Episode 80: The Mariners Are Still Alive For Ohtani, Dissecting Tension Between The Ownership And Front Office, And A Case For Dominic Canzone in 2024

[00:00:00] Welcome to episode number 80 of the Marine Layer Podcast. We'll dive into the newest show, Hey Ohtani rumors surrounding the Mariners. Is there going to be an all out war in the Mariners organization between front office and ownership? And which Mariners position are you okay leaving

[00:00:15] as is? We'll also take a look around baseball with our MLB wrap around and close out the show with Speak Your Mind. Here's your reminder before we start the show that if you're listening to our podcast, make sure to follow, download and leave us a five star review

[00:00:29] wherever you get your audio podcasts. Those reviews, the downloads, they do help us out a ton. So take a few extra seconds to do that. Watch on YouTube where the full video podcast is, like, comment, subscribe over there and follow us on social media. We're on Instagram,

[00:00:43] TikTok, Twitter, YouTube shorts at Marine Layer Pod. Let's get it rolling. And we welcome you to this episode of the Marine Layer Podcast, part of the Just Baseball Podcast Network recording here on Thursday, December 7th in the evening.

[00:01:11] And we're going to kick off this episode by going straight to our most trusted source for baseball information. We're going to go to MLB Reddit. All right, Lyle, take it away. MLB Reddit's got Shohei as an M as a Mariner. He's coming. Didn't you read the news?

[00:01:29] As they say in New York, start spreading the news, except you're going to do it here in Seattle for Shohei. Haven't I always said I loved Reddit for two people that went to journalism school and actually have their degrees from the Walter Cronkite School of Journalism at

[00:01:42] Arizona State? Weren't we taught and haven't we always learned the number one trusted source is Reddit, especially when it pertains to things that go your way? Wow, you said a better than I ever could have, Lyle. The context behind that,

[00:01:59] go check out our social channels if you want Lyle's instant reaction to this piece. I think I got the first reaction from it when you saw it found this last night and you text me,

[00:02:07] you're like, oh my God. Oh my God, I can't sleep now. I'm like, oh boy. According to Reddit, there was on MLB Reddit a post here says there was a report out of Japan by a veteran sports columnist.

[00:02:24] Let's see if I can pronounce his name correctly. I think Sochi Hayashi Sr., I think I got that right and posted it on Yahoo Japan saying that a lucrative one-year deal is to believe to be estimated to be $65 million for the designated hitter services for 2024 is on the

[00:02:43] table from the Seattle Mariners. $65 million for one season on the table to Shohei Otani. And that's with all of the mystery team rumors floating out there that there's one unnamed team out there in discussion and that the Mariners haven't had their name mentioned once

[00:03:01] in a leak. They haven't, and none of the front office people have bothered to mention it and Ryan Divish, Adam Jude, Daniel Kramer want to ask people about Shohei Otani. They refuse to talk

[00:03:11] about it. Like Lyle said, if they're out of the discussion, why wouldn't they just bring it up? They're already out of it. Why does it matter? Well, because potentially if we put our tinfoil hats on here, there is a one-year $65 million deal on the table for Shohei Otani.

[00:03:29] I'm going to put the odds of this being real at about 5%. Let's just start there and be clear. 5% that this is a real truthful report that has, that is realistic in this case. However, if this were actually how the Mariners were going to go around offering Shohei Otani,

[00:03:52] I think this would be a smart way to go. That was like music to my ears listening to you read that. The Mariners, Shohei Otani all connected. I couldn't stop smiling over here just like last

[00:04:03] night when I texted it to you at like 12 30 and then subsequently went to bed at, I don't know, 2am because I couldn't fall asleep after thinking about it all. But yes, you're probably

[00:04:14] right. How much truth is there to this? We don't know. It could be 100%. It could be negative 100%. TJ's probably right that it's probably about a 5% chance that this is actually real and that the

[00:04:26] Mariners are actually thinking about this, but you got it. Do the Mariners want to separate themselves? Here's a great idea. They say, Hey, Shohei, this is the year you're not going to pitch. We will still pay you not just like you're a two-way player, but a higher AAV

[00:04:42] for one year than any other team would even touch in 2024 because we still believe in you. We will pay you that money just to DH this year. What could that result in? Well,

[00:04:54] it could result in the Mariners fall short of expectations even with Shohei and then he goes somewhere else after the one year. Shohei Otani as we've seen this winter doesn't seem to love the spotlight. As we've seen his whole career, he doesn't seem to love the

[00:05:08] spotlight. He doesn't like being the center of attention. He's not some Scott Boros Klein who's happy to travel around having everything get reported out left and right. He doesn't want any of it talked about. Are we sure he would want to go through something like this again?

[00:05:22] I say that because I mean, I sound contradictory because you're saying, Oh, you're saying, Oh, would he go through something like this again, but he's signing a one year deal. What I'm getting out with the Mariners is if he signed that one year deal,

[00:05:33] he liked it here in Seattle. They won with him. They made some type of playoff run. It doesn't feel like a Juan Soto thing where it'd be like, yep, I'm going to go to free agency again,

[00:05:42] probably not going back to the team I was originally with. And I'm going to do a whole free agency campaign again. Now if Shohei liked it here for the one year, it feels like there's

[00:05:51] a chance the Mariners might keep them and he would be more than happy to stay and he'd sign for longer. So maybe this is how the Mariners do it. As I said to you before we start this

[00:06:00] recording, TJ ownership screw and Jerry DePoto. You've got players screw and Jerry DePoto Kyle Seager never stopped trashing his name through all the years. All this lack that he has caught over the last few weeks, last few months, whatever you want to call it.

[00:06:15] But he's having his Adam Sandler moment here and uncut gems. And he says, this is how I win. You're waiting for that. I was waiting for that. You said how it makes sense on Shohei's side. And that does make sense.

[00:06:30] Let's make sense from the Mariners side. Let's say the Mariners actually do have budget problems. Let's say that the RSN bubble, which has already burst, gets worse and the market significantly tanks and the value of the Mariners share of root sports tanks through the ground

[00:06:47] and the revenue tanks along with it. Okay. So that paints a pretty dark revenue picture for the future for the Mariners television deal, especially with them being locked into deals with the Blazers and the Kraken in the future. So we take a look at future year budgets.

[00:07:05] So you know, those teams are going to be holding their broadcasting rights through, I think the Blazers have one more season, the Kraken have two more seasons, if I know that correctly. But the revenue is uncertain beyond that. And when I say beyond that, I'm talking

[00:07:22] about 2025, 2026, 2027, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera going on. Okay. We don't know what our future budget is because cable is dying and we have tied a big chunk of our finances to cable. However, we do with a decent amount of certainty know what our budget is for 2024.

[00:07:41] And we would be, we would feel comfortable with one abnormal amount for one season. Because we know we have a good guess of what our revenue is next season, not beyond that,

[00:07:53] but next season, yes. So we're okay upping the average annual value of a contract for more in one season for Shohei Otani rather than a lower AAV over more seasons in which we don't know what

[00:08:08] our future finances are going to look like. So because we know our finances for next season and we have a pretty good idea of that, we're more comfortable with a one year deal

[00:08:17] to Shohei Otani. And I think that's the only way this gets done for the Mariners. Thinking about this more and having this Reddit idea come to us, this report, it really does make sense because

[00:08:31] it's been known all along the Mariners will not outbid the Dodgers. They will not outbid, they'll probably won't outbid the Cubs. They probably won't outbid the Blue Jays. They will not outbid the Giants and they will definitely not outbid the Los Angeles Angels.

[00:08:43] So you have to offer something else. Are you going to get them to sign a three year deal? Probably not. Like probably not in this cycle. He probably wants something longer because like

[00:08:55] you said, he doesn't want to do the circus again. Who knows how healthy he's going to be the next time he hits free agency. But one season where he can focus on rehabbing his

[00:09:04] arm near driveline, where he can put all of his focus into hitting and he can get paid like the two way player he is to only do one of those things. And that's all for the Mariners to

[00:09:18] say, Hey, please give us a shot. We will show you why it is worth it for you to stay here. And we can get a good estimate with the revenue you bring in in a single season,

[00:09:29] what the number we can give you after the 2024 season would be. That sounds pretty good to me, Lyle. I like the way you're talking right now. Just hearing you talk through this, there's like more and more reasons why I'm starting to think maybe it's higher than 5%.

[00:09:44] Maybe there's a chance they could actually do this, especially when you mentioned the driveline thing. You know he wants to have full control over that rehab and he wants to make sure it's done right. If he could be right near driveline go there all the time.

[00:09:59] I bet you that's a big plus. And like you said, he's not locked into being a Mariners forever. So if the Mariners weren't good with them, it's not another angel situation. Man, that would be interesting. And again, there's going to be people out there that's like,

[00:10:11] I don't want them on a one year deal. I want them on a 10 year deal. Yeah, we all want them on a 10 year deal. But guess what? He might not want you, the Mariners on a 10 year deal,

[00:10:20] at least at the moment. So how do you get in here? Just get him here and figure it out from there because guess what? At the very least one year of Shohei Otani is better

[00:10:30] than no years of Shohei Otani. And one year of Shohei Otani, I can't stress this enough, is much different than one year of Juan Soto, who we're going to get to later. Juan Soto was hitting free agency. Juan Soto was not signing an extension.

[00:10:42] Set, stone, sealed, delivered everything. Juan Soto's hitting free agency. Shohei might too, but Shohei might not be so against the idea of returning. He could technically become a free agent but say, Hey, Jerry, Justin, let's work something out,

[00:10:59] pay me fairly and I will stay here. Just get him here. You ready to jump deeper down the rabbit hole? The Shohei rabbit hole? Yeah, so we know how he said it would, by the end of this weekend, it sounds like he will sign

[00:11:14] a guess to me. Like by then you would imagine he will. So per John Moroszi, yes. There's been some other reports saying it could take longer. Who knows? It sounds like yes, but we don't know for sure.

[00:11:26] I will just say, the Mariners have announced their team stores will be closed on Saturday due to quote unquote system maintenance and will reopen on Sunday. Now, wow, what could they be doing with system maintenance? Sure, they could be updating all their computers. They could be cleaning.

[00:11:46] They could be reorganizing. There's some players not on the Mariners roster that they might need to shuffle out. There also could be some new ones that they need to add in deep secrecy before an announcement comes this weekend. I don't know. They getting some 17 jerseys ready? Maybe.

[00:12:06] Yeah, maybe. They bringing some old Mitch Hanna, Gerseys back out with those. That's what they're really doing with that maintenance resale. Yeah, resale. There's scraping all the, there's scraping all of, all of Mitch's harder and jerseys off and just the nice Otani on the back of it.

[00:12:23] Wouldn't that be nice? Dude, I'm buying that jersey in a second. If he signed here, like I can't keep a smile on my face this whole segment just thinking about it. I would sign, I would get that jersey in a heartbeat.

[00:12:35] Even if it was for one year, like I don't care. I'm getting it. Anyways, so if anyone wants to actually go do some reporting for us, wow, you can do some reporting for us. You're up there.

[00:12:44] Why don't you go stop, sit outside on Saturday outside a team store. Look through the windows. Let me know what you see. See, if there was still a Mariners team store at Bellevue Square Mall, which is not that far from where I live, I would actually do that.

[00:12:59] Like I'm an, I'm enough of a psychopath and currently don't have anything to do on Saturday, where I would probably take the 15 minutes to drive over and actually like look through the windows and be like, well, can we see anything?

[00:13:11] The problem is these team stores are now much further away from me. Where are they now? There's Alderwood, there's downtown Seattle. Yeah. Yeah. It was the, it was the Mariners team store at the stadium and then the one on what, 4th Avenue? Like Stewart Street.

[00:13:26] I was like, that would have been close. If I was home, I could do it. If this was in two weeks, Lyle, I could go do some on the boots reporting because that's not

[00:13:34] very far from my house. However, I'm unfortunately four hours away right now and I cannot do boots on the ground reporting. So that's why we need you, our correspondent, in the Seattle Metro area to get your boots on the ground, strap them up

[00:13:48] and go do the reporting everyone else needs to do. I guarantee you, Lyle, you will not be the only person doing that. I guarantee it. Yeah. You know what? If this sounds enticing to anybody listening,

[00:14:01] add us on Twitter, say, hey, I'd go if there's enough people that are interested in this conspiracy theory enough to actually show up at one of the team stores and try to look through the window. I'll show up with some of our fans and listeners and we

[00:14:12] can all hang out together, see, hey, are they really cooking something up here? This is fun. I'm going to be honest. Maybe it's just because I'm so obsessed with the Shohei to Seattle thing, but this is one of the most fun segments we've done in man forever. Maybe

[00:14:25] there's that's because there's been so much negativity the last few weeks. I'm loving this. And we all have to come back to thanking the number one source for baseball information for this opening segment. Right. Thank you, Reddit. The first time we have

[00:14:39] used Reddit as sourcing on this podcast and it checks out. Wow. It checks out. All right. I am very interested to see what my emotions are going to be like the next time we record a podcast because the next time we either record a podcast

[00:14:55] will be our normal Wednesday episode or there's a certain emergency episode. We'll see. I guess we'll see. All right. Before we get to our next segment, let's hear a quick word from our friends over at Pagotches pub 85 Pagotches pub 85 in Kirkland,

[00:15:13] our favorite spot to go hang out with our friends. The best spot in town to go eat, drink and watch some awesome sports. They have 22 TVs in the place. It's a bunch of fun. People are always there during college football Saturdays and NFL Sundays.

[00:15:27] Even with baseball being done, there's plenty to do. And if you show up during happy hour, they have some pretty good happy hour specials. There's some great happy hour specials. What are they? The happy hours are Monday through Friday, two to 6pm. And they include

[00:15:40] $3 domestic beers, $4 mani's blue moons, $4 mac and jacks, $4 wells, $4 house wines. Get all that hang out with your friends. Go watch some games over at Pagotches pub 85 in Kirkland. Well, the news of the week is obviously the quotes out of Nashville and everything going on

[00:16:00] with the Xfinity, root sports, regional sports network news surrounding the Mariners. We talked about it a lot on Wednesday. If you have not gone and listened to that episode, you should. We recommend it. But there's still some more to kind of flesh out here. So

[00:16:16] after sitting on this for a couple more days and thinking about it, I've started to get more and more nervous. Why is that? Not just because of the revenue potentially going down or ownership not spending, because again, I think they're

[00:16:28] absolutely capable of spending and are kind of gaslighting fans or not kind of they are gaslighting fans by saying what they're saying right now. But are we on a crash course for an all out war

[00:16:40] within the Mariners organization? And I'm serious when I'm saying that an all out war between the front office and ownership. If you think about it, you don't normally see some of the some of the comments come out about budgeting. They're very small, they're very slight. But when

[00:16:59] you hear Scott Service say these are the cards we've been delved, or Jerry DePoto saying oh, two weeks in stuff changed for us, you know, not like saying there is an issue without saying it. He is definitely saying an issue. These guys are professionals. They know our

[00:17:17] professional talkers. They know how to do it. I don't know if we're quite at that point, because we have seen what a true mutiny looks like, at least within an organization. We talk

[00:17:29] about the fans all we want. But within the actual organization itself, Jerry DePoto already did this in his career once. Before he was the Mariners General Manager, the reason he resigned in Anaheim is because he had no power in the organization. It was Mike Sosia and

[00:17:51] Artie Moreno. I can't believe I forgot that. I'm a fucking idiot. And Artie Moreno essentially controlled the roster moves. And Jerry's like, what the hell am I supposed to do? Like, I'm a GM but I have no power to actually make

[00:18:06] personal decisions. So he resigned. Jerry now has full power to make personal decisions in Seattle. The problem is, he does not have full reign to do what he wants. I would imagine judging that the moves he's made early this offseason regarding the budget. And this has

[00:18:23] not been the first time the Mariners have pulled back the budget on him after initially saying the budget was going to be higher. They did it after the 2020 season. They did it after

[00:18:32] the 2021 season. And they also did it after the 2022 season. And as I mentioned on Wednesday's episode, all the way back in 2018, they did it to Jerry in 2018 instead of wanting to add on to a team that

[00:18:45] was winning games. They said, no, you got to go within your budget restraint. You cannot go above this number. And that cost the Mariners a playoff spot. Eventually, Jerry's got to be frustrated with what he's doing. He's getting paid handsomely. He is a president

[00:19:00] of baseball operations of a majorly baseball franchise. His paychecks look great. He has a great position. He's doing exactly what he wants to do in his life. Is he entirely happy how it's all playing out though? And the meddling from up top with how the ownership is structuring

[00:19:18] his budget and restricting what he can do after he pitched them this idea of let's rebuild. And once I get all this young talent in there, we can finally spend. And then once that moment comes, they're like, yeah, actually, no, we don't feel like spending.

[00:19:33] And he hates it. So this might just be the first moment of this. I would pay very close attention to Jerry DePoto's sentence structuring and his appearances on the radio and just his general

[00:19:48] tone when talking about his budget and his job and his roster and all these other things. Because I really wouldn't put it out of the question of how frustrated he would be as a general manager

[00:19:59] who can't fully do his job under the restrictions placed by ownership above him. And his patience is starting to wane. We heard it in the quotes this week. We probably didn't talk about the quotes from him and Scott as much as we should have on Wednesday,

[00:20:13] but both of them sounded pissed off. We talked about Scott's quote about saying the hand we've been dealt and all that stuff, but the way both of them sounded, they did not sound happy. Jerry did not sound happy. It was the closest I've ever seen either of them

[00:20:28] to publicly throwing ownership under the bus. And that signals to us that there is really a lack of patience all of a sudden, there's a frustration building up within that front office, within the baseball ops department, within Scott's service and maybe his coaching staff as well,

[00:20:43] that they're doing what they're supposed to be doing. They're holding up their end of the bargain, but there's only so much they can do if they are not granted money to be freed up to

[00:20:53] make the decisions they want to go and make. They're doing this with one hand tied behind their back. And let's be very clear. Jerry DePoto is not asking to spend Steve Cohen type of money. I don't even think Jerry DePoto would choose to spend that type of money.

[00:21:06] I think he wants to spend. I don't think he feels like it's necessary to spend like Steve Cohen. I think all he is asking this ownership group to do is give me the

[00:21:16] reins I need. Give me fair reins like a major league baseball team that is competing for a world series that makes a lot of money. That's top 10 in attendance. Give me the budget that

[00:21:26] a team like that with all these young, exciting players is supposed to have. And I will take this over the top. I will get you into the playoffs again. I will get you deep into the post

[00:21:36] season and to a world series and win that thing, but I need help and he's not getting it. He can't win a title by being given $20 million this off season in a pivotal off season

[00:21:49] to try and change this franchise. That is impossible. Who do you think the best GM in baseball is right now or best president in baseball? President of baseball out. Andrew Friedman. Andrew Friedman, Alex Anthopoulos. You want to say Theo Epstein even though he's

[00:22:01] not in the role anymore. Those guys couldn't do it with $20 million either. There's people all the time. Fire DePoto, fire DePoto. I'm sick of it. He's not perfect, but if you think there's somebody else that would come in here and thrive with that payroll,

[00:22:15] no way. So again, Jerry is not perfect, but like we said on Wednesday, if you've got issues with the Mariners, I'm going to use this phrase again, climb up the ladder and take it up with

[00:22:26] ownership. That's who the real enemy is. I'm using another pop culture line here again, Hunger Games. Remember who the real enemy is. It is not Jerry. It is not Hollander. It is not Scott Service. It's the ownership. And we're liles getting that $20 million number. Adam Jude

[00:22:44] wrote a piece in the Seattle Times today was talking about the new coaches hired Tommy Joseph and Brent Brown officially hired this week. And in the article, he speculated, I don't know if

[00:22:57] this is a hard number. It's hard to ever get an actual estimate. The actual estimate will be what they end up spending this offseason. But Adam Jude said, in quote, the club now has roughly

[00:23:08] $20 million to find suitable replacements for its 2024 lineup. I have a news flash. They will not find suitable replacements for $20 million. They could make that trade with the raise for $20 million. The combination of Parades and Randy costs about $11 million. But that's

[00:23:25] on the most, the highest optimistic side, the most optimism. There, that's it. But outside of that, it is going to be very difficult for Jerry if he only has $20 million, which by the way,

[00:23:36] would go against what Jerry said and he had available where he said he envisions the payroll being higher next season than it was in 2023. $20 million would put the payroll at $137 million. And that is definitely not higher than what they had last year in their payroll. So

[00:23:53] that's where Laug got that number from. And what I'm referencing with the promise of future spending for Mariners ownership, here's a tweet from Shannon Dreher back in 2018, just following the season. DePoto, when he was talking about future spending, he was talking about the 2019

[00:24:09] season upcoming at this point. He says he still believed that payroll would be in the 140s, even though they sucked. But then after that on future spending, we feel like we'll put ourselves in the position that when the young team is on the field that the team

[00:24:21] can use free agents to finish a team rather than build one. The problem is, once we have gotten to this point where the Mariners need free agents to finish the team, the bill has not come.

[00:24:34] We've seen this before. I mean, we have with crummy ownership. And if not that, we see executives get picked off from franchises. It might not be a mutiny, but guys getting hired from the raise and hired from the A's to richer organizations

[00:24:51] to go work somewhere else. The magic sauce that built the roster of the small budget teams of the Oakland A's and the Tampa Bay Rays, go get shipped off somewhere else like Andrew Freeman

[00:25:03] was a ray until the Dodgers are like, yeah, we're going to buy you away, essentially. And now Andrew Freeman has unlimited resources to go operate the Dodgers. And he's done a phenomenal

[00:25:13] job just like he did in Tampa Bay as well. So there's a lot here, but I mean, no, it's in some real out like, no, I'm not, I wouldn't be surprised if there is tension there.

[00:25:26] But until there's actually action we would never know or unless there is a really deep dive by a reporter who's willing to go above and beyond to dig out some information about all this.

[00:25:37] I'm looking at you, Ryan Divish. If anybody's going to do it, it's probably you or it'd be one of the national people. So maybe they can do it. I will say this, by the way,

[00:25:46] this is another thing I really wanted to get out there this week. I've just got to go out and say it ownership attempting to project what their payroll is going to be in 2024 based off this

[00:25:58] whole Xfinity thing and the whole regional sports network thing is sad because this is not about the money you currently have. You're projecting the money you're going to make based off Xfinity changing root sports and putting it on the premium package rather than

[00:26:13] the normal one. Can I throw a crazy idea out there and I'm being totally sarcastic because this is not crazy? What if we get three weeks into the season in 2024? And Xfinity says, whoa, nobody wants to move over to the premium package for root sports.

[00:26:30] We upped it to an extra $20 a month. People aren't paying. Now we're losing money. We thought we were going to gain money from this. We thought people would just shift over no matter

[00:26:38] what. It's not happening. This is bad. And after a few weeks, they decide, you know what? This isn't worth it. We're going back to the basic package. Everybody has access to watch the Mariners again on root sports. No premium package. You get it no matter what

[00:26:54] if you have Xfinity and if you have the basic package. Let's say that takes three weeks. Let's even say it takes one month. You're not losing that much money off three

[00:27:03] to four weeks of not having games on the basic package of Xfinity. So let's say they change it back. Do you know how fucking foolish this ownership group is going to look if that happens? Because then you will have wasted all off season, not spending any money.

[00:27:21] Shohei gone. Yamamoto gone. Blake Snell gone. Juan Soto, for all we know, he could decide he's going to be a Yankee the rest of his life. He'll probably hit free agency like we said.

[00:27:31] He will, but he could decide I'll be a Yankee the rest of his life. All those guys will be gone. So then what happens? You would have wasted all off season spending money on nobody just to lose

[00:27:42] minute and marginal money off the first three to four weeks of the season. And if that happens, oh, you think ownership looks bad now? Think about how ridiculous they're going to look if that goes down. That wasn't passioned. Yes. But it's been another passionate

[00:28:01] show. It's two in a row. We were passionate on Wednesday and between Shohei and between all this stuff again, we're passionate again today. You're right. Okay. So let me jump in here.

[00:28:10] Let me say a couple of things. And I'm going to push back on what you said a little bit. First of all, Xfinity needs to make money on this too. And they ran the numbers on what they

[00:28:23] assumed that they would make moving this up a tier. And I don't think this would be something they would cut or turn back on what six months into doing it. That doesn't really seem logical.

[00:28:36] Six months in business is not a very long time. That's two quarters, six months. So after two quarters, like the losses would have to be astronomical for Xfinity for them to consider moving it back. And remember this is only one channel. Xfinity deals with

[00:28:56] hundreds of channels. They are in fact a cable company, not just an RSN. They're a cable company. They worry about more than just root sports. So I don't think this would be a decision they would

[00:29:12] make in just six months. That doesn't sound realistic to me. They don't operate just in the interest of the Seattle Mariners. They operate in their own interest to make money. Second, there's a dog two entire sports seasons going on right now airing on root sports that

[00:29:30] people can't see. Right? And that are on the premium tier that would not be moved down. That the Mariners and root sports have invested significant amount of money in. And again, if it's on the premium tier right now, not when opening day comes around right

[00:29:50] now, then that revenue is not coming in. I feel like the Mariners have a bigger draw than the Blazers and Kraken here in Seattle. I mean on root sports. Yes, you're right. But it doesn't

[00:30:03] matter because they already they have to they have already paid the Blazers and the Kraken that money for the right. So they pay a yearly fee of what $30 million ish. I think a little bit more for the trailblazers like that money's already paid.

[00:30:17] So they have to make money on that. That's the point. They got to make money from commercials now. It doesn't matter what the rate, the ratings, yes, are their issue. Like you say, well,

[00:30:28] the Mariners get a higher draw. Well, yeah, but they're still paying money for the Blazers and the Kraken because they own the network. These have to be good business investments. If they're not good business investments, then we see the shit they're doing right now.

[00:30:42] All I'm going to say is if there was enough pushback on this, where enough people were not switching over to watch the Mariners, like this is not going to happen, right? But if they were legit getting 100 views a night because nobody wants to switch over their their

[00:30:57] Xfinity package, they would have to do something about it. That's what I'm getting at. Will it happen for sure? No, that's not what I'm saying. I'm not saying they'll switch it back. I'm not saying everybody's going to boycott. I'm saying if it were to happen

[00:31:10] and then if Xfinity actually made the decision to flip it back to the basic package, ownership would look ridiculous because then they would have wasted all off season off an idea which goes back to my

[00:31:22] original point that I was making Wednesday. I'm saying now is stop letting this whole thing trick you into the idea that ownership can't spend. They have money. They can go spend money.

[00:31:32] I think your banking that people as soon as they move it back to the basic package will re-sign up for cable and I think that is flawed thinking. For this age of consumption,

[00:31:43] it's not happening. So people who care about root sports enough to watch, right? And to give ratings to root sports, they watch root sports when it's on the basic package. Once it gets moved to the elite tier package, they're like, okay, I'm done. Xfinity membership

[00:31:57] canceled. And Xfinity comes back is like, oh, by the way, we're putting it back on the basic package and the person who has already subscribed to I don't know, Fubo or YouTube TV is

[00:32:07] like, no, I'm good. No, I don't need to sign back up for cable again for you guys to metal and channels and all this stuff. No, I'm good too expensive. Don't want to worry about it. I

[00:32:17] like what I have right now. Like you're going to have to buy back. You would have to sell back your own fan base to purchase your product after the product you already have. Like you

[00:32:27] would already be operating at a loss of loss of fans for this subject. Like I guess you can't just assume like the stream of people will immediately come running back to Xfinity and start paying these

[00:32:40] cable fees again, to root sports, which again is the root of how they how they make money on this channel. They pay what the ever the eight $10 a month or directly to root sports to watch the channel. But that's like that's no promise that that would happen.

[00:32:59] No, it's not. I guess I was thinking about the idea of all these people that already have Xfinity. They hear the option of, Hey, are you going to switch the premium package so you can watch

[00:33:08] the Mariners? And they'd say, No, I'm going to stick with my basic package. I'm not upgrading to watch the Mariners. And then as a result, if enough people did that, they bring it down. But maybe you're right. Maybe people would just change TV providers and maybe they

[00:33:20] go to Fubo or maybe they go to YouTube TV and then the Mariners are running into the same problem that we're talking about here. But that's more what I was thinking about is if nobody switches

[00:33:30] their plan over, we got to move on here. But like one last point in my like people don't watch that much on cable anymore. That's why it's going defunct. The main the main consumption of cable is cable news and cable sports pretty much like that's it. If you're

[00:33:48] not watching cable sports, aka most people who really care about this watch the Mariners and mostly. And once the Mariners are gone from their sports package, they're like, Well, I can get ESPN plus for cheaper and watch all my ESPN channels without an issue. I can get

[00:34:04] YouTube TV and have all the watch the NFL, the NBA, etc. Without any issue. So in like the cable news, people watching like I guess. But it just like it's not I would say like buying back

[00:34:18] your fan base is is is not a guarantee. But you're right, they will kind of look stupid for for marginalizing their payroll. They're stupid for marginalizing it even now because again,

[00:34:28] we come back to the point it was their decision to buy at the peak of RSNs and watch it crumble like buying fucking blockbuster. The Mariners are essentially blockbuster turning down

[00:34:42] buying Netflix or vice versa. But like essentially that's what it is. Or if you just want to switch it around the Mariners are essentially an investor who invested a shit ton of money in blockbuster

[00:34:54] in 2008. There you go. And you know what, like again, I can't stress this enough, even with the TV stuff, they have made money and so much of it other places. So stop tricking people into thinking you don't have money. And nobody knows what regional sports

[00:35:10] networks are going to look like in a couple years. This isn't just a Mariners thing. This is a baseball thing. There's a ton of teams affiliated with Bali sports that have lost their TV deal.

[00:35:18] This could be a league wide issue. So if you're the Mariners, stop worrying about the future, spend a win right now, figure it out later. And then another reason one last thing here why the blazer deal and cracking deals are so important. Remember the Mariners

[00:35:33] TV revenue is revenue shared. Remember that major league baseball TV money is pulled and split up evenly in the revenue distribution, which by the way, the Mariners are a revenue recipient per all the per the compensatory draft picks they get for QOs. They are a

[00:35:51] recipient. So they receive the pooled television money for major league baseball, they receive more than they give. But again, that is banking on the fact those other two broadcasts make money, which again, they do not share on root sports, which is why that's

[00:36:06] important and why if they're making less money than they paid for, then it's a bad investment. I can't believe we're in the middle of the off season and we're wasting our time talking

[00:36:16] about the nitty gritty of the business of the sport rather than just how about you go sign some players like we just waste. Sorry, I shouldn't say wasted. These are all important things we

[00:36:26] talked about, but I can't believe the Mariners are making us spend all this time on this podcast, on other radio stations this week across the nation talking about this bullshit when we

[00:36:36] could just be talking about what players you could sign and shout out to Mike Salk by the way, because he really went on a pretty great tangent on Wednesday over on Seattle sports

[00:36:45] friend of the pod Mike Salk. He ripped them as he should as everybody else has this week as we have as national radio people have as national TV people have as players have as agents have everybody like everybody's ripping this ownership group. So how many more people do

[00:36:59] they need to hear it from? And I think Mike Salk did a great job really formulating it well. He's not usually overly critical either. He's usually I would say right in the middle and

[00:37:10] more on the optimistic side. So when I saw most of the tweets say when you've lost Mike Salk you've lost everybody. That was pretty accurate, but he said everything that needed to be said.

[00:37:23] He's a pro for a reason. He did a fantastic job. Okay, so let's get to our final Mariners subject Lyle. The Mariners have four holes they need to fill in the roster both cornering fields,

[00:37:35] third base DH if you're going to pick one of those positions to not fill which one would you leave as is? You mean two corner outfield spots right I think you said corner infield. Okay, sorry two corner infield spots third base outfield

[00:37:55] third times charm two corner outfield spots there we are third base and DH Lyle of those four positions which one are you leaving as is there we go and to your credit to be fair

[00:38:08] I mean you could make an argument for a fifth spot at first base but it just seems like the point in the offseason we're at doesn't really seem like they're doing anything with Ty France.

[00:38:17] It appears he will be the team's opening day first baseman from what we've gathered. So to the four positions we're talking about two outfield third base DH there's a couple different ways you could go with this what I said was left field

[00:38:30] and what I mean by that is letting Dom Kanzon be the everyday left fielder and figure it out and why this all ties together is because again all the money topics we've been talking about here on this show it all ties together because if the Mariners are really

[00:38:44] going to have such a limited payroll they're going to have to use their money wisely and the likelihood of filling all these four positions sad to say but it's probably unlikely so now

[00:38:55] we're thinking about all right which are we most okay leaving alone I say Dom Kanzon and I say that because I think the upside of Kanzon the potential of Dom Kanzon is what you can buy

[00:39:08] if he is the one question mark in your lineup I'm okay with it but I think the other three spots would be much bigger issues otherwise Jerry came out and said they wanted to acquire

[00:39:20] one and a half outfielders and the half was supposed to be essentially a platoon bat with Dom Kanzon which would lead us to multiple platoons and Lau and I will riot but in a realistic case this

[00:39:33] actually seems like it's going to happen and I don't think the Mariners traded for Dom Kanzon last season and trading Paul Seawall to the Diamondbacks Forum to sit down on the bench

[00:39:42] and have him play twice a week he was going to play more often than that and that seems like it's going to be the case this season there is a lot of optimism with his bat he

[00:39:53] hits the ball extremely hard Lau do you know actually who baseball savant thinks is the most similar header to Dom Kanzon in baseball last year do you know who that was I'm going to say Mitch

[00:40:04] Hannigar Bobby Whit Jr. What that can't be real no my stack cast he was it's like hard hit rate like launch angle like like good contact percentage like pop up rate like all those things Bobby

[00:40:20] Whit was the next closest well look 81 I think it was like 81 percent similar that's pretty good I like that comp look the reason we say Kanzon and the reason I said Hannigar is my guess there

[00:40:34] is because he gets compared to Mitch Hannigar all the time the idea of kind of forgotten about prospect or lower end prospect older guy coming up through the system and absolutely crushed baseballs through every level of the minors and then once they got to the big leagues

[00:40:52] despite being a little bit older they figured it out and Mitch Hannigar at age 26 his age 26 season that's when it all clicked his first full big league season when he was in Seattle

[00:41:03] that's when it all came together whereas Dom Kanzon at right now he's about to enter his age 26 season similar to Mitch at age 25 those two kind of had an up and down

[00:41:13] 20 30 ish games in the big leagues in their first in their first stint in the majors and they figured it out I can't promise the two are going to be exactly the same but considering Dom Kanzon last

[00:41:25] year and the minors was maybe the best hitter in all of minor league baseball and put up a 151 WRC plus I like rolling the dice with him a little bit better than I do with leaving Luis Urias at

[00:41:36] third or having some combo of Deloach Tramiel Dylan Moore and Sam Hagerty fill the right field and DH thoughts there's another thing because we have precedent on this precedent allow big courtroom term you know what precedent is right yeah okay good there has been precedent sent

[00:41:55] by one Jerry de Poto of an in season acquisition in which he traded his closer to another western region team and received younger bats back and in this previous scenario this other said bat got way too much run on the major league roster almost stubbornly

[00:42:22] way too much run on this roster however he was forced into the lineup to play a significant amount of time in the 2021 and 2022 seasons now who might I be talking about who might you be talking

[00:42:36] about I can't figure it out like did you ever did you ever have much investment in this guy you know when the Mariners traded Kendall Graveman they got back this guy right his name

[00:42:49] um Abraham Toro yeah back in the AL West with the with the ace right yo these by the way yeah right that's it's just that's his perfect team for him he played too much and it seemed like Jerry

[00:43:06] would refuse to say he was wrong in that acquisition and boy he was because he came out and said however many times man I love a tutorial this dude's gonna be good or really like his young

[00:43:17] his upside his young talent everything he's got he's so versatile yeah he sucks Dom Kanzon in 2023 Mariners have a closer they trade him to the Arizona Diamondbacks and get back an older yet and they'll be ready prospect who Jerry was talking up when they traded for him

[00:43:43] we love Dom his hard hit profile it's great he's gonna be a have a great future as a mariner we insist on playing him a bunch that's it and with Jared Kellnick being traded

[00:43:58] it you have your young left-handed outfielder now and this is it and you have a young left-handed outfielder who doesn't strike out a whole lot 17% strikeout rate for Dom Kanzon last year Mariners want to make more contact Dom Kanzon makes a lot of contact fits with the philosophy

[00:44:14] fits with the precedent and the batted ball data would suggest that you know don't be surprised if Dom Kanzon could put up a 105 to 110 WRC plus next season in the outfield for the Mariners

[00:44:27] not amazing but he has the tools to be a productive big leaguer and I think I would roll the dice that he can do that if not a little bit better again this is when Mitch

[00:44:37] Hannigar broke out and we know Kanzon can hit he hit at every level of the miners and he crushed it I would trust that more than 162 games of having Dillon Moore and Sam Hagerty

[00:44:51] and maybe Cabby Jose Caballero at the DH spot again so let's let's play this out somewhat let's say the Mariners with their with their 20 million dollars trade for Esauk Parades trade for Randy Rosarana and you said that would cost about 11 million bucks right yep

[00:45:11] and what if at the DH spot they went and got Jorge Soler again he'll probably cost a little more than that maybe you can back load the contract maybe there will be a little bit more

[00:45:20] wiggle room maybe they can offer him an an extra couple million and instead of it being a 20 million dollar payroll it was a 22 to 23 million dollar payroll this winner and you give Jorge Soler the three-year 45-ish million dollar contract he's looking for I'd be okay with that

[00:45:37] and then your one hole is Dom Kanzon in the outfield rather than if you go trade for Randy trade for Parades and sign an outfielder and then you've still got Dimo or Sam Hagerty or somebody like that DHing I like that first point I'm better.

[00:45:53] Still still available oh god. Imagine they brought him back you know that we talked mutiny mutiny and insurrections there would be one I promise I do like like the off season you just laid out works I think

[00:46:16] people would be happy with that I really do people think people would be happy that and I think the Mariners would be a better baseball team than they were in 2023 if that lineup would

[00:46:26] stay healthy now we gotta go do it they need to put the pedal to the metal and make it happen and of course if they mix in a one-year 65 million dollar deal for Shohei Otani I think

[00:46:39] that would work out too. So Dom Kanzon's a lot of time I do have one last nugget on Dom did you really see Slug like 900 against fastballs this year past year I know he hit that well

[00:46:52] I know he hit well he slugged 878 against fastballs I think there is a lot about Dom Kanzon that is similar to Mitch and Dom's not going to walk a lot we know that but you know what he

[00:47:05] hits the ball really hard and he's got power if it can click for Dom Kanzon I am okay with that being the one question mark in the lineup I am okay with the lineup looking very quickly

[00:47:17] to roll that potential lineup out there Kallit Ketchar tie at first Roe Hassid and Uriah's platoon at second until Bliss gets up JP at short Parades at third Dom and left Julio in center

[00:47:29] Arosarayna and right and Soler DHing yep I am more than okay with that lineup I would if they go into opening day with that lineup I will sit here and say they had a successful

[00:47:39] offseason they are set up to win now the offense is better they strike out less they have more power great great I'll cheers to that love before we get to yeah before we get to our MLB wrap around a

[00:47:53] word from our friends over at Simply Seattle your go-to place for all your holiday shopping Christmas is coming up guys Christmas is well we got three weeks three weeks till Christmas right yeah three weeks till Christmas yes yeah that's right so you got to get your holiday shopping

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[00:48:29] and use our code Marine 15 for 15% off your order Lyle and I have already received our Simply Seattle gear for this winter it's fantastic the gear is top notch you can't miss it I got a Seahawks hat

[00:48:44] a Seahawks store-backs hat that you've seen here on this podcast I wore it last week and also this awesome sonics crew neck I'm not wearing it right now but it is amazing

[00:48:52] and I got that using our code Marine 15 at Simply Seattle dot com and you can go do that too Huskies Kraken Mariners Seahawks Sonics all that you could want go to Simply Seattle dot com use our code Marine 15 get all your holiday shopping done at Simply Seattle using

[00:49:14] our code Marine 15 at checkout okay let's get to our MLB wrap around up first on the MLB wrap around the Juan Soto drama has finally concluded the Padres ship him off

[00:49:31] to New York he is now a Yankee and the Yankees now possess wow what a two three in that lineup they have now I do not uh I I sympathize with pitchers who are gonna have to go through a

[00:49:45] healthy air and judge and a healthy Juan Soto in 2024 they really did it didn't they this trade was in talks for weeks then talk stalled then even when it sounded like it was gonna happen for a

[00:49:58] few hours it got held up but it happened Juan Soto is a Yankee he's gonna be spending 2024 in the Bronx and that Yankees team and that offense just got a whole lot more deadly

[00:50:10] I'll say that much even even with Alex Verdugo going over there too which was in a different trade that team's getting much much better than it was a season ago wasn't it funny to be online and watch

[00:50:20] uh the 24 hour window when it was just Verdugo and people were pissed yeah oh yeah they thought that they thought that meant the Juan Soto trade was done and then you flip over a day later

[00:50:32] and oh arguably the best hitter in baseball now he's a New York Yankee and all of a sudden their outfields pretty deep so we have uh you mean Verdugo Soto Judge and Trent Grisham as well

[00:50:44] who comes over in the Juan Soto deal he'll mix in at center field for the Yankees not gonna hit a whole lot but he'll be in there and I really to be honest looking at the package the Padres

[00:50:53] got in return the the centerpiece was Michael King the Padres think he can start he was a reliever last year for the Yankees it has been a pretty good reliever for years and years

[00:51:02] looking at that package um yeah I would have done it if I was the Mariners for a like-minded package for Seattle I would have sprung on that in a second I would have had zero issue giving up

[00:51:13] what is required to go get Juan Soto I'm right there with you what do we think that would have costed on the Mariners end I was trying to even ballpark a trade would we say it felt like

[00:51:23] Emerson Hancock maybe a reliever and a couple of mid-tier prospects just about yeah the real winner in all this are the Washington Nationals I mean highway robbery the difference

[00:51:35] in package for Juan Soto in a year and a half is astronomical now my money is on that Juan Soto spends the rest of his career as a Yankee I think when he hits free agency next year even if

[00:51:47] there's some touring and some talks with other teams I feel like in the end he is going to be a Yankee and probably sign a huge contract there and spend the rest of his career there

[00:51:58] that being said could you imagine if he goes back to the Nationals next year when they're right on the brink of potentially getting really good with all these prospects that would be the greatest fleece job in the history of the sport could then AJ Prelar finally be fired

[00:52:15] oh that do you think Juan Soto's signing with the Nationals is what would do it like if Juan Soto resigned with the Yankees it'd be like okay AJ Prelar you can keep your job

[00:52:24] if he goes and signs back with Washington no now you're fired I mean what more is it going to take how much more how much more attrition can this happen can happen to the Padres for him to get

[00:52:38] fired it's gotta happen it's gotta happen soon this man has been through more ups and downs in any GM ever and now their roster is in a state of financial ruin their owner is dead

[00:52:50] and like where's the security blanket for AJ not only are the money money bags gone they had to take out a loan to pay the roster this year but they're not exactly getting any younger and not getting

[00:53:04] any more optimistic for the future not at all I don't know what he's I don't know what is keeping him in that job I wish I was in the Padres front office to be able to find out but yeah you've

[00:53:17] got to think time's ticking and I feel like if they don't make the playoffs this year I don't know how he sticks around I just don't I will say though for the Yankees side with Soto let me propose a

[00:53:28] question to you and I can't take credit for this it was our friend Peter Apple friend of the pod and co-founder of Just Baseball who put this out there on Twitter yesterday and I thought it was

[00:53:37] kind of an interesting debate and I figured I'd bring it up today would you rather have the one two of Aaron Judge and Juan Soto or Mookie Betts and Freddie Freeman for just next year we can say going forward or next year whichever you want me

[00:53:59] healthy or take the Yankees okay so here's what I said offensively I'd take the Yankees I would take Aaron Judge and Juan Soto as hitters overall I might lean toward the Dodgers and I say that

[00:54:13] because of the injuries because Aaron Judge has had a hard time staying healthy along with the fact that not only does judge not always stay on the field Juan Soto also plays atrocious defense

[00:54:24] and then when you factor in Mookie might be the best athlete in the sport aside from that guy Shohei and then pairing him with Freddie Freeman I think I might take the Dodgers the

[00:54:34] overall package of the Dodgers I like a little bit better because of Mookie's defense because those guys are almost always on the field but if it's just offense I would take the Yankees if Juan Soto

[00:54:45] signs an extension with the Yankees I mean we're going to be talking about two teams the Dodgers and the Yankees who pulled off absolute heists to grab marquee players on the block with few

[00:54:58] few to one year of control left did Mookie only have one year left one year remember yeah it was one it was okay so one year left of control to then sign them to monumental contracts after and

[00:55:10] potentially aging gratefully this is a this is a piece of advice to all general managers and owners in Major League Baseball if there is a MVP Calibre player who you think would be willing

[00:55:22] to sign an extension with your franchise and he's out there for any sort of price um trade for him and don't think twice it can cost your best prospects for all you care if you're getting

[00:55:34] an MVP who's already an MVP and then he's gonna sign an extension what are you waiting for it might not even cost your best prospects I mean Alex Ferdugo is now a Yankee he was the Marquis one

[00:55:48] of he was the Marquis one of the the Mookie trade unreal absolutely unreal it feels like at some point in time if Soto stays there maybe we're finally set up for a Yankees Dodgers World Series

[00:56:02] at some point maybe we're finally gonna get it if that Yankees rotation can stay healthy and if Carlos Rodan can stay healthy that's a big if big if speaking uh not speaking of ifs anymore I should

[00:56:13] say this is now sealed Eduardo Rodriguez he is now an Arizona Diamondback he's got a four-year contract under his belt that he signed for 80 million bucks and that Diamondbacks rotation that's getting pretty interesting teams that lost their TV deal can spend money really who would have

[00:56:32] thought the Diamondbacks did lose their TV deal to Bali for those who don't get that reference so yes they can yeah they did and they only get 80 percent of their their TV deal through major league

[00:56:42] baseball and yet huh 80 million dollars and if they go out and sign someone else they'll be pushing their record payroll for their franchise huh interesting I didn't know teams are allowed to do that uh anyways yeah this rotation is amazing Zach Allen Merrill Kelly who really burst onto

[00:56:58] the scene in the playoffs he's been a veteran for a while but really shined in October and then Eduardo Rodriguez who arguably at the best season of his career this past year 3-3-0 ERA in a

[00:57:09] FIP just above that at 3-6-6 in 152 and 2-3-2-3 gonna go to more of a hitting environment in Arizona opposed to Detroit but I mean he did suffer an injury in the middle of the season

[00:57:20] for the Tigers that kind of hampered him but he was getting off to an amazing start and I think the Diamondbacks are really buying into that Eduardo Rodriguez is gonna be pitching at the top of his

[00:57:30] game and they don't have him under contract for that long so they don't have to worry about paying him you know Garrett at the end of Garrett Cole's contract for example no like E-Rod will be signed

[00:57:40] for the Primus Careers 30 right now so he he'll be pitching at the best of his game while he is in Arizona Diamondback and the Diamondbacks are essentially fortifying a strength of their team

[00:57:53] to complement the young hitting core they have as well. I'm gonna throw Brandon Fod into that rotation too who I know if you just look at his big league stats for the regular season that is yeah it

[00:58:05] wasn't that impressive for his rookie year but similar to what you're talking about with Meryl Kelly look at what he did in October and he was a pretty high prospect we saw the upside that Brandon Fod had through the Diamondbacks playoff run and I think he's

[00:58:17] gonna be the number four guy on that rotation next year and I think he's gonna take a big step and be pretty damn good so that Diamondbacks rotation all of a sudden with those four looks really good and another thing with Eduardo Rodriguez when he's healthy he's been

[00:58:31] pretty consistently a three to four-war pitcher who keeps his teams in games who puts up ERAs in the threes who puts up consistently good year after year and only costs 20 million bucks

[00:58:43] so it's not that much for a starting pitcher on the free agent market who was pretty sought after it's not that much money. No it's really not so one they now have if they all these guys pitch

[00:58:55] at the top of their game they have one of the best rotations in the national league at least to give them a chance to compete with the Dodgers eventually we'll have to see but

[00:59:03] what? Speaking of the Dodgers Eduardo Rodriguez is getting booed when he goes to Dodger Stadium now a lot. Yeah he is the only player ever to to be a Detroit Tiger and decide yeah I would rather

[00:59:12] not play for the this version of the LA Dodgers just one of the most bizarre decisions ever. Bizarre but if you watch Dodger's fans reactions to it you kind of got a chuckle and now

[00:59:26] they're gonna get their chance to boo him. Yeah but he'll boo and be like yep yep yep yep yep come at me if you're watching on YouTube you know if you're if you're not and if you're listening

[00:59:37] to this and you don't know what I'm doing right now then that's your sign to go subscribe to our YouTube channel and watch please go watch. Okay the final thing Lyle on our MOB wrap round this

[00:59:47] regards the Mariners as well. Uh Jaymer Candelario signing a three year 45 million dollar contract with the Cincinnati Reds I think the Reds have too many infielders now Lyle. You smell a trade coming. Hmm I don't know they have six in what they have six infielders for

[01:00:07] no five infielders for three spots I smell an issue. Spencer Stier, Ellie, Delvy Mortay, Jonathan India, Jaymer and Matt McLean. Oh crap six six for three spots. Yeah no you said you said six. I said six at first then I went down to

[01:00:27] five I left McLean out of my notes. Oh that's okay yeah I don't know how they were going to play all those guys somebody's probably going to get traded it feels like it's going to be India from

[01:00:36] all the rumors as we've talked about on this podcast I. Stier cleared. Yeah I hope it's not here because I don't I don't buy that profile one bit so yeah now Jaymer Candelario himself just

[01:00:50] relates to the Mariners a little bit because some people suspected that when they traded Gino away they thought maybe the fit would be Candelario it's not the case and for three years 45 million

[01:01:01] dollars that's not a terrible contract that feels like one of the Mariners could have given out they decided not to do it and they still have a third basehold to fill but Jaymer he's going

[01:01:10] to a hitter friendly ballpark he's going to a team that's going to compete he's going to a core of young players it's really fun an infield that's going to be good it makes some sense for him. Remember how we were talking about spending money we've

[01:01:22] talked a lot about spending money on this podcast the Cincinnati Reds has spent 87 million dollars this offseason. The Cincinnati Reds the same team that just a season ago the beginning of 2022

[01:01:36] told your fans where are you going to go you have to stay and watch the Reds there's nobody else for you to go watch that team is now spending money interesting but the team

[01:01:47] that has Julio Rodriguez on it no they can't spend money has Jerry DePoto ever signed a hitter to a three year 45 million dollar contract uh no no he's not has he ever signed a hitter to a two year

[01:02:00] contract he has not signed a hitter above seven million and one dollars period and he has not signed any of them for more than one year correct man well congrats to Jaymer he got his money

[01:02:15] he's put up three the last four years he's been really good and he's probably going to stay pretty consistent in Cincinnati all right that's our wrap around let's get to speak your mind speak your

[01:02:27] mind spoke that would be unwise what is necessary is never unwise well we've had a lot to talk about this week but is there anything else that's on your mind that you'd like to talk about i just

[01:02:44] have one question lyle that we can debate did the college football playoff committee get it right if you wanted the best two games yes if you want it based off what the criteria is supposed to be

[01:03:00] no that's my two cents i'm just gonna say i'm not complaining yeah i'm not this is what you get when you have a playoff that is owned by a television network and conferences every other ncda

[01:03:15] championship is run and all the rights are run through the ncda the one sport that is not is college football so when you let espn form a committee own the playoff own the bowl games

[01:03:36] this is what you're gonna get this is what happens do you think espn after watching that national championship last year when they sold all that advertising and watch tcu just get shit pumps i don't know how else to describe that shit pump 65 to 7 to georgia and said

[01:03:55] yeah we can't let this happen ever again we cannot let a team that we know has no shot into this playoff and there might be some merit to that there might there is absolute sorry

[01:04:07] there might be absolute reason to be frustrated with that 100 percent that's not how playoff works it doesn't matter like perception it doesn't matter recruiting rankings it matters what you do on the field however this is college football in case you didn't notice called football isn't

[01:04:23] exactly logical it never has been logical i mean ship they used to decide the national champion after bowl season they used to the ap used to sit there and decide who's going to be

[01:04:35] the national champion this year oh okay we'll decide on you you won the national champion this year that's how stupid the sport is and how illogical it is so i don't know how we can expect this season

[01:04:47] in the final year of the 14 playoffs that everyone's just up in arms about and pissed off at the decision it made florida state was mad sure but i can't say as a college

[01:05:02] football fan like i'm that sad to see it i mean i think we're going to get two great games on new year's day and that's what espn wants and that's what they've decided upon i just realized we

[01:05:14] should probably give a little bit of an explanation in case there's anybody out there listening that does not know what's going on the college football playoff was decided the four teams are going to be michigan washington texas and alabama it's in that order one through four

[01:05:28] florida state went 13 and 0 and were left out and a big reason for that is they lost their starting quarterback a couple weeks ago to a season ending injury florida state fans for obvious reason

[01:05:38] are furious it went undefeated and missed the playoff that's never happened so that's what we're sitting here talking about so i'm with you yes college football is not it's not a normal sport

[01:05:50] like in most sports it's like here's what you do you get into the playoff college football is totally subjective with this playoff you can argue college basketball is a little bit like that too

[01:05:59] or some of the other college sports where there is a selection committee and they pick the team but there's enough teams in those other sports like men's and women's basketball like some of

[01:06:08] the others where if you miss if you miss out it's probably on you because if you miss out there's something you didn't do in your season and you lost too many games

[01:06:19] in college football you can go undefeated and miss the playoff because it's 14 so yes if it was about the criteria that they usually use florida state would be in that's what they should have done

[01:06:31] but if we're talking about picking the four quote unquote best teams and getting the two best games in the semifinal and then a good national title game i got this right it's going to be

[01:06:41] way more fun to see alabama than florida state does espn understand the ramifications of their decision you know why i say that what is florida state going to do now that they've been left out

[01:06:56] what are the next three years for florida state going to look like now that they have been told their league was not good enough i don't know what what do you think they're going to do

[01:07:06] leave they are going to do whatever pot whatever is possible to get out of their agreement with the acc and they're either going to go to the big 10 or they're going to go to the sec

[01:07:17] they know they're good enough they know they draw enough tv eyeballs and this decision made by the committee i think just finalized it the acc will in its current form will probably dissolve because

[01:07:32] of this decision i'm like i'm like you think i'm crazy like no i guarantee you this is it florida state and clemson have been looking for a reason to leave the acc forever the acc by

[01:07:44] the way if you're not up to date on on college football television contracts signed one of the worst deals ever in 2016 they wanted security they signed a 20 year grant of rights with the espn

[01:07:57] 20 uh your grant of rights by the way is saying that the only the only way you can make television revenue is by being in this league or the league sorry the league gets all your television

[01:08:09] revenue and distributes it back to you that's what it means so the acc gets about 30 million dollars a year however the sec in the big 10 now will be approaching 100 million dollars a year

[01:08:18] once their new deals kick in starting next season and florida state's like huh we know our brand's good enough we need more of that so now that not only has the television money been reflected

[01:08:28] back upon them and their league and the the the deteriorating performance but now the committee has also said the teams in your league are not good enough the perception of your league is not

[01:08:38] good enough overall because if florida state went 13 and 0 in the sec and won the sec without their starting quarterback lau are they in the playoff oh they're in the playoff bingo so florida

[01:08:52] state realizes if we want to have a successful future in college football or however this sport looks in the future we got to leave this league and it's starting now i'm guarantee you they

[01:09:02] got lawyers going they're trying to find any way possible to get out of that grant of rights and leave to a bigger conference where they know if they go undefeated in that conference they're into the playoff and they're guaranteed mine now do i say does espion understand the

[01:09:18] consequences well if florida state goes to the sec then espion's like oh great we just got florida state in the sec that's perfect another marquis brand under our umbrella what if florida state

[01:09:30] goes to the big 10 espion doesn't get any of that they lau they lose all of that and then they lose the acc now who knows what the rest of the shuffling around would be i think organ state

[01:09:41] in washington state would be jumping back into the discussion then with the members of the acc that have now disbanded but that's for a conversation later down the line but i just hope espion

[01:09:52] understands what they did with decision and all the ramifications that will happen because of it you know how else this could have been avoided to stay on this topic and now that's simply my speaker right should have a 12 team playoff this year yep because then florida state's in

[01:10:12] sure do you know what else would have solved this issue lau if we had the bcs and the bcs still existed would have been the easiest decision ever michigan one washington two national championship in the rose bowl boom perfect no arguments no arguments from anyone

[01:10:31] it would have been the easiest decision ever let the computer pick it would have been the easiest decision ever but it's because we had this 14 playoff and five power leagues yeah you're asking

[01:10:42] for it well that's no fun two teams in one national title game i want what did i say the last time we talked about this i want more meaningful games so that would that would be it

[01:10:52] and then alabama's still in then george is still in then texas is still in nobody's complaining you're in and again similar to the college basketball thing if you're going to be mad about who's 12 who's 13 who's 14 that gets to the point where you didn't do enough in your season

[01:11:06] this was in your control and you lost i don't want to just rehash this argument because we've already argued about this but i will say i did really enjoy conference championship weekend and i would be very disappointed that it really wouldn't mean anything for any of the teams

[01:11:21] playing in it if that was the case it would the sec championship by the way tickets were going for what 550 bucks at cheapest what the game would be would be meaningless they could have

[01:11:31] played all their backups and both made the playoff organ and washington could have done the exact same thing played all their backups and um played all the backups made the net made the made the

[01:11:40] championship texas could have done the same thing they could have lost a game and they would have made it as well i mean you see where i'm going with this michigan could do the same thing i

[01:11:47] mean that's what we're talking about i did very much enjoy conference conference championship week it was a bunch of great games that being said you would get a lot more games that would

[01:11:57] still matter if you did the expanded playoff because what like there's a week in the nfl where most of the backups play it's like the last week of the season so it's not that different it's completely different seasons they are talking about conference championship weekend

[01:12:12] well that's true that part yes that is supposed to mean the most yeah but conferences are going away at this point like it's so different now like i feel i feel like we might be getting to the point where conference championships aren't even really a thing

[01:12:24] it'll be a 12 team playoff it'll be these new conferences and then it's like the nfl it's like the final week all right guys sit if i wanted to watch the nfl i would watch the nfl well

[01:12:35] that's out of my control i i am i am simply a tv watcher and i would like to watch meaningful games i know i know we're gonna have to agree to disagree on this because we were on different

[01:12:46] ends of the spectrum on this argument that's okay i did like what you had to say about florida state i hadn't really thought about it that much but that is a good point that maybe we're

[01:12:54] going to see a changing in the guard it would make a lot of sense i'm sure we'll be talking about the playoff in a couple weeks so i'm sure when those games play and play themselves out

[01:13:03] you'll hear us talking about it and i'm looking forward to it all right i think that just about wraps up this edition of the marine layer podcast you guys know the drill if you want

[01:13:12] to listen to the full form podcast you can do so wherever you find your audio podcast if you do that make sure to download give us a five star review and follow the show those reviews and

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[01:13:31] media we're on instagram tiktok twitter and youtube shorts at marine layer pod that's tj i'm lile as always we thank you guys for tuning in talk to you soon