybe Corbin Dickerson? Just to jump ahead of you, Lyle, and answer this. Yes, the Rays would absolutely do that trade, Xander. But I want no part of this at all. 00:37:44 Speaker 2: I'm just not really sure what warrants trading Felny and Celestin for Richie Palacios. I think he means, did you say Corbin Dickerson? I think that's who he means. I think Corbin Dickerson. Yes. Yeah. 00:37:55 Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. 00:37:56 Speaker 2: That's what, that's what I thought. Yeah. Richie Palacios had some flashes in the post season where he really showed up, but he's not some electrifying career player. I mean, he wasn't even a league average hitter last year. I would love Richie Palacios as a bench player, but he's not like, he's certainly not an everyday guy that you would trade for. And he's definitely not somebody you trade Felny and Celestin for. 00:38:26 Speaker 1: I'm wondering Xander, if you want to leave us a comment either on Patreon or on YouTube about your reasoning for wanting Richie Palacios. Cause I, Like, here's the lowdown. He's been roughly a league average hitter for his career. He is every single year graded out as a below average defender, if not a bad defender. He plays second base and outfield. He hits left-handed, and he's 5'8. Why? 00:38:58 Speaker 2: In this past year, somewhat of a small sample, but he just OPSed 478 against left-handed pitching. 00:39:06 Speaker 1: That sounds like the type of player the Mariners would be wanting to get off of their roster, not add on to. 00:39:12 Speaker 2: Yeah. And I like Richie. We did a little bit of content with him at World Series Media Day. He's a really fun personality. And he did some nice things for the Rays this year. But I don't think it's really a fit here in Seattle. No, I don't think so either. 00:39:27 Speaker 1: Next question comes from Cameron on Patreon. 00:39:29 Speaker 2: Cameron's question. 00:39:30 Speaker 1: is, what's your guys' prediction for who will be in the Mariners starting rotation opening day 2027? 00:39:38 Speaker 2: I think the easiest way to predict this is more who's out. And I'll say Kirby's out because I think he gets traded. So Could that involve the Mariners replacing him by signing somebody like Freddie Peralta or Michael King or Sonny Gray like we talked about on Monday? Maybe. But if we're going to hold off on that until it actually happens, but assume they're going to trade one starter, I'm going to guess Kirby's out and then the rotation is Logan, Wu, Emerson, Kate Anderson, and Bryce Miller with Ryan Sloan waiting in the wings. 00:40:13 Speaker 1: I would be shocked if the rotation order on opening day is not Logan Gilbert, Brian Wu, Bryce Miller, Kate Anderson, and Emerson Hancock. 00:40:22 Speaker 2: In that order. 00:40:25 Speaker 1: Yeah. 00:40:25 Speaker 2: Unless they get really crazy like we talked about on Monday and really go trade two starters and sign another. 00:40:31 Speaker 1: They could, but most likely I think it's going to be those five on opening day with Ryan Sloan and Logan Evans in the rotation at some point due to either injury or promotion. 00:40:43 Speaker 2: Agreed. Yeah, for sure. 00:40:46 Speaker 1: Next question comes from Alex on Patreon. Alex's question is, noting that Buster Only's tweet about Seattle hiring elite instructors got him thinking. With so much of the team's future tied to Julio and Cal, I wonder if getting the most out of those two was an added consideration when hiring Jason Kanzler and Tanner Swanson. Noting that Kanzler works with outfielders and hitting and that Swanson works with catchers. 00:41:15 Speaker 2: I don't think you can hire a manager or coaches for the benefit of one singular player. I just don't think that's how organizations think. But how are the Mariners going to be at their best if their stars play like stars? The Mariners can't be the best versions of themselves without Cal and Julio playing to the best of their potential. So was a part of their thought process, likely, hey, can these guys really get through to Cal and Julio? Can they help them? I'm sure it was a part of it. I don't think it was the end-all, be-all reasoning, but I'm sure it was in their minds. 00:41:50 Speaker 1: It's an added benefit. 00:41:52 Speaker 2: I don't know if it was the priority. 00:41:55 Speaker 1: When Buster's noting that they're looking for instructors, I think they're looking at raising... the entire roster, not just Cal and Julio, because I think there's more to gain from other players on the roster than Julio and Cal, who we've already seen really great stuff. If not Cal, we've already seen his ceiling as a baseball player by hitting 60 home runs and being a platinum glove defensive catcher. Like he's already got both of those things. So if we take Cal off the board, I think there's more for Julio to do, but I would rather them spend more time on some of the young guys in this system. who can be the real difference makers in you making a push to the World Series, as much as the Mariners need to add on the outside of their organization to help get them there, these teams don't make the fall classic by having bad development of their homegrown players. They get the most out of those guys usually. 00:42:52 Speaker 2: I mean, it's crazy to think about, you guys, but there was a point once upon a time where we thought to ourselves when Colt Emerson gets called up, Could he just go play like Kevin McGonigal? It was certainly in my head. The way McGonigal just played this year, he was nearly a six-war player. There was a thought at one point of, could Colt Emerson just do something like that in his rookie year? He didn't, but he has every bit of talent to do it. What if he did that next year? Think about the unbelievable leaps and bounds him playing like that would give this team. Or I'll use an example on the pitching end of it, too. What if Ryan Sloan comes out next year and pitches like Parker Messick? Same idea, right? And Sloan's a much more higher regarded prospect than Messick was. What if he comes out and does that as a rookie? Or if Cade does it as a rookie next year? Where Parker Messick, again, was a rookie of the year finalist and one of the 10 most valuable pitchers in all of baseball this year. What if that happens? These young touted prospects getting developed early and well is so important. Exactly. 00:43:57 Speaker 1: I could not agree more. And what if you get more out of Alaz or Arroyo too? Like that would be a big help. People are asking us when we put together that proposal for Monday's episode where those two guys were, we did not include them in that. But if they develop and they get significantly better and they become big contributors, then they are part of that discussion next year. 00:44:18 Speaker 2: And it's a problem. 00:44:18 Speaker 1: And it's a good problem to have that the Mariners have too many good players for the roster. And the roster is all of a sudden very deep and very talented and can do a whole lot of things together. And that's what you should want. It's not, I think not just focused on the two star players. 00:44:33 Speaker 2: It's nice to have though. Absolutely. 00:44:40 Speaker 1: Emma is next up on Patreon. She asks, who's someone you guys have not talked about that you want to trade for? 00:44:48 Speaker 2: There's so many guys. Kyle Tucker. 00:44:51 Speaker 1: Have we not talked about him? 00:44:53 Speaker 2: No, I don't have. We maybe once or twice. Just not this offseason. Well, not yet. No, not yet. 00:45:02 Speaker 1: No. 00:45:03 Speaker 2: Offseason's only two or three weeks old. Who have we talked about, okay, in all seriousness, who have we not talked about that I would want to trade for? There's so many names. You know what? I'll give a shout out to friend of the pod, Jason Churchill, who we were just... messaging a bunch with back and forth yesterday. Cause he floated out an idea on his show and online that truthfully, I didn't even really thought of, but it's a pretty interesting idea. He said, what if the Mariners went and tried to trade for Zach Geloff from the A's? I really liked that idea. And he's not a household name. Maybe not. Everybody is 100th percentile familiar with Zach Geloff. He's a really good player, man. Zach Geloff can play third, fourth, He could be your primary third baseman if you needed him to be. He can also play second. He can also play outfield. He's a right-handed bat. He just hit 22 homers this past year. He was just a 116 OPS plus hitter. So he was 16% above league average. He was a three and a half four player who just OPSed 885 against left-handed pitching. He's a good player. That's somebody a little more under the radar that would be tougher to trade for because he's in division, but I'd be interested. 00:46:18 Speaker 1: Above average offensive and defensive player and playing as many positions as you just listed. 00:46:22 Speaker 2: Yeah. 00:46:23 Speaker 1: He's about to hit ARB and he does not have an extension. 00:46:25 Speaker 2: And we know how the A's. 00:46:26 Speaker 1: Treat players like that. They're usually expendable. But we also know that the A's have made it very difficult for you to trade for their players. 00:46:34 Speaker 2: But if they want to listen, I'm open. 00:46:36 Speaker 1: They just got a new GM. So maybe the new GM is more open to that kind of idea. 00:46:40 Speaker 2: And they really need starting pitching. So to be clear, it would probably cost the Mariners... potentially Emerson Hancock, or maybe Bryce Miller, if the A's like Bryce Miller. It would probably cost you one of those guys, but the Mariners would have to decide if it's worth it to trade one of those guys for Zach Gelof. But again, Gelof is a really, really good player. Again, he just put up a three and a half win season. 00:47:01 Speaker 1: This is a guy I think we've mentioned maybe once, so I'm going to count it as if we haven't talked about him a ton. 00:47:07 Speaker 2: Trevor McGill. 00:47:09 Speaker 1: Oh, yeah. 00:47:10 Speaker 2: Yes. 00:47:12 Speaker 1: Another example of teams... capitalizing on value before someone hits free agency. This does not add that much to your payroll and would make a massive difference in your bullpen. If you had a full healthy season from each Trevor McGill and Andres Munoz. 00:47:29 Speaker 2: Makes a big difference. Very much. Yeah. I still have a hard time believing the Brewers will actually do it, considering he was just the anchor in that bullpen that won him the World Series. But the Brewers do do this a little bit. They are a little bit like the Rays, where when guys get close to free agency, they try to capitalize on value. So it's not impossible. 00:47:49 Speaker 1: Yeah, definitely not. Next question comes from Pucci Delgado on Patreon. His question is, it's opening day 2020-30. Given all the players and prospects currently in the system, Which two or three are the faces of the franchise? 00:48:06 Speaker 2: Let's see. I think Ryan Sloan's going to be the face of the pitching staff. I really do. There's people that are saying Ryan Sloan's the best pitching prospect the Mariners have had since Felix Hernandez. Incredible people who do prospect evaluation. I mean, I think he's got a chance to legitimately be an ace. You can't guarantee anything, but... When I say ace, there's not many aces in Major League Baseball. There's number ones in a rotation, and then there's aces. Ryan Sloan, I think, has a chance at some point to be an ace. So I will say Sloan's one of the faces, and I will say I still feel like by 2030, at least one of Cal or Julio is still a face of the franchise. 00:48:49 Speaker 1: I think if everything goes right, it's going to be Julio and Ryan Sloan. If you're going to drop a dream plan for the Mariners, it's going to be those two. Because I would assume they both have long-term contracts at that point. Julio already has his. The Mariners would probably want Ryan Sloan to have one by then. But they would also be peaking as players at that point. Julio would be nearing the position player prime of, what, he'd be 29 in 2030. And then Ryan Sloan would probably be... be entering his peak years where he's really figured it out at the big league level. And he starts to really dominate and put up the kind of volume that you want. And then hopefully it also coincides with the Mariners winning as well. 00:49:33 Speaker 2: The only thing is, as we talked about a couple weeks ago, is Julio still here in 2030? That's why I said if everything goes right. True. Yeah, if Julio comes out in 2027 and 2028 and he plays like an MVP candidate, then yes, of course. If he doesn't and it's more like 2026, again, it's a conversation we're probably going to continue to hash out as time goes on. But there are some real conversations to be had about the Mariners picking up that eight-year, $ 240 million player option in a couple years. And in two years, they're going to have to decide. 00:50:08 Speaker 1: It is still more likely than not he will be here in 2030. 00:50:12 Speaker 2: Probably. I will treat the question as such. Fair. 00:50:17 Speaker 1: Last question comes from John on Patreon. John's question is, honest question, do you think it's right to put so much pressure on a first-time manager? 00:50:28 Speaker 2: No, but by no fault of Jason Kanzler's, this is the situation he's walking himself into because the front office has put him in this position. It's not his fault, but And it's not fair to some extent, but he has to succeed as a first time manager. 00:50:45 Speaker 1: It is not fair, but if Jason Kanzler thought it was that unfair, he wouldn't have taken the job. 00:50:51 Speaker 2: So that's just part of the job. 00:50:53 Speaker 1: Like you got to win at some point, every manager at some point either has to win or they get fired. Jason Kanzler situation happens to be in year one. And Oh, by the way, he's probably making at least a million dollars. 00:51:05 Speaker 2: So yeah, like, Win. Okay. Yeah. 00:51:12 Speaker 1: Go win. I would also do an unfair job for a million dollars. 00:51:16 Speaker 2: Oh, yeah? 00:51:17 Speaker 1: Anyone out there in our audience who has a job like that available, I will listen. 00:51:21 Speaker 2: Well, you can't put things out like that. You can't put things like that out there. Then this podcast dies. 00:51:27 Speaker 1: Well, I just need to assess everything that's in front of me. Maybe they'll have a job for you to also make a million dollars. 00:51:33 Speaker 2: Well, great, but then the podcast still dies. All these people that you know, want to dunk on our takes every week, don't get to do that anymore. 00:51:40 Speaker 1: Look, I said I would be all ears. I never said I would take the job. Like Jason Kinsler, you need to evaluate every option you have in front of you. I think it's a good problem to have if people now are walking up to you and offering you a million dollars. 00:51:53 Speaker 2: I see. I see where you're going with this. Okay. I mean, yes, most people would take a job for a million bucks a year. Yeah. Would you? Consider it. The right one. I wouldn't take a million dollars a year doing some job. I hate it every single year. 00:52:10 Speaker 1: Would you manage the Seattle Mariners for a million dollars? 00:52:12 Speaker 2: Oh yeah. Yeah. Okay. There you go. 00:52:15 Speaker 1: Problem solved. 00:52:16 Speaker 2: Great. Awesome. I'll probably just delete social media for that year, but I do it. That's, that's honestly smart. Yeah. If I was a coach, no way. Yeah. Or we just keep this podcast going while we're managing the team. 00:52:30 Speaker 1: And we just, and we just air out daily mailbag episodes. 00:52:34 Speaker 2: I mean, we just air out every problem we have on our own podcast. It's like, this guy doesn't throw enough strikes, and this guy's striking out too much, and, you know, I could, like, whatever. Yeah. 00:52:46 Speaker 1: Why didn't you bunt the runner over in the seventh inning? Oh, God. 00:52:49 Speaker 2: We would definitely get questions like that. And I'd hop on here as the manager of the team and say, because elevate and celebrate, pal. Bunning is feeble. 00:53:03 Speaker 1: Yeah. 00:53:03 Speaker 2: Yeah. Yes, it is. I promise you I will not be bunning if I'm the Mariners manager. Oh, I know. I know. And I'm guessing you won't either. No, I will not. 00:53:14 Speaker 1: Yeah. All right. 00:53:15 Speaker 2: Well, that's a good mailbag episode. Thank you guys for the questions. You guys always send us really good questions every single week. And if you want priority on the questions, go sign up for our Patreon and you will have priority every time we do a mailbag. With that, that'll just about wrap up this edition of the Marine Layer podcast. You guys know the drill. You want to listen to the full-form podcast, you can do so wherever you get your audio pods. Go download these episodes if you're listening. Please go leave a five-star review when you rate and review this episode. It helps a ton. Hit subscribe on YouTube if you're watching the show. You can also find us at our website, which is marinelayerpod.com. You can find all of our episodes there. Our merch is all there. Patreon's there. Again, marinelayerpod.com. And then check us out all across social media. We're always posting content on all our platforms every day at marinelayerpod. That's TJ. I'm Lyle. As always, we thank you guys for tuning in. We'll talk to you soon. 00:54:48 Speaker 1: Thank you.